Help needed for upper bass and mid |
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samsonrocker
Registered User Joined: 29 July 2016 Location: Brighton Status: Offline Points: 16 |
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Posted: 25 April 2017 at 11:22am |
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TO give some background:
I'm running - 2 mini scoops with fane 18xbs up to 60z a vented double 15 cab with sovereign pro 400w lf from 60 - 1k2 then a fane comp from 1k2 to 7k with tweeters above it What I want to do now is build a dedicated mid cab as I want the 15 cab to just cover the upper bass. I'll bring the c/o point for the 15s down to 600 and use either a double 10 or 12" to cover from 600 - 2k, and change the comp c/o point to match What do people think about this arrangement? I was thinking I'd upgrade my 15s to 600w drivers as I don't think I'm getting much kick out of the 400w but could I achieve this with a more powerful amp? (currently using a DARE V1400) If anyone is willing to share any designs for a double 10/12" cab id appreciate it too |
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bass*en*mass
Old Croc Joined: 03 September 2009 Location: "unknown" Status: Offline Points: 4009 |
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build the boxes to suit your needs? Physically at least..
Even the most simple simulation programs online will give quite accurate results simulating closed/vented boxes.. scoops 40-80 kick 80-120ish mids 120ish-1600ish tops 1.6k up depending on comp driver and horn |
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bob4
Old Croc Joined: 29 February 2004 Location: Finland/Germany Status: Offline Points: 1842 |
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1) power dissipation is meaningless. sensitivity is the spec you want to look at to get a clue as to which of two drivers might be louder for same input. 2) from 400 to 600 W is a 1,7 dB increase. Not meaningful. Also consider power compression 3) I would guess you haven't properly spanked your kicks yet - your amp is probably to blame. It didn't get very good reviews:
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gen0me
Young Croc Joined: 20 February 2016 Location: UK Status: Offline Points: 999 |
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Instead of upgrading those 15 put them in horn kick bin.
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levyte357-
Old Croc Joined: 27 July 2012 Location: UK, South East Status: Offline Points: 8128 |
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Misconception. Most important section of Roots Reggae Soundsystem, is the low mid, and in terms of vocal reproduction, 15" reflex is the best cab for this. |
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Global Depopulation - Alive and Killing.
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valve head777
Old Croc Joined: 27 July 2012 Location: East Sussex Status: Offline Points: 1780 |
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II'd chime in at this stage and say that it's also alot to do with the c/o slope as well as point. For good vocal clarity and decent un-muddied high bass, you need separation and steep slopes do this.
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Freedom of choice, choice of freedom.
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samsonrocker
Registered User Joined: 29 July 2016 Location: Brighton Status: Offline Points: 16 |
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In terms of the amp, I agree I need to get a new one just waiting until I can afford it.
vocal reproduction out of the 15s is good it's just it doesn't perform well from 100-200hz I'm not too well educated on c/o slopes, orders, phase shifts and alignment so I'll probably need to spend some time making sense of it. From a quick search I think I've kind of got a slight idea of it; a post from someone on the forum said "Active crossovers more commonly have a 24dB/octave slope, so the power would be 24dB-or roughly 16 times lower at an octave away from the x-point". Where my c/o point is 60hz does this mean at 120hz the power is 16 times lower?
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nickyburnell
Old Croc Joined: 06 February 2005 Status: Offline Points: 4410 |
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The vocal reproduction from the 15's will be lacking, but there IS some in there. I think where Lev was pointing is that you have the best lower vocal reproduction with your reflex, but yes adding something above to complete the picture. Going to horns for (kick) after you add your new mids could be seen as a retrograde step as you will lose the warm lower vocal.
If I got Lev's drift right I personally couldn't agree more, nasal or boxy lower vocals through horns bothers me? Could be off kilter here though, as you never said you would change the reflex 15's Edited by nickyburnell - 01 May 2017 at 9:25pm |
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It's everything, not everythink!
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Sinai Sound
Young Croc Joined: 09 November 2009 Location: Sheffield Status: Offline Points: 631 |
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Have you tried experimenting playing the double 15" on a narrower band?
Try playing the mini scoops up to about 70hz, then try the double 15" from 70hz to say 170hz That way you can hear the cab playing the theoretical bandwidth if you were to add say a double 12" box Give it a little boost at 91hz as well The first amp I used with my old 15" cabs was a Matrix STR3000, which I was never happy with Tried it with a void infinite 8v2...... whole world of difference! What amp do you use on sub? Do you use 1 channel for sub, then the other for the double 15"?
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samsonrocker
Registered User Joined: 29 July 2016 Location: Brighton Status: Offline Points: 16 |
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I've got a pair of hd15s which I've been meaning to try but I agree I don't want to lose the lower vocals.
I have but I'm using a Behringer CX3400 so I don't think I can drop the low mid to below 440hz. Sage pre amp is being built though so I'll be able to properly test it then. Subs are Behringer EP4000 which does a very nice job, bridged and one scoop per channel, double 15 is a dare v1400
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SouthwestCNC
Young Croc Joined: 27 November 2015 Status: Offline Points: 830 |
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You say horn vocals sound nasal Nicky, are you talking about bph or flh or both? |
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nickyburnell
Old Croc Joined: 06 February 2005 Status: Offline Points: 4410 |
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BPH or folded. Not forward facing MT type stuff. Lower vocals (like reggae has) out of HD15/USB yuk. Techno kick, yes
Still think 15 version of below with fast 3" coil driver double stacked on top of scoops is an option from 90 to comps. Cue lots of slaps on my wrist about beaming etc :) http://hornplans.free.fr/4512.html |
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It's everything, not everythink!
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