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DSP, help setting up correctly
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Jack1991 View Drop Down
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    Posted: 01 April 2021 at 9:58pm
I have just got round to getting myself a dsp for my 12v system. I could do with help on setting it all up correctly. I have been googling and reading up on it so some of it i understand but alot of it i would be completely guessing, and obviously I do not want to mess anything up. 

DSP: https://m.thomann.de/gb/the_t.racks_dsp_4x4_mini.htm?o=5&search=1617221766 also on this link there is a photo of each section on the dsp software.


My setup is:

Tops: 2x 1" P-Audio BM-D26 Mk2 30W wired in series to channel 1, each recieving 25w. 

Mids: 2x 10" Beyma SM110/N, wired in paralell to channel 2, each recieving 50w.

Subs: 4x Tham12 with Thomann The Box 12-280-W drivers. Two wired in parallel to channel 3 then the other two to channel 4, each sub recieveing 50w.

On the DSP i will only be using 1 input which will either be a mobile phone via aux or via bluetooth reciever or a dj controller.

I will no doubt have further questions but will start with these.

1. How to set gain correctly (input & output) also on my amplifier where should i set the gain dial.

2. Gate & Comp, i assume id be best off setting some sort of limiter as the input will be changing? So would be good to make sure i dont get any clipping, especially as the amplifier cuts out completely if it clips, it goes into some sort of 'protect mode'.

3. Type of crossovers to use? I have read to use Butterworth 24 to help avoid phasing.




Edited by Jack1991 - 01 April 2021 at 10:05pm
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Conanski View Drop Down
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Points: 2545 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Conanski Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 April 2021 at 12:23am
You will be using 2 inputs if you want stereo sound or at least mono that doesn't miss any content.
Looking at the pics in the link it's not clear if the processor can sum inputs, do you have any more info on setting up the processor? You need a 3-way crossover at the very least, to do stereo with mono subs would require 5 outputs minimum.
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Points: 2545 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Conanski Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 April 2021 at 1:17am
OK I had a quick look at the manual, the only stereo option you have is 2-way but that eats up the 4 amp channels you have and leaves nothing for the subs. You can do mono 3-way with this gear but you have to come up with a way to sum your sources to mono before the signal gets to the dsp. 

All of these DSP inputs and outputs are balanced mono but the amp is unbalanced and so are your sources I bet, so you need some 1/4 TS to RCA cables to connect the dsp to amp. 

Using a single mono input(A) means all dsp channels will be set to source from A.
Gate is no use to you, forget about it. 
For crossovers LR filters sum flat electrically so maybe start there, I think crossovers at 80-100hz subs to mids and 2-2.5khz mid-high. 
Parametric EQ and delay is anybody's guess but it will definitely benefit from it, get the boxes in front of a test system too set that up.
Amp gains. Set them both at normal and adjust the relative output levels in the DSP. The high out channel will be lower than the others to balance the sound. 
Limiters, set to whatever stops the amp from clipping. Set the sub channels first and then dial in the mids and high limiters so they all engage at the same signal level, you don't want the mids and highs to keep getting louder after the subs have run out of gas. 



Edited by Conanski - 02 April 2021 at 1:28am
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Jack1991 View Drop Down
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Thank Conanski. 

Yes mono is all i wanted anyway so thats all ok.

You can select the input to output routing in the dsp, so i have set it so input 1 goes to all 4 outputs.

Delay. I have worked out the Tham12 horn length, so have delayed the mids and tops by 5.9ms.

Crossovers. Ok so i will try LR, do you think 24db? Also is this for hp/lp & for each section use the same LR?

Gain on the dsp outputs. I assume this is just gradually raise them all to sound correct with each other but not running into the red. And then also when EQ'ing check the gains again after?
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Yes you have the idea. When doing EQ try to think in terms of removing what you don't want instead of boosting what you do want to keep the total signal level boost to a minimum, and yes recheck relative levels again after EQ.
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Points: 495 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jack1991 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 April 2021 at 11:12am
Originally posted by Conanski Conanski wrote:

Yes you have the idea. When doing EQ try to think in terms of removing what you don't want instead of boosting what you do want to keep the total signal level boost to a minimum, and yes recheck relative levels again after EQ.

Ah ok cool yeh that makes sense doing it that way instead. Also when setting the gains is it best to just play a song or play white noise or something like a constant sound?


Edited by Jack1991 - 03 April 2021 at 12:07pm
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Conanski View Drop Down
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Use music you are familiar with and that will typically be played on the system. 
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So been reading up a bit more on gain on various threads. And it seems input gain should be left as is, or decreased if anything. And to only focus on the output gains. Is this correct? Also i have seen some saying about setting the gains by using a ocilloscope, would that be possible in this case seeing as im setting the gains by using the dsp? Im just trying to think how i can set the gains up correctly without having it blaring at home.

(this is just a screenshot of the gain tab from the website to show what its like)



Edited by Jack1991 - 04 April 2021 at 10:22am
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Conanski View Drop Down
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Input gains at unity(0dB) should be fine for most music sources, mute inputs not being used.
You can set relative DSP output gains with the amp gains turned down so it's not as loud, leave the sub output channels in the DSP at 0dB and adjust the mid and high outputs to balance with those. With that done the balance will be the same when the amp gains are turned back up, but some tweaks of the levels at full output may still be necessary.
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Jack1991 View Drop Down
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Originally posted by Conanski Conanski wrote:

Input gains at unity(0dB) should be fine for most music sources, mute inputs not being used.
You can set relative DSP output gains with the amp gains turned down so it's not as loud, leave the sub output channels in the DSP at 0dB and adjust the mid and high outputs to balance with those. With that done the balance will be the same when the amp gains are turned back up, but some tweaks of the levels at full output may still be necessary.

Cool thanks for your help Conanski. If i am to bridge 2 channels into 1 channel. How would i go about setting the gain for that?
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Conanski View Drop Down
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That would be the sub output right, so that is the one you leave at 0dB.
On the amp you will notice it only has 2 gain controls, that means each one controls a L+R pair of channels. 



Edited by Conanski - 05 April 2021 at 3:36am
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Originally posted by Conanski Conanski wrote:

That would be the sub output right, so that is the one you leave at 0dB.
On the amp you will notice it only has 2 gain controls, that means each one controls a L+R pair of channels. 


Yes sub output. But im just wondering for when i just want to use just 2 subs, as i would bridge 2 channels into 1 on the amplifier having 2 subs in parallel on it, to get more power. Then when using 4 subs i will just have 2 on 1 channel in parallel and 2 on another in parallel. 

Right i think i get it now anyway, ive been googling & reading the manual of a different dsp (as it doesnt say about bridging in mine) and it explains how to configure the dsp when 2 channels are bridged into 1 channel on the amplifier. It says to link the 2 outputs of the dsp that go to the 2 bridged channels so they act exactly the same. Id assume its the same on my dsp.


Edited by Jack1991 - 05 April 2021 at 1:59pm
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