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Scoops with dance music?

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spl-aro View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote spl-aro Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Scoops with dance music?
    Posted: 30 August 2010 at 5:37pm
Hi all! Big smile

I saw the 21" project and i am pretty interested.
How does scoops work with this kind of musics (dance house electronic)?
I heard that they have a "slow" bass and they are good with reggie but not with dance, is it trueCry?

Thanks all
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TONY.A.S.S. View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TONY.A.S.S. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 August 2010 at 5:59pm
Subbass contains long wave lengths. These remain the same whatever cab they come out of. Speaker output is very much signal dependent. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The Builder Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 August 2010 at 6:12pm
I think this stems from people useing them up to 120hz or so, like a one way bass cab.  Sounds poo. Elephant & castle used to have a Scoop system, Sunday after Ministry, (scoops straight to 12's) that worked but it was more Garage than house, therefore not much kick.
Scoops need a kick bin, with the possible exception of Rhino 3 and a bit of eq.
IMHO as usual
It just is.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mykey- Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 August 2010 at 6:15pm
hehe

love your answers Tony, sarcastic yet still diplomatic

@spl-aro......if the bass is old and past it, say 70 +, it tends to be slow and grumpy
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote spl-aro Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 August 2010 at 6:43pm
So you guys are saying that with an EQ and high-cut filter at about 80Hz they work well?

Sorry but I don't understand english well, I'm Italian..Confused
In a word can I have with a scoop a fast bass, without delays (good for music like dance, techno..) or is better a normal horn subwoofer?

The problem is that horn subs usually don't reach 30Hz like a scoop does, and i need that
frequencies
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JR.junior Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 August 2010 at 6:43pm
15" scoops for dance music. 50-90Hz boost.
Support the scoop technology, larger mouth plays louder!
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spl-aro View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote spl-aro Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 August 2010 at 6:59pm
So for you the 15" are better sounding than the 21"?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sine Here Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 August 2010 at 7:05pm
Originally posted by JR.junior JR.junior wrote:

15" scoops for dance music. 50-90Hz boost.

yeah, 21's are for really low bass i.e. Dubstep but even then a pair of 15's or 18's will do the job easily...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JR.junior Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 August 2010 at 7:08pm
+1


Edited by JR.junior - 30 August 2010 at 7:18pm
Support the scoop technology, larger mouth plays louder!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pfly Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 August 2010 at 7:41pm
I think 18" scoops can be used for dance music if used together with proper upper bass cabs ie. HD15 / USB / ES18BPH / Martin 115/215 and enough of them. Most of what most call bass "fastness" is down to the frequency range those cabs are playing and with DSP it is not hard to time / phase align scoops to work with those.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TONY.A.S.S. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 August 2010 at 7:54pm
In general, it is considered that a bass speaker responds slower than a mid speaker for instance. On one hand this may seem strange because a speaker should only respond to signal, The problem is that a bass speaker with a large coil and a heavy cone has a lot of mass compared to a smaller speaker, and therefore it takes a bit more to push it up the hill. Bass speakers do redeem themselves slightly in horn loaded cabs, not because of the horn, but because of the small compression chamber that they are usually housed in. This has the effect of restricting movement through resistance and vacuum, and making the sound a bit more sharper.
I am starting to use 3"voice coil speakers in folded horns because these become more punchy than a 4"voice coil speaker.
The same is true for monitors I think a 3" coil is far better (faster) for vocals than a larger speaker would be.
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