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12 line array cab plan

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MattStolton View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MattStolton Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 January 2019 at 4:05pm
Originally posted by toastyghost toastyghost wrote:

What did you pay for your HDL again Matt? A grand a box was it?


HDL6-A is £1135+VAT UK list. I am not at complete liberty to say what I paid, but it was at a considerable discount, less further settlement, and a "PLASA" little bit % more with first order...Same for the 8004A-S, and all flyware/accessories. List for everything works out at around £27K ex VAT.

I get the lobe behavior is superior on the SH96, clearly demonstrable, but I needed a bit more mutli-purpose. And one man deployable, I haven't got a forklift handy!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote toastyghost Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 January 2019 at 4:16pm
Jesus... how do they eat?!

To be fair you would have to spend a lot more cash on Weetabix to lift it by yourself! But I’m comparing flown here anyways.

Just thought i’d complete the picture, since the discussion went there. I’d love to show you a big brand array but they don’t make their data work in Focus either.

But to the OP - this is the results on a line array you get when you have a huge company with lots of R&D time, advanced DSP and knowledge, and good rigging. Your posted plans wouldn’t even come close to this.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mini-mad Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 January 2019 at 6:39pm

Couldn't find any easy to use software so modelled mine in lego...


If it sounds like a gorilla is trying to escape, turn it down.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gen0me Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 January 2019 at 6:39pm
Originally posted by toastyghost toastyghost wrote:



Horizontal deviation

HfConfused
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote toastyghost Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 January 2019 at 7:25pm
What about it? In the stated coverage line (pink) it’s very flat for an unprocessed box.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gen0me Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 January 2019 at 9:05pm
Between 4 and 5,5k there is around 9db difference. Then you still see pattern peak valley, peak valley. Overally small horns you buy for 50£ will be flater on high frequencies. You wont get such coverage from them.

PS
Not exactly about quality as its small here but... Fact that horn is treated as one speaker doesnt mean there are no lobes inside it. You can see it at 6.3k 
Originally posted by toastyghost toastyghost wrote:

how consistent it is as you move off-axis. 
Yes hard to find anything more consistent overally.
Im curious what eq do you put on them?


Edited by gen0me - 12 January 2019 at 9:42pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gen0me Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 January 2019 at 9:14pm
How about Jerichos? Maybe there it will look nicer. With multiple hf drivers it should. On the other hand spacing between drivers will make a problem.

Edited by gen0me - 12 January 2019 at 9:17pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote toastyghost Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 January 2019 at 9:45pm
Originally posted by gen0me gen0me wrote:

Between 4 and 5,5k there is around 9db difference. Then you still see pattern peak valley, peak valley. Overally small horns you buy for 50£ will be flater on high frequencies. You wont get such coverage from them.

PS
Not exactly about quality as its small here but... Fact that horn is treated as one speaker doesnt mean there are no lobes inside it. You can see it at 6.3k 
Originally posted by toastyghost toastyghost wrote:

how consistent it is as you move off-axis. 
Yes hard to find anything more consistent overally.
Im curious what eq do you put on them?



Yes but that is consistent so can be adjusted with EQ, how do you fix the massive dips of 17dB in the RCF box?

As I say they’re not perfect, but it’s a big step in the right direction. The Jericho uses a layered combiner, to resolve spacing issues, and the patent is online for that. I can repeat the same sim later but not at my laptop right now with my EASE license.


EDIT: So all the prior plots were done at 10m, because that's where a real listener would be. It makes the data look a lot worse for a point source, but we can compare at 1m since that's where people often do their sims from before building something, and refer back to:

HDL6a



96HO



J3-64



Now these are symmetrical cabinets, so you can compare up close. For asymmetrical boxes, such as the KV2 stuff, it looks horrific at 1m because of the distance between sources varying so much. This is also the case for a line array with a curve in it, of course.

KV2 SL412



However, move further back and these even out a lot more. And since they advocate one, maybe two boxes a side at most, the issue of comb filtering and lobing is still way lower than with a line array.

I'm really curious to hear VHD5.0 on a real show, to be honest.



Edited by toastyghost - 12 January 2019 at 10:39pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gen0me Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 January 2019 at 10:41pm
.

Edited by gen0me - 12 January 2019 at 10:42pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote toastyghost Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 January 2019 at 11:10pm
Something seemed off to me on the RCF data, it looked smoothed even though I have the lowest smoothing of 1/24th set in GLLviewer, so I got a 'big boy' line array to compare. Here's the DAS Aero50, in 1/24:



Do those look raw data at 1/24th to you?!

Also here's the TF, curious phase data here...


And then the sensitivity shows the box with the array compensation enabled in the preset:


Remember these GLL files are for full acoustic simulation with reflections via raytracing, so the omission and smoothing is an interesting choice.

I have the d&b data too, but it's dinner time.

Edited by toastyghost - 12 January 2019 at 11:12pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote doller Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 January 2019 at 8:13am
I think that most would agree that the Danley stuff works. Also line arrays in the rite trained hands kinda work. So Toasty when you take the arch line out what size truck do you take? How many amps and cables?
The same thing for the Danley stuff ? Which is more cost effective? Real questions.


Edited by doller - 13 January 2019 at 8:14am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote doller Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 January 2019 at 8:16am
http://www.danleysoundlabs.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/01/line-array-paper.pdf

I was reading this today Thanks again Toasty. Just incase anyone missed it or forgot about it.

Edited by doller - 13 January 2019 at 8:17am
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