need plans for a good line array
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Category: Plans
Forum Name: Plan Requests
Forum Description: All plan requests here
URL: https://forum.speakerplans.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=11581
Printed Date: 20 April 2024 at 7:10am
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Topic: need plans for a good line array
Posted By: arpc
Subject: need plans for a good line array
Date Posted: 02 September 2007 at 12:08pm
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Yo guys!Please give me some good plans hot should i make a Powerful Line Array system, i have no idea how to make it and thats why i want some help.So please give some tips, plans how to make. |
Replies:
Posted By: MarjanM
Date Posted: 02 September 2007 at 12:12pm
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:-)
Why do you thik some of the Line Array boxes cost as much as 15 000 $ per box?
It takes more than just a plan to do them.
------------- Marjan Milosevic MM-Acoustics www.mm-acoustics.com https://www.facebook.com/pages/MM-Acoustics/608901282527713 |
Posted By: doober
Date Posted: 02 September 2007 at 6:03pm
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Have a thorough read of these
http://acapella.harmony-central.com/forums/showthread.php?s=867889dc1c430323a2053fb2bedd7842&threadid=521160&perpage=20&highlight=line%20array&pagenumber=1%20 - http://acapella.harmony-central.com/forums/showthread.php?s=867889dc1c430323a2053fb2bedd7842&threadid=521160&perpage=20&highlight=line%20array&pagenumber=1 http://www.burton-manor.co.uk/Audio/Audio.htm%20 - http://www.burton-manor.co.uk/Audio/Audio.htm That should inspire you (or maybe put you off the idea altogether). ------------- Blahblahblah |
Posted By: soundsystemdan
Date Posted: 02 September 2007 at 7:10pm
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If you're up for some tricky woodwork try http://billfitzmaurice.com - Bill Fitzmaurice DR range.
------------- http://dancomsound.com" rel="nofollow - http://dancomsound.com |
Posted By: ddujovic
Date Posted: 03 September 2007 at 8:02am
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For me the line array speakers (most of them) are not so special and no hard to build these boxes are only a standard vented boxes. All is in the HF part of the box but you have to buy a horn adapter for a line array and thats it. And if you want you can put some Mid drivers. The minimum cabs per side is 4 and the line array can't reproduce a high spl Low's so you need a stack of bass boxes!!!
Link for horn adapter
http://www.paacoustic.com/Product_Detail.asp?CatalogID=0117&ProductID=PH-14525 - http://www.paacoustic.com/Product_Detail.asp?CatalogID=0117&ProductID=PH-14525
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Posted By: MarjanM
Date Posted: 03 September 2007 at 8:20am
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Then why not everyone make a line array boxes???? First you need to understand the technology and learn how to apply it. Drivers has to be carefully positioned in order to achieve what it suppose to. If drivers to not couple well than it is just a reflex box turned on its side. Driver selection is also critical and some of the best LA boxes are not reflex one (EAW, Martin...). Then the processing must be implied to phase and time align the drivers. And... some of the LA boxes can produce serious bass if its needed. As a mater of fact every LA produce more bass then HF. ------------- Marjan Milosevic MM-Acoustics www.mm-acoustics.com https://www.facebook.com/pages/MM-Acoustics/608901282527713 |
Posted By: ddujovic
Date Posted: 03 September 2007 at 8:48am
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sory i don't see nothing special in this box exept the MID/HIGH part ansd also there are not so special!!! You have rihgt on processing but is not so dificult!!!!
link
http://www.jblproservice.com/pdf/VerTec%20Series/VT4887.pdf
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Posted By: MarjanM
Date Posted: 03 September 2007 at 9:10am
Yes it is not so difficult but for someone that has extended experience in box building. Not for someone stating something like the original poster. ------------- Marjan Milosevic MM-Acoustics www.mm-acoustics.com https://www.facebook.com/pages/MM-Acoustics/608901282527713 |
arpc wrote:Posted By: MarjanM
Date Posted: 03 September 2007 at 9:13am
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Oh.. and what about the rigging equipment security and insurance part. The rigging stuff must be certified. ------------- Marjan Milosevic MM-Acoustics www.mm-acoustics.com https://www.facebook.com/pages/MM-Acoustics/608901282527713 |
Posted By: ddujovic
Date Posted: 03 September 2007 at 12:29pm
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I think that rigging can be also solved by guys that make stell staff!! dalo bi se napravit dobar array!!
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Posted By: Sibulus
Date Posted: 03 September 2007 at 3:58pm
You might want to try something a little bit less full on if thats the case!! |
Posted By: MarjanM
Date Posted: 03 September 2007 at 6:46pm
Da ali ovaj ti pojma nema ni o cemu :-) ------------- Marjan Milosevic MM-Acoustics www.mm-acoustics.com https://www.facebook.com/pages/MM-Acoustics/608901282527713 |
Posted By: hansol3
Date Posted: 03 September 2007 at 11:35pm
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Hi
I need a plan for a array sytem 10 ,12 or 15 inch and horn 2 ways or 3 ways
tank's
Hansol3
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Posted By: adambomb
Date Posted: 03 September 2007 at 11:38pm
| every time I see that avitar I think of toxic. |
Posted By: Mark James
Date Posted: 03 September 2007 at 11:50pm
lol  ------------- me so horny me love you long throw horn loaded for her pleasure |
Posted By: mykey
Date Posted: 04 September 2007 at 5:12am
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Every time I see yours, I wanna cupa tea. ------------- ......just all them hanging there like giant bananas. |
Posted By: NITROSSUB
Date Posted: 07 March 2010 at 6:21am
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or any one who is interested i am currently working on a proto type full size line array
quick vids so far using LF 2 X 15" MF 4 X 8" HF 2 X 1.4 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rb8I8qMhB20 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4xMX67budi8 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zFnbY0f2998 |
Posted By: SebP
Date Posted: 07 March 2010 at 3:32pm
| this waveguide in youtube video can't work as a line source. It's a simple guide: nothing special !!! |
Posted By: staiper
Date Posted: 07 March 2010 at 10:56pm
This waveguide (from youtube links) CAN work as "line source" according to Frensel (WST criteria from L'acoustics) as long as wave front curvature is less than 1/2 wave length at highest freq. we want to reproduce. (in later documents they note 1/4 wave length as that ideal curvature) At 16kHz it is ~10.75mm -1/2wl (or ~5.37mm -1/4wl) Slot in youtube video seems a bit shorter and higher than ideal so WST "curvature criteria" will be satisfied only at a bit lower freq. than "aimed" 16-18kHz. ..Yes that is simple diffraction slot and may work full OK as "line source" (but big companies have developed other complicated/very "special" (and maybe only marginally better) ways to flatten wavefront and wrapped all with shiny marketing paper signed by R&D)  ------------- Just do it! ..or do not.. ;) |
Posted By: SebP
Date Posted: 08 March 2010 at 7:53am
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It's not simply marketing. If you want to produce a cylindrical wave (as opposite to spherical wave), the paths lenghts of the waves must be equal (as much as possible). With the waveguide in the video, the path of the wave are shorter in the mid of the waveguide than the extrimities. And with this design, you have at least 3 cm path lenght difference, so it can't works as a line source no more higher than 3KHz. |
Posted By: staiper
Date Posted: 08 March 2010 at 11:00am
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I do not know dimensions of slots in video but if we take those are
roughly ~25cm deep and ~19.5cm height it will give front difference
(curvature) of 18-19mm which will satisfy full ideal up to ~4600Hz
(nearfield conditions - 1/4wl max difference satisfied) and up to ~9200
(far field conditions -max 1/2wl diff. satisfied) This is not perfect but for most PA situations if setup is correct this may work fine as linearray HF. (..considering that MF and LF unit distances and crossover points are set correctly in respect to "line array" rules/acoustic physics ) Better situation will be if he have used 3 HF slots in same space so every slot will be ~13cm height and than wavefront curvature will be ~8 mm which will satisfy fully up to ~11kHz (~22kHz theoretical in far field -not optimal) which is more than enough for any real world situation for such simple to make device. More critical range with line arrays is MF drivers placement and setup (human vocal range .. where ears are far less forgiving at phase and time imperfections) ------------- Just do it! ..or do not.. ;) |
Posted By: MarjanM
Date Posted: 08 March 2010 at 11:02am
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SebP, that is theoretically true. But having 2-3 cm of path length difference only maters if your ear is close to the source. having in mind that this is not how you use a line array box , which means you are at least 6-10 meters away from the source that imperfections smooths out with distance. Aahhh... I should have patented that wave guide :-)  ------------- Marjan Milosevic MM-Acoustics www.mm-acoustics.com https://www.facebook.com/pages/MM-Acoustics/608901282527713 |
Posted By: Centauri
Date Posted: 08 March 2010 at 11:30am
And maybe I should have done too ...... |
Posted By: SebP
Date Posted: 08 March 2010 at 5:01pm
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No, the path lenght is very important for a line source. If you want to
produce a front plane wave, the path lenght must be the same, especially
at high frequencies (because of the short wavelength) Attenuation on a real
line source is in theory 3 dB each time the distance double (6 dB for a
spherical source). Ruban tweeters have this caracteritic, this is why
some companies use them. So call the video waveguide "line array" if you want, but it will not work as a line source at high frequencies. |
Posted By: MarjanM
Date Posted: 08 March 2010 at 9:43pm
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Yeah we all know the theory very well and you dont have to remind us. But at the end it is all in the way you are using it. I have 4 boxes per side and do events for some 1500 or 2000 people with it and i dont have to throw the sound 40 meters. So in a environment that i am using my system it does not have to achieve that 3db attenuation per doubling the distance. So it is working for me. And now you can get "real" wave guides from P-Audio or some other manufacturers for arround 50 uer per lens and just stick in the box and you have it done. ------------- Marjan Milosevic MM-Acoustics www.mm-acoustics.com https://www.facebook.com/pages/MM-Acoustics/608901282527713 |
Posted By: Sibulus
Date Posted: 09 March 2010 at 1:20am
probably best not to bother then. ------------- http://soundcloud.com/judas-beast |
Posted By: Centauri
Date Posted: 09 March 2010 at 1:33am
I don't think half the commercial manufacturers know either ! |
Posted By: mykey-
Date Posted: 09 March 2010 at 2:08am
 do you know anyone that likes them?------------- BbbBBRAAAAPppBBBBbgushhhhhhhhssshhhhhGrAbRAAAAAAPPPPPp = Dubstep |
Posted By: mykey-
Date Posted: 09 March 2010 at 2:09am
------------- BbbBBRAAAAPppBBBBbgushhhhhhhhssshhhhhGrAbRAAAAAAPPPPPp = Dubstep |
Posted By: Centauri
Date Posted: 09 March 2010 at 2:16am
Wish I had the time to further develop the HF and add the low mid section ......  |
Posted By: MarjanM
Date Posted: 09 March 2010 at 7:40am
Not the old one. New one is ok. And Oberton, B&C, Beyma, BMS all makes wave guides ready to use. ------------- Marjan Milosevic MM-Acoustics www.mm-acoustics.com https://www.facebook.com/pages/MM-Acoustics/608901282527713 |