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12" 2-way + sub(s) for DJ'ing at small parties |
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ceharden 
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Joined: 05 June 2005 Location: Southampton Status: Offline Points: 11776 |
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 Posted: 29 September 2014 at 1:38am |
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The Y axis scale makes the differences between the drivers look much bigger than it actually is. In practice you'd probably get good results with any of those.
I can't think of any reason why not to go with the 12MB700. Looks pretty well suited to the job.
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Soren
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Joined: 07 May 2013 Location: Copenhagen Status: Offline Points: 34 |
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Posted: 29 September 2014 at 11:53pm |
You’re right, there’s only a few dBs difference between the 12MB700 and the other drivers. Still, the simulation shows that it would take another 150W (600W instead of 450W) for e.g. the 12ND710 to play as loud as the 12MB700. See screenshot below.  Edited by Soren - 30 September 2014 at 12:03am |
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ceharden
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Posted: 29 September 2014 at 11:57pm |
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Equivalent to 1.2dB which is about the limit of what is an audible difference to most people.
I happen to quite like the 12ND710, especially given how light it is but I did buy them while neo was somewhat cheaper.
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Soren
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Posted: 30 September 2014 at 12:00am |
I think so too :) So now the question is which CD and horn I should use together with the 12MB700. In the German project that I linked to earlier where the 12MB700 is also used they suggest an active xo at 135Hz and 1.9kHz (24dB LR). Here the 12MB700 is matched with a Selenium D220Ti + HC23-25, which is a fairly cheap option at around €74. Besides that the BMS 4550 + P Audio PH220 combination (€149) was suggested by corell, although that was together with the 12NDL76. I see that you, ceharden, also used the the 12NDL76 in another project where you matched it with the B&C DE250 + ME10 (€105). Would you suggest that CD+horn here as well? Any other suggestions for a great sounding and reasonably priced CD+horn that would integrate well with the 12MB700? Thanks Edited by Soren - 30 September 2014 at 12:05am |
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ceharden
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Posted: 30 September 2014 at 12:14am |
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DE250 I would definitely recommend but the ME10 was a mistake, it's too small and didn't perform as desired for various reasons.
I would definitely recommend the 18Sound XT1086 or XR1064, both are excellent. I'm sure the PH220 would also be fine too. Another option to consider would be the 18Sound 1424BT, which is a 2.5" diaphragm, 1.4" exit. I use it in my 15" + 1.4" cabs which are my workhorses for small FOH or monitors and mated with an XR1464 horn they a superb job from 1.5kHz upwards and actually have a really nice top end. Not quite as good as the DE250 though! |
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Teunos
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Joined: 23 November 2008 Location: The Netherlands Status: Offline Points: 1799 |
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Posted: 30 September 2014 at 10:06am |
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+1 on what Chris says. DE250 is an absolutely lovely 1'' driver, and dare i say one of the best out there! Put in on a horn which is lagre enough though or you will regret it. As Chris also said the 18sound horns are awesome bang for buck. They have good dispersion control and do not have very sharp transitions in the flare of the horn which reduces the amount of reflections down the throat of the horn thus giving better sound quality.
I personally have the 18sound xt1464 (if only they did a similar metal version of this horn!) and they rock with a NSD1480N driver attached to them. Still, a 1'' will go higher up the spectral ladder and sound nicer doing so than almost any 1.4''. If you want to cross them lower than 1300~ish Hz however, then a 1'' is too light in general. (BMS do some 1'' drivers that claim to go down lower, but they don't convince me doing so, also the 4550). And please don't cut the cost on a good HF driver, or you will regret it. If you'd ask me whether to cut cost on the woofer or on the driver, i'd tell you to cut cost on the woofer any day of the week. My personal favorite 1'' drivers are: Beyma CP-380M DE250 BMS 4550, the best 1'' that BMS makes i.m.o. both of which i am sure you will not regret buying them. A few links of measurements made on the same horn. http://www.prodance.cz/files/dl/1/870/B-C_DE250%2BA7570.pdf http://www.prodance.cz/files/dl/10/18352/BMS_4550_A7570.pdf Edited by Teunos - 30 September 2014 at 10:15am |
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Best regards,
Teun. |
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Soren
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Posted: 30 September 2014 at 4:43pm |
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Thanks a lot for the suggestions and recommendations. I'll do some research and get back to you when I have more questions :)
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Cheekybox
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Posted: 04 October 2014 at 3:55pm |
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Fane colossus 12" is a giant. We bought one, cheap, second hand that was built in 1995. It sits nicely in our mini (not too mini) scoop.
I'd upload a pic if I knew how, but, I can tell you the colossus bass scoop, tweeter box, and, mid-box (twin 8"mids, 12" bass reflex cab) with amps, all fits into the back of a Nissan Almera hatchback. This isn't an accurate vid, size and specs wise, but shows what the mid box is. http://youtube.com/channel/UCn-zrXUPFkXGdS14opiM0tQ As a full range mini rig it works a treat for small parties. It sounds like you know what you want so go with your gut. |
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Soren
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Posted: 06 October 2014 at 12:24am |
I’m having second thoughts about choosing a woofer for the midtops that won’t go very low and this made me consider the Beyma 12P80Fe, which you used in your midtop build. I checked your thread - those are very nice speakers you made! :) I think that midtops with Beyma 12P80Fe would give us a more versatile setup compared to midtops with dedicated midbass drivers (like the 18S 12MB700), which would be dependant on sub(s). My friend sometimes plays at small house parties, even in apartments, where I believe we could make do without sub(s) if we went with the Beymas and used reasonably limiting. Could I still match the 12P80Fe with something like the B&C DE250 + 18 Sound XT1086, which was previously suggested? Futhermore, I think that the Beymas would give us more possibilities when choosing sub(s). Dedicated midbass drivers such as the 18S 12MB700 will need sub(s) that can go fairly high to 120-140Hz. The Beymas on the other hand would give us the possibility of using a tapped horn sub, which is often recommended to be low passed at no higher than 100Hz. I have looked at Xoc1’s TH-18 sub. What do you think of 2 x midtops with 12P80Fe + B&C DE250 + 18 Sound XT1086 matched with 1 x TH-18 sub? I think we should be able to fit that into most cars. Edited by Soren - 06 October 2014 at 12:46am |
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ceharden wrote: