Plan ! - D-20 (hz) Macro Sub ..tapped horn by moi. |
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nineleaves
Young Croc Joined: 31 August 2007 Status: Offline Points: 1327 |
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Posted: 11 March 2009 at 7:09pm |
NOTE (due to some confusion on another thread): SOFTWARE NOT CALLIBRATED FOR SPL AT
MIC YET, THE NUMBERS ON THE CHART ARE JUST THE ONES THE SOFTWARE CHOSE.
ALSO DUE TO THE FACT THAT TOTALLY FIXED DRIVE LEVELS & MEASUREMENT
LOCATIONS WHERE NOT STRICTLY USED, THE SLIGHT CHANGES IN LEVELS ARE NOT
REPROSENTATIVE IN SHIFTS OF SENSTIVITY & OUTPUT LEVELS (YET).
heres a neat little something, ever wanted to experience freqs well below the typical 30hz region, with very low distortion ? :) and have an easy build which isnt going to cost much, or take too much skill, time or space either ? well, then this maybe of interest to you. ever wondered what 22hz or so at high spl feels like ? its weird, kind of makes you nausious sometimes.. but oddly you just arent as physically aware as with 30hz. you do however notice when you try to speak in the middle of such a continuious tone, it modulates your voice like someone beating on your chest ! ..this is something like a combination of the pressure difference between lungs and outside air modulating layrinx & ears being effected in one way or another by the tones. very odd, and something to experience ;) was designed for a friend who wanted to have a sub which could drop to round about 20hz, whilst not costing alot.. for use with his home hifi. these cabinets are ideal for use in home hifi/cinema & would hide very nicely under those side wall chairs in pubs :) best used flat on one side on the floor, followed secondly by corner loading upright. this design is free for personal, non commercial use.. if you want to make more than 4 of them for business uses, let me know and we'll work something out ;) This design is largely experimental 'tapped horn', its unusual in inverting the taper of the horn to trade a little efficency for a lower cutoff ..from 30hz odd to 20hz odd :) I feel it can yet be improved on, thus im leaving it open for forum users to tinker with.. and i will be doing so when i get back round to it too. at the state of refinement i got this sub to, its good down to 22-24hz'ish with full output & its got a dip in the 50hz region (but is crossed to a system capable of this). experiments revealed the following: * a solid exit plank emphasised the lower cutoff, but supressed the upper frequencys. * no exit plank removed the gain in the lower frequencys we wanted ! * a slotted exit plank seems to find a balance between the two. * use of wadding seems to prevent some honking issues & also lowers the fc nearer to its predicted cutoff. characteristics of this cab: * radiation will be mostly omnidirectional. * senstivity will be modest, but stacking multiples may well increase this & lower fc further. further fiddling with the design may well get it even closer to predictions, if you build these.. let us know :) Also as noted by another horn builder making more conventional tapped horns, some drivers didnt behave quite as predicted & he found that for some bizzare reason, some worked better than others ! ..notably he also saw the dip in the 50hz region with some drivers, then not others.. this design uses the lab-12, so if you have other reasonable excursion 12" drivers ..experiment ! :) also, assuming the response is flattened overall, then pending a little parametric to tame some of the top end spikes, they should be good for x-over at 80hz or so too :) the design: the prediction plot: the numbers for 20hz: the numbers for 30hz: the plot for 30hz: Slot loaded exit, with large ammounts of damping at end of line: plain wood slab loaded exit, with large ammounts of damping at end of line: no wood slab on exit, with large ammounts of damping at end of line: Slot loaded exit, with no damping at end of line: plain wood slab loaded exit, with no damping at end of line: no wood slab on exit, with no damping at end of line: Slot loaded exit, with some damping at end of line: plain wood slab loaded exit, with some damping at end of line: no wood slab on exit, with some damping at end of line: a crappy phone pic of the unfinished prototype: (in response to space-face) Heres a scaled up version for playing around with 18" & 15" (use a shim ;) drivers. also, youll probably find the drivers harder to match upto this kind of cabinet configuration; but please do play and let us know.. ive provided the -untested- plans for the 18-D20 revision below as a curiousity, however a more conventional tapped horn will probably be a better choice :) also note as seen before, that tapped horns like this can be tempermental, even though the plot here is somewhat less favourable; you may well find that the actual result differs in a positive manner :) ..as noted with the 12", the response measured.. wasnt quite the behaviour predicted. also note that its likely that the suspensions resonance being in the middle of the plotted response will do some funny things (so choose / mod the drivers for lower resonance :) in this case, with the v1000 as suggested by an earlier poster, may well work.. the pd 154 probably wont ..on account of lots of power.. as this cabinet needs large xmax's to drop low. the v1000 will certainly struggle to do its 1000w without bottoming out, but under drving it could be no bad thing either ;) plot: UPDATE: infact.. when being arsed to investigate 'properly'.. you could according to the theory get that box down to 230 litres with supposedly a similar senstivity response as with the silly size 18" box. however, im really not convinced that this would actually work; someone care to fold and draw up a box like this and try ? ;)
looks like a right coffin of an idea ;) Another Update: and following in todays tradition of haistily posting additions without mulling over them properly; heres a more sensible answer to the 18" tapped horn in this config problem: 240l internal, which is better, but still..: numbers: the 1500 number, is actually nearer to 1100 or so.. tho not too much a resp deviation :) Edited by nineleaves - 25 March 2009 at 2:18pm |
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Mark James
Old Croc Joined: 15 January 2006 Location: rig side Status: Offline Points: 5309 |
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driver??? i cant figure out the diagrams to the right of the plans Looking good! M |
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me so horny me love you long throw
horn loaded for her pleasure |
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Mark James
Old Croc Joined: 15 January 2006 Location: rig side Status: Offline Points: 5309 |
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now i do........
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me so horny me love you long throw
horn loaded for her pleasure |
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space-face
Registered User Joined: 11 September 2008 Location: E5 Status: Offline Points: 439 |
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Hmm very nice, could you make one that works with a 15 or 18 inch drivers? I've a pair of pd154'sand a pair of v181000's looking for a home and was thinking of trying to build something to play 20-40hz to go under some punishers I'm going to get,
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nineleaves
Young Croc Joined: 31 August 2007 Status: Offline Points: 1327 |
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if i get time, i may.
though the point of the project was seeing just how small a box you could get clean '20hz' out of at decent s.p.l. ;) problem with using other drivers, is that the box will prefer them to have lower resonant freqs to work properly.. no harm in trying, however to ensure that it will actually drop low.. its highly adviseable to ensure they have a low resonance. most large bass drivers are barely below 30hz. im sure someone else will scale these up for larger drivers, if so.. let us know how that goes :) Edited by nineleaves - 11 March 2009 at 8:20pm |
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nineleaves
Young Croc Joined: 31 August 2007 Status: Offline Points: 1327 |
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WTF ? ..the form keeps on turnin s.p.l.s. into 'splease' ?
..meh, bugs ;) |
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Deadbeat
Old Croc Joined: 12 March 2008 Location: Singularity Status: Offline Points: 3167 |
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I expect the Karlson people will be all over this in a bit . Very useful info.
Looking good. Just to put my mind at rest, is that HR running on a mac. Out of curiosity, what measurment package are you using? |
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Away on extended leave.
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nineleaves
Young Croc Joined: 31 August 2007 Status: Offline Points: 1327 |
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karlson ? :)
nah, not a mac, i just prefer using that skin ontop of xp as its cleaner and nicer to work with than the usual sh*t. the program is ARTA with a saffire le & behringer ecm8000 |
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Deadbeat
Old Croc Joined: 12 March 2008 Location: Singularity Status: Offline Points: 3167 |
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Thought so (ARTA).
Thanks for the info. I believe a certain European member was on here a while back discussing tapped horns and Karlson (the infamous air coupler design...). Can't remember the link. They are similar due to the mouth arrangement. |
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Away on extended leave.
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nineleaves
Young Croc Joined: 31 August 2007 Status: Offline Points: 1327 |
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oh yes, the old karlson design.. that used a slot as its soul method of enhanced coupling of the drivers loading.
the idea here was to try to maintain the right loading for low extension, whilst allowing the higher bass notes to work their way through. this is more a byproduct of the way the air mass is loaded in 3 dimensions.. rather than the slots focusing potential.. which is much higher up the range. i suspect a modern revisit to the proper interpretation 1950's karlson design, using modern materials, and techniques would result in quite a useable cabinets :) for christ's sake.. how long did it take folks to rediscover what a well designed horn can do ;) ..and they are old as the hills them :) |
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Deadbeat
Old Croc Joined: 12 March 2008 Location: Singularity Status: Offline Points: 3167 |
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Yeah. djk I believe tried to model the effect in Akabak a while back, can't remember if it gave any conclusive results or not, But the karlsonites of this world have something new to look to now.
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Away on extended leave.
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nineleaves
Young Croc Joined: 31 August 2007 Status: Offline Points: 1327 |
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karlsonite.. lol.. sounds like something superheroes should stay clear of ;) :)
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