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Budget 18s in gsub?

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saintzoilus View Drop Down
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    Posted: 17 November 2017 at 11:50am
Wondering how these subwoofers might be in a gsub design.

https://www.rockvilleaudio.com/rvp18w8/

Or if someone can suggest a different budget 18 design or driver? I'm in canada so half a grand or more each (Over a grand total by the time I get them both) for the suggested gsub drivers just simply isn't in my budget.

Another design I was thinking might be cool would be something "like" the ookpik sw-218c or eaw sb1000 since I'd like to feel the bass 20-40 feet away, outdoors. (Would love a link to any designs like this if you know of one)

Power draw limits are making me look for something that is roughly 400-600w rms 2x (perfect for a double 18 gsub), buying a new bigger amp or using larger power draw speakers isn't a option since I will blow a braker if I use anything bigger then what I currently have (That I'm currently using to power a pair of rental speakers when I need)

~Edit
I'd like these to cover roughly 90-100hz down to 20-30hz since the rest of my system is pretty beefy from 80hz-100hz up.

Edited by saintzoilus - 17 November 2017 at 3:41pm
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Hemisphere View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hemisphere Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 November 2017 at 12:18pm
Just because you can't afford $1000 doesn't mean you have to spend $100.

Notice they don't publish the xmax specification for this driver. That should always ring alarm bells when buying a sub driver. Why not publish it? Because it's crap.

Excursion capacity is one of the best ways to cut costs on driver design. I doubt that driver has ever sold for $170. The $60 offer looks nearer to the mark.

Pretty cheap for what it is, it has to be said - it will work it just won't be anywhere near optimal and will run out of juice a lot quicker than it's Watt rating suggests. If you're on an ultra-budget, building some bins for a laugh with some scrap wood and house paint, I would say go for it.

If you're buying quality plywood and plan to finish them professionally with decent paint and cabinet hardware, and going to use them for anything remotely serious, spend at least three times as much as that if you're buying new drivers, or buy used.

The North American market is different from European market for cheap drivers, but Parts-Express has an excellent range and a good search tool, so just look for 18" drivers and sort by price range - think in the $150-200 range for decent quality budget drivers.

Slowly working my way through The Dunning-Kruger Curve.
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MarjanM View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MarjanM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 November 2017 at 12:36pm
I am pretty sure you can find 18sound, B&C, even Eminence in Canada.
BC 18TBX100 should not be too expensive there.

Marjan Milosevic
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saintzoilus View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote saintzoilus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 November 2017 at 12:42pm
Well to put this into perspective....

I thought the same thing about rockville.. Untill I did some homework on them, they do car audio gear and are pretty respected in car audio and car audio competitions. They factory make their stuff and sell factory direct so your looking at prices before retail. For example a place like parts express would be adding a large retail price ontop of what the factory direct cost would be, I would assume somewhere around 50%-60% of the cost is the real cost.

With that being said...

I took a risk and figured "why not" try their PA speakers? I had four kick bins loaded with old 450w 15s that I eventually killed, so for around $200 I got *Four 15 inch drivers that cover the hz band I wanted very nicely, they sound better then the drivers that used to be in here by a *long* shot and are the roughly the same power rating on paper. They seem to be able to handle the power I'm giving them as well that is around its RMS rating so I would call it accurate for the 15s I own at least.

Alternatively the cheapest/best thing I could get locally would be kappa's at around $150/ea meaning this would've cost me $600 for the same kick bins. Sure we can argue all day that the kappas are better, they obviously are, but for the hz band I'm using these rockvilles in the kick bins I have are loud as hell and keep up with my double 15 yorkville maxim 1000's that I've taken the old drivers out of and replaced with kappa 15's. Again granted the kappa 15's go 1khz higher, but for kick bins I don't need that since I'm cutting that out anyways, so for this situation the rockvilles are the better option since they are as loud in the hz band I'm using them for and are a 1/3d of the price for the same four drivers.

With that being said, this makes me think about their subwoofers. I have a pair of yorkville PR418's that I've loaded a pair of these rockville 18's into and they sound good to me, however the orginal drivers seems to sound better at higher hz 200-300hz cut off, while the rockville seemed to go lower then the 40hz orginal could. This makes me think they are not very well suited for woofers (like this cab is designed for) and would be better in a gsub design.

I'm open to other options tho, what should I be looking for? Obviously xmax doesn't tell the entire story or else everybody would be using car audio speakers with huge xmax rubber speaker surrounds instead of tight impact based surrounds like all PA speakers use.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote saintzoilus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 November 2017 at 12:50pm
The bc 18tbx100 is a nicer price I can see them on ebay for $400 after shipping so I mean $800 roughly for a pair is better then over a grand but these are 1200w rms so I would be unable to power them with my current power limits or I would only be able to power one, not a double.

This is why I'm thinking about the rockville drivers, I mean I already got two of them and if they sound good I could cut some speakers out of my setup like the PR418's to make room for some more.

I did some local pricing and to build one cab its looking like the cab itself is going to cost me under $150 with a half sheet left over if I wanted to build a 2nd cab. So in theory this could be a double 18 for around $300 or less, a completed cab for less then the cost of one of the suggested drivers.

Edited by saintzoilus - 17 November 2017 at 12:56pm
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MarjanM View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MarjanM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 November 2017 at 12:53pm
You dont buy professional PA drivers on ebay. Find the distributor and you will get much better price.



Edited by MarjanM - 17 November 2017 at 12:54pm
Marjan Milosevic
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote saintzoilus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 November 2017 at 1:03pm
Its actually $12 cheaper on ebay after usd to cad convertion assuming shipping on both is $22.

I mean even things on parts express, sold by parts express on ebay are cheaper on ebay, its not the worst place and alows you to "make a offer" on things sometimes.

Talking to local dealers hasn't been very productive for me, for example long n mcquade (that is my only local dealer for eminence speakers to get my kappa's on the entire island) is actually more expensive then what I can get online and due to that I've only bought a pair off them once when they where able to get them in asap before a party, so it was worth the extra money to me in that situation since ordering online takes time...

The point I'm making here tho is that I could make the entire cab with drivers (two) for less then the cost of just one driver (that is the wrong wattage anyways) so I'm just kinda feeling like the alternatives are not very good options for me (spending a grand for something I cant even use)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hemisphere Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 November 2017 at 1:09pm
You already have two of the drivers you're thinking of using so just build a Gsub, load them, see if it's good enough for you and if it is then buy four more, if it isn't just refit them for whichever drivers you decide to buy instead.
Slowly working my way through The Dunning-Kruger Curve.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote saintzoilus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 November 2017 at 1:13pm
I mean alternatively I can buy delta pro-18's from long n mcquade for over $200, but I could get 3 rockvilles for that and the deltas do not look anymore impressive with 2.5 inch voice coils vs the rockvilles 3 inch voice coils.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote saintzoilus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 November 2017 at 1:15pm
Originally posted by Hemisphere Hemisphere wrote:

You already have two of the drivers you're thinking of using so just build a Gsub, load them, see if it's good enough for you and if it is then buy four more, if it isn't just refit them for whichever drivers you decide to buy instead.


Well thats the thing, I'm wondering if these drivers are better suited for something else like the ookpik sw-218/sb1000 type design.

How would I go about finding out what they are best suited for instead of just building a random case and hope'n for the best?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hemisphere Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 November 2017 at 1:28pm
Originally posted by saintzoilus saintzoilus wrote:

Originally posted by Hemisphere Hemisphere wrote:

You already have two of the drivers you're thinking of using so just build a Gsub, load them, see if it's good enough for you and if it is then buy four more, if it isn't just refit them for whichever drivers you decide to buy instead.


Well thats the thing, I'm wondering if these drivers are better suited for something else like the ookpik sw-218/sb1000 type design.

How would I go about finding out what they are best suited for instead of just building a random case and hope'n for the best?
WinISD, simulate the box and see how the plot looks.

I don't see why they would be more suitable for the Ookpik design. The loading of the drivers looks more demanding than a Gsub, which is just a straight up reflex really. The box dimensions don't look at all convenient either. 1.1 metre depth!? Nightmare!
Slowly working my way through The Dunning-Kruger Curve.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MarjanM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 November 2017 at 1:29pm
Why are you looking at USA sites?
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