I need kick

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Posted: 14 April 2014 at 2:12pm

Hey
so its like this i opened the boxes cleaned everything and colord some parts
this is what i found inside
-dynacord ax 903 amps
-tops-rcf n481
-mid-rcf l12/854
-lows-rcf l15p/200ak
-emminence kappa

thinking of getting a 2 way xover and a amp for lows for start
later when i get some cash i will buy amps for mids and high
got some 12" scoops(really small ones)on the side but there is nothing writen on them
any advice,ideas,critics or help is welcome

thanks

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Posted: 24 April 2014 at 8:35pm

Just looked up those unusual Dynacord AX903 amps and they feature a 3 way crossovers in them and are 250w rms + 100w rms + 100w rms.

Your in danger of clipping the amps like that to drive a sound system nowadays, especially as you will want to get the most out of your drivers usually.
Your best to just sell the amps and buy some used amps on ebay to run them properly.

As for the crossover, the Behringer CX3400 does 4 way mono/3 way stereo for cheap.

I wouldn't have thought you needed kick bass when you probably power the scoops with 1000w rms or a bit more at least, as those are standard 15" design which normally don't go lower than 50-60hz, NOT 18" designs which go usually much lower.
And 15" scoops are normally more kicky in their nature than most 18" scoops are.

But if after that you still require kick bass, some Eminence Kappa 15LF loaded HD15's with the xover in 4 way mode and 4 amps will do you nicely.

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Posted: 29 April 2014 at 7:22am

Hi FLic,

welcome to speakerplans! You have a nice little system :)

People tend to throw a lot of sometimes conflicting and confusing advice because they make assumptions about the posters situation and needs. Before you make decisions about selling/buying stuff, it would help if you give a little bit more information about yourself and your system:

1. How much experience do you have with PA stuff? (impossible to tell from your posts)
2. What kind of musical genre is usually played through your system? Live bands or DJs?
3. How many times have you used this specific system?
4. Are you happy with the SPL output (=is it loud enough for you?)
5. Are you happy with the spectral balance ? (ok, obviously not, because you are asking about more kick)

Edited by bob4 - 29 April 2014 at 1:14pm

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Posted: 29 April 2014 at 2:36pm

bob4 wrote:

Hi FLic,

welcome to speakerplans! You have a nice little system :)

People tend to throw a lot of sometimes conflicting and confusing advice because they make assumptions about the posters situation and needs. Before you make decisions about selling/buying stuff, it would help if you give a little bit more information about yourself and your system:

1. How much experience do you have with PA stuff? (impossible to tell from your posts)
2. What kind of musical genre is usually played through your system? Live bands or DJs?
3. How many times have you used this specific system?
4. Are you happy with the SPL output (=is it loud enough for you?)
5. Are you happy with the spectral balance ? (ok, obviously not, because you are asking about more kick)

HI ,thanks
i did explain it roughly didnt get the time to sit down and write it down nicley .great questions thanks a lot Smile

1-i dont realy have a lot of expirience .but i know i can get a lot more from this system (xover,amps.....)Im been planing and googling soundsystems and everything about them for a few years now.Im from croatia and theres only few people in my town that know anything about this.i work in three shifts so i dont have the time or money to go to school., but somehow will do so soon.buying this system started something ive been waiting for a long time. very entusiastic and egard to learn.
2-well the idea is to use it mostly for dub,reggae,dnb,dubstep,deep house,minimal,hip hop.Althoug i plan on renting it for live bands and dj"s
3-I used it just a few times for now but the guy we bought it from organises rock concerts in my town so we heard it a lot of times but used it just a few times.realy intrested how it would sound with a xover and separete amps
4-it can always be louder Smile

5-yes and no. i organised a deep house,techhouse,techno,party(althoug i am planing on playing more dub on it)last weekend at a bar it worked great(the bar is a bit small so i couldnt play it at max. but the sound was exellent the kick wasnt missing)the place was full and everything was awsome(for pics add me on facebook flicflico) .planing a few outdoor events where i can test it .i will upgrade the system to work better .

bob4

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Posted: 29 April 2014 at 8:54pm

Hi Flic,

thank you for the additional info, it helps to assess your situation. :)

Your hi and mid section seems to be reasonably sensitive and go loud enough for your purpose, they should be able to hit more than 120 dB SPL easily, especially the horn. The scoops will have a few dBs
les maximum output.

Before we go any further: do you understand the concept of the decibel scale?

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Posted: 29 April 2014 at 9:00pm

bob4 wrote:

Hi Flic,

thank you for the additional info, it helps to assess your situation. :)

Your hi and mid section seems to be reasonably sensitive and go loud enough for your purpose, they should be able to hit more than 120 dB SPL easily, especially the horn. The scoops will have a few dBs
les maximum output.

Before we go any further: do you understand the concept of the decibel scale?

yeah i do

bob4

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Posted: 29 April 2014 at 9:33pm

flic wrote:

bob4 wrote:

Hi Flic,

Before we go any further: do you understand the concept of the decibel scale?

yeah i do

great!

so if we look at your amp specs and your drivers:

RCF 481: 120 W continuos program
available amp power: 100 W
sensitivity: 104,5 dB/W/m

RCF l12-854k: 350 W AES
available amp power: 100 W
sensitivity: 98 dB/W/m

RCF l15p200ak: 800 W AES
available amp power: 250 W
sensitivity: 95 dB/W/m

EDIT: let's calculate max SPL first.....

481: 10*log 120 = 20,8 -> 104,5 + 20 = 125,3 dB SPL
l12-854k: 10*log 350 = 25,4 -> 98 + 25,4 = 123,4 dB SPL
l15p200ak: 10*log 800 = 29 -> 95 + 29 = 124 dB SPL

the mismatch in amp output reduces available output by:

481: 120/100 = 1,2 -> 10 *lg 1,2 = 0,8 dB -> negligible
12-854k: 350/100 = 3,5 -> 10 *lg 3,5 = 5,4 dB -> significant
15p200ak: 800/250 = 3,2 -> 10 *lg 3,2 = 5 dB -> significant

10 dB is considered to correspond to a perceived "doubling" of loudness, that should give you an idea about how much output you are missing...

EDIT: I realised the last paragraph was a little bit confusing, so I decided to edit it:

The sensitivity of the mid and bass drivers are 6 and 9 dB lower than that of the HF driver. But the HF driver is measured with horn, so that is an unfair comparison. Taking the horn loading of mid and scoop into account will add a few dBs of gain on top of the sensitivity of the naked driver, let's say 3 - 5 dB. So with horn loading, mid and bass will have almost the same SPL output as the HF horn, despite being underpowered. So your system is probably balanced quite ok, but a bit lacking in bass for modern taste..... Smile

Edited by bob4 - 03 May 2014 at 7:30am

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