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Dual 10" coupling

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Augusts View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Augusts Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Dual 10" coupling
    Posted: 24 August 2021 at 5:58pm
Hi!
 
A am about to make a compact project of PD 10".  As I understad the centers of cones should be as close as possibe,  I need to maximally awoyd phase issues, as I want them to be crossed at 4k

In the middle a CD, something like a line array but with 90x50 coverage

Something like this
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote toastyghost Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 August 2021 at 8:35pm
You’d need the centre to centre spacing to be 21 millimetres to be within 1/4 lambda (0.25 milliseconds) at 4 kHz.

Perhaps you might want to rethink that choice.

The cabinet you’re comparing to crosses from the LF section to the cone midrange on the coaxial horn they’ve designed at a much, much lower frequency than that. Even that cone midrange can’t hit 4 kHz without beaming, and it uses the HF horn as a phase plug.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tinnitus Rex Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 August 2021 at 8:44pm
 just use one 10"  or use a coax driver, problem solved. Using two drivers is only useful when you desire cancellation, like horizintal line array ellements do . If its a vertical box you would never locate the hf in  between two drivers as you create twice the problems above and below the vertical axis and practicality dictates that you need the hf as high as possible if ground stacked. Copy something good already available , These days, I  think you will be dissapointed if you to try to reinvent the wheel.


Edited by Tinnitus Rex - 24 August 2021 at 8:52pm
"couldn't we just like... use headphones?"
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote FOO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 August 2021 at 9:37pm
Originally posted by Tinnitus Rex Tinnitus Rex wrote:

If its a vertical box you would never locate the hf in  between two drivers as you create twice the problems above and below the vertical axis and practicality dictates that you need the hf as high as possible if ground stacked.


Eeeeh say what?

Outline Spektra
OHM TRS212 and MD-MH
DAS Audio ST215
Seeburg K20 and K24
Seeburg A2 and A3
Amate Audio X102FD and P212a

Just to name a few boxes with this allingment.
Most of them are really nice and loud sounding. OHM MD-MH is insanity!!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tinnitus Rex Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 August 2021 at 9:50pm
Those are horn loaded.........................did I miss something
"couldn't we just like... use headphones?"
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote FOO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 August 2021 at 6:36am
Yes you did. Half of them are reflex. Outline Spektra is one of them. A real beast.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Augusts Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 August 2021 at 6:48am
Im thinking of crossing the bottom one 140-500 with passive high qual Low pass filter so 17,7cm cone to cone and the upper one just see how it does the high freq stuff, if I need to cross lower , I Have  BMS 1" 4550 :800-up to 20kHz and large faital tactrix horns..


like so. the black ones angled 10" PD and the green one the 60x50 horn.
Red line center to center
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Conanski Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 August 2021 at 2:29pm
Just drop the crossover freq down to about 1khz or whatever the horn supports and experiment from there to get the best sound quality.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Xoc1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 August 2021 at 10:29pm
MTM mid tops (with the tweeter in the middle) have a horizontally alligned dispersion characteristic which makes them useful for certain applications. I like their in your face when you stand up in front of the speakers, foccussed sound for small venue PA system.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JonB67 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 August 2021 at 1:29pm
There's some interesting discussions and info on mtm, if you google d'appolito array/arrangement/configuration you should be able to find some more thoughts on its pros and cons. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote toastyghost Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 August 2021 at 2:23pm
Originally posted by JonB67 JonB67 wrote:

There's some interesting discussions and info on mtm, if you google d'appolito array/arrangement/configuration you should be able to find some more thoughts on its pros and cons. 


D’Appolito does not apply to any old MTM configuration. It requires specific fourth order slopes to broaden the vertical coverage and maintain phase coherency. That dictates spacing and loading somewhat.

The real benefit of MTM is the vertical polar response. Especially if you’re able to design the system based on the use of all-pass or FIR filtering (based off anechoic listening window data) to adapt the off-axis response.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JonB67 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 August 2021 at 6:43pm
Im aware its a specific thing, but it was in discussions and info on the d'appolito arrangement that I found out about the pros and cons of mtm

I didn't suggest he used the d'appolito arrangement, just that googling it was a source of some info.


Edited by JonB67 - 27 August 2021 at 8:19pm
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