Speakerplans.com Homepage
Forum Home Forum Home > General > General Forum
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - Horn dispersion arraying REALLY matter? HELP!
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login

Horn dispersion arraying REALLY matter? HELP!

 Post Reply Post Reply Page  12>
Author
Message
Lincoln1 View Drop Down
Registered User
Registered User


Joined: 16 February 2009
Status: Offline
Points: 251
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lincoln1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Horn dispersion arraying REALLY matter? HELP!
    Posted: 30 March 2010 at 12:11am
In seeing various pics on the net (including here) I have noticed that when stacking 2,3,4... a side midtop bins that they seem to appear to not stick to any proper 'strict' angle ratio between them. Now I know all HF horns have different dispersions but even then if more are used the angle between each one gets less just to direct the bulk of the sound in the general direction required. I have heard this not work so well with a 'phasey' HF thing going on, but do most people give a toss?
 
Reason is I have bought 4 x 2426 1" jbl comp drivers for an 'X15' project. Have another 2 or 4 N481K RCF 1" drivers which have a similar response and power handling to the JBL's. I have some 60x40 horns for them all but want to know when I need more power can I just put 4 boxes a side with minimum degrees between them? But when using 2 a side go for correct dispersion angle?
 
Just to make things more complicatedConfused I have been offered some JBL 2370a biradial horns which will remove much of the HF boost required for my 60x40 horns. However they are a 90x40 dispersion, meaning THEORETICALLY I can't array them in narrow'ish controlled angles making matters worse (IN THEORY). I know that 90DEG horiz isnt a given and will require listening to determine a the degrees to array them at.
 
Any help on this area would be awesome, as I really would like the flexibilty to use from 1 midtop a side to 4 a side. If you made it this far thru my postClapCheers:)
Back to Top
Centauri View Drop Down
Old Croc
Old Croc


Joined: 29 November 2004
Location: Newcastle Aus
Status: Offline
Points: 1792
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Centauri Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 March 2010 at 4:37am
When you need 4 boxes per side, stack the additional two upside down on top, and keep the correct angles.

Back to Top
Lincoln1 View Drop Down
Registered User
Registered User


Joined: 16 February 2009
Status: Offline
Points: 251
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lincoln1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 March 2010 at 7:43am
Wont be as pretty but will work, cheersThumbs Up. What about if I opt for the original jbl biradial horn with it's 90 deg dispersion...does this mean I can't put anymore than 2 per side, 1 on top of the other? (Else the coverage angle would be too great I'm guessing with 90 deg disp horns).
 
The JBL biradial would maybe be better since they need less HF boost and from what i have read lately some horns can increase cone breakup, and possibly piling on the usual EQ surely wont help either.
 
Sorry about 2 questions at once...just saving posts:)
 
Thanks for the help so far.
Back to Top
nex_audio View Drop Down
Registered User
Registered User
Avatar

Joined: 29 March 2010
Status: Offline
Points: 19
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote nex_audio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 March 2010 at 10:08am
90 degree horns are designed for small format sound with only 1 speaker per side. You wouldn't really want more than than otherwise it will spill onto stage and cause all sorts of problems. That is why manufacturers spend £1000s designing narrow dispersion speakers.

The only people that don't give a toss about it sounding 'phasey' are the ones that don't really know how to set it up properly, or just want it loud rather than quality.
NEX Audio - Hire & Sales
www.nexaudio.co.uk
Back to Top
VPAS View Drop Down
Registered User
Registered User


Joined: 05 December 2005
Status: Offline
Points: 1203
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote VPAS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 March 2010 at 10:19am
Some cabs array alot better then others...

Heres a balloon render for 2 Martin F12's.



And heres 2 Res2s



These are at 1KHz, cant remember the splay angles but they were the best i could find.

n^2 modulo -P = number wang
Back to Top
FarmerWardy View Drop Down
Young Croc
Young Croc


Joined: 05 April 2004
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 647
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FarmerWardy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 March 2010 at 1:03pm
thats pretty cool, you can blatantly make out the spikes and dips on the martin image, where as the fk1 looks to be more rounded and covers more evenly.

wikkid stuff, kinda makes me wonder if those images are a real representation tho or its just over complicating/working something that is really much simpler......i dunno.
UnKnOwN Soundsystem
Void, Turbosound, Thunderridge
Bristol, UK
Back to Top
rich, ind.st View Drop Down
Young Croc
Young Croc
Avatar

Joined: 14 January 2005
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 1096
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote rich, ind.st Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 March 2010 at 2:23pm
the funktion image would be interesting from the same angle as the martin plot
music is god
Back to Top
VPAS View Drop Down
Registered User
Registered User


Joined: 05 December 2005
Status: Offline
Points: 1203
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote VPAS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 March 2010 at 3:22pm

Il sort a screen shot of the res2's from the same angle, it is as smooth as it looks!...


Anyone want to see any other cabs? Give me model numbers and splay angles and il stick them in. Most manufacturers have EASE data for their speakers, dont think void do though...
n^2 modulo -P = number wang
Back to Top
tomschute View Drop Down
Old Croc
Old Croc


Joined: 15 May 2006
Location: Mid Wales
Status: Offline
Points: 1817
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tomschute Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 March 2010 at 3:39pm
Smooooth...

how would one go about compiling EASE data for a particular horn? They look very useful indeed.

Out to lunch... stableaudio@hotmail.co.uk
www.stableaudio.co.uk
Speaker Building Services
Back to Top
tomschute View Drop Down
Old Croc
Old Croc


Joined: 15 May 2006
Location: Mid Wales
Status: Offline
Points: 1817
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tomschute Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 March 2010 at 3:45pm
to reply to myself...

http://www.auralisation.de/dir_dnl/speakerformats404.zip

Big smile
Out to lunch... stableaudio@hotmail.co.uk
www.stableaudio.co.uk
Speaker Building Services
Back to Top
burningbush View Drop Down
Old Croc
Old Croc
Avatar

Joined: 25 May 2009
Location: Pictland
Status: Offline
Points: 5897
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote burningbush Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 March 2010 at 4:43pm
So, if you want more than one horn a side, then you should use narrow dispersion horns.  Try a different horn, like a obvate spheroid as opposed to the square, angular types.  If you have it so can rotate horn, then can adapt very easy to adding more.
music is the message
Back to Top
Lincoln1 View Drop Down
Registered User
Registered User


Joined: 16 February 2009
Status: Offline
Points: 251
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lincoln1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 March 2010 at 8:38pm
That's true burningbush, I thought that much. I am guess an obvate speroid is the rounded versions of the std horn? (bit of a newie here) I cant see this helping to do both jobs well either due to spilling over if disp is too wide. Do you mean will help with less cone breakup? or they dont require HF compensation?
 
I also have 4 spare big grunty JBL 2446's (2" throat 100-150W) which I could maybe fit a pair each to single large horns in a separate box and not power the horns in the mid-top boxes when I need more power. This way it'll be a point source of known dispersion.
 
Those ballon graphs look interesting. I'm guessing you'd need one for each frequency though...(as he goes back to confirm this is the caseEmbarrassed)
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  12>

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Forum Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 12.06
Copyright ©2001-2023 Web Wiz Ltd.

This page was generated in 0.156 seconds.