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7 laminates ply birch instead of 13 laminates

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heavydub View Drop Down
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    Posted: 06 July 2021 at 11:30am
I am building my first superscoop. Unfortunately my wood seller has only 7 laminates 18mm birch panels, instead of 13 laminates as suggested in the scooper plan. Will this make a huge difference? I am more scared about sound quality than build resistance.

I know 13 laminates wood is more dense. If 7 lam is not enougth, could I renforce the external structure with 2x 18mm panels (on both sides and behind) to give more density and better isolation?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote csg Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 July 2021 at 11:45am
Are you sure he is offering you Birch? I wouldn’t be surprised if you are being offered WBP hardwood ply, which is definitely not the same thing

But, stick with 13 laminate, solid void free birch. BB/BB grade is considered the gold standard, however you can save a bit if you only are showing one side by using BB/CP grade which will have one face that will have greater imperfections/ knots etc. that can easily be filled or hidden inside the cab.

“The fact is this is about identifying what we do best and finding more ways of doing less of it better”
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote heavydub Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 July 2021 at 12:54pm
I have news. Maybe I have the possibility to buy panels with this specs:
Birch
18mm
13 laminates
BB/CP
WBP
Marine

Do you think I can use this kind of wood to build the whole structure (internals and externals)? I probably can't find nothing better right now. 

I am not searching for the best solution. But I am searching for something that could work very nice.


Edited by heavydub - 06 July 2021 at 1:07pm
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Old Croc
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote csg Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 July 2021 at 1:39pm
That will be just fine, use the BB side on the outside obviously!…
“The fact is this is about identifying what we do best and finding more ways of doing less of it better”
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heavydub View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote heavydub Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 July 2021 at 1:43pm
Awesome! Just another question: what does the "marine" spec means? 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote csg Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 July 2021 at 2:21pm
Marine means that the ply is rated for maritime use, approved by Lloyds of london etc. WBP means that the ply should not delaminate when wet. You dont need or want marine ply for speakers.
“The fact is this is about identifying what we do best and finding more ways of doing less of it better”
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote heavydub Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 July 2021 at 2:33pm
I don't need or want, ok. But it can be used for speaker box builds without problems? I mean, mechanical resistance, sound quality, density. I've heard it's more difficoult to cut too. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote csg Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 July 2021 at 3:41pm
Never used it for speakers, so i cant comment. I really would stick to the Birch, even if something else is slightly cheaper you will lose those savings bringing the finish up to the same standard as is quite easy with Birch 
“The fact is this is about identifying what we do best and finding more ways of doing less of it better”
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote VECTORDJ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 July 2021 at 9:54pm
7 Ply Birch is only Birch on the two outer layers....13 ply Birch is Birch every layer...Way better.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JonB67 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 July 2021 at 10:12pm
Birch is stiffer, more stable, more void free, easier to machine, easier to screw into, cleaner cutting....


The extra money is worth it twice over.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote citizensc Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 July 2021 at 10:53pm
When I first got in to sound system stuff, people gave me the advice that I should just use birch. I thought it wouldn't be as important for my tops, I built them out of cheaper ply as I was on a tight budget. Within a year, they were turned in to plant pots and I had rebuilt them out of birch. I didn't save money, I wasted money and time. Honestly just use 13 laminate birch, you will not regret it! 
https://www.facebook.com/voyager.system

@voyager_soundsystem
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote heavydub Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 July 2021 at 12:28pm
Thank you everybody.

I've found new panels today. 

Birch
BB/BB quality
18mm
13 laminates
phenolic

Everything looks good, but I am not sure that phenolic ply is ok. The seller told me that the wood is absolutely birch, the quality is the same as a non-phenolic panel. The only difference is in the glue used to attach each laminate. I guess and I hope that this will be just good to build boxes. What do you guy think? I've searched in the forum info about phenolic birch but I can't find nothing special.

Maybe (but I am not sure) using phenolic birch instead of non-phenolic ply could be better because box should better resist to humidity too?? But again, I don't know. I just hope this wood is ok for scoop building.




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