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My first rig... progress thread

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Khyber View Drop Down
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    Posted: 18 January 2018 at 11:33pm
Pretty happy with this one! Took some working out to get the adjustable arms calibrated but it works.
Full adjustable every 2.5° from flat up to 20°


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Khyber Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 January 2018 at 6:26pm
Will do guys, Much appreciated :) funny isn't how when they state usable frequency range (and a lot of other parameters for that matter) it appears almost impossible to ever translate that into practice. I am documenting everything i'm learning here as notes, i haven't tried digesting this much info since school. Even then i didn't really try ha. keep it coming! i have practiced alot of 'disciplines' autodidactically but this has got to be the hardest in terms of scientific and mathematical thoery :)

*Edit - Do the rest seem sensible?



Edited by Khyber - 11 January 2018 at 7:57pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bass*en*mass Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 January 2018 at 5:12pm
^ ideally not even that high as the 10" will beam a lot.. + you wont require a 1.4" hf, bms 4550 would do, crossed at about 1.6khz

have a look at bluearans 1581 cab using the sonitus audio 8" horn+de250hf, xover around 2.5khz
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RoadRunnersDust Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 January 2018 at 4:16pm
You will struggle to get a non-horn loaded 10” to reach much beyond 2k5...

Common cross frequencies for 10/12” to HF are 1k8-2k5... most common being 2k2 in my experience
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Khyber Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 January 2018 at 2:15pm
Thanks for the clarification :)

Edit-
Im planning 4 way
18" Sub up to 70-90Hz
15" Kick 70-90Hz  -  180-200Hz
10" Mid Bass 180-200Hz  -  4-5KHz
1.4" CD 4-5KHz  -  20Khz >







Edited by Khyber - 11 January 2018 at 2:34pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote valve head777 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 January 2018 at 2:02pm
Reggae Soundsystem has a quite particular frequency response which might not be the best template for a system that plays a variety of styles. You could 'tune' a general system to make it sound like a reggae Soundsystem tho.
Agreed on the need for clarity on low mids/upper bass.


Edited by valve head777 - 11 January 2018 at 2:02pm
Freedom of choice, choice of freedom.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jo bg Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 January 2018 at 1:58pm
while the 100 - 200 hz range could not be so prominent in reggae, you still need quality there, and few big subs maintain it up there. you see many reggae sounds going from horn loaded to reflex kicks, but few without them.
if you really want to run your rig three way i'd look at mid tops that reach at least 100/120 hz...



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hemisphere Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 January 2018 at 1:52pm
You could do but there are reasons not to as well.

Imagine for example the part of a track where the lowest fundamentals of the vocals or some other definition critical sounds are creeping into the upper bass region (and if not entirely, at least within the audible range of the crossover)

And at the same time you've got a 35Hz bass note driving your subs to maximum excursion.

At that time you would be better with a separate kick cab, not for SPL or weight but for clarity between frequency bands.

Edited by Hemisphere - 11 January 2018 at 1:56pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Khyber Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 January 2018 at 12:32pm
Made up a shortlist from the plethora of available drivers to work with now. Also been working on the X-over freqs for the WinISD simulations and cab tuning. If say for example stacking to play hard electronic music having the sub upto 70-90Hz then Kick upto around 180-200Hz (maybe even 250Hz), would i then be better off when playing reggae adjusting the X-over of the sub upto 180-200Hz (or whatever the mids take over from) and just not stacking the kicks as the reggae doesn't really need anything in them freqs to hit hard? In a lot of dancehall the perc sits way back in the mix anyway and the subs would be more than capable upto 200Hz. I have seen a few systems doing this. Thoughts?...


Edited by Khyber - 11 January 2018 at 12:37pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Khyber Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 January 2018 at 1:35pm
I see what your saying man, That's the kind of approach i would normally take - Enter woods, map as i go, but with something of this complexity i.e designing a rig i thought it may be the better approach to ask around for maps for say. maybe i should just grab my torch and enter them scary woods :) again i wont be starting any building this instance (im still short of a plunge saw and few other bits and bobs) but hopefully in the summer ill get started on my first sub.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Hemisphere Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 January 2018 at 11:58am
The trouble is you're asking people who've learnt their way around the woods (and not all the way around them either, just the specific routes that they've needed to familiarise themselves with to reach their desired destinations) by walking through it, if they can send you a link to the map.

Maybe some people started with a map. I didn't so I really don't know what to recommend. There are some books - The Loudspeaker Cookbook by Vance Dickason is one I've heard recommended many times but haven't read.

http://www.avsforum.com/forum/155-diy-speakers-subs/1276116-best-diy-book-best-speaker-theory-book.html

There are a whole bunch of book suggestions here, but which one is most suited to your specific needs I don't know.

You know you could have used the search function to find these titles. LOL

Edit: Even if you read all these books it still won't be the same as having a map, although it will give you a lot of useful information about the field. Or woods as the case may be.

Unless you're hyper-aware and able to process new knowledge and information brilliantly, and quickly discern that information which is most relevant to your requirements as you read it, then you may struggle to determine which sections of these volumes of dense technical information are particularly relevant to your goals, and may miss something important or fail to draw the link between a piece of information and the issue you're facing, or an issue that you don't even know you're facing. This is particularly true if you're determined to produce something unique. It's that desire specifically which makes things difficult.

There's a connection here with the Dunning-Kruger effect of not knowing enough to know how much you don't know. The books will help with that, but if you want to do this right they're probably going to make the goal of producing the system (if you're determined to entertain bizarre features like downwards-firing HF and CD horns recessed into the woodwork for the sake of producing a unique aesthetic) seem a lot further away.


Edited by Hemisphere - 09 January 2018 at 12:15pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Khyber Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 January 2018 at 11:37am
So having taken into account what everyone is posting here, say for example pointing the MT baffle down at 7.5 deg isn't a good idea etc (why?) i struggle to then find any relative theory explaining the reasoning behind this. Rather than me whipping up design after design and people telling me it wont work I think i would rather read up on theory behind all of this speaker design malarkey. I know most will just say use the search function but when your not quiet sure on what your searching for its a bit more tricky. So then a lot of you may tell me stick to proven designs but then haha yeah you just don't know me... :) Basically i would like to build this rig i will be designing myself, but the main reason for undertaking this project isn't to have a rig by the end of it, its for the learning process leading up to that. One of the few documents covering things like this is this one

https://celestion.com/speakerworld/downloads/patech/109.pdf

but that doesn't even really touch on any theory

So if anyone can point me in the direction of some reading material that covers as much theory as one might need to start designing a rig and know why certain things will or will not work.. enlighten me :)

Then in future i might not have all my post received with change this change that. as i said before i am doing this for the reason of learning the theory behind building speaker cabs not just to own a rig by the end of it.

Lastly i take all these comments as constructive criticism positively i am not digging at anyone (I wouldn't ask the newbie questions if i wasn't able to take ridicule) :)

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