look at tops to build |
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Keen
Young Croc Joined: 30 May 2011 Location: Brisbane, Aus Status: Offline Points: 1203 |
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lol
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corell
Young Croc Joined: 19 August 2013 Location: Berlin Status: Offline Points: 1161 |
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If you like the idea of a conventional direct radiating "multifunctional" top with a passive x-over but are afraid of jobst-audio's waiting/delivery time, you might want to take a look here:
https://www.bs-tek.de/bausaetze/fullrangelautsprecher/bs-m-14/ support there is excellent. HF horn is rotatable, so these array fairly well to 120° a side if needed. |
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MHayes
Registered User Joined: 15 April 2019 Location: U.K Status: Offline Points: 19 |
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good to hear PM90 with nd950 are working out for you. what are you using below them?
Yes, as much as i would like to get to get the funktion1s or others in that price range, i just think that for the moment they are not for me. maybe in future. for now i'm mainly looking 4 good tops that can take upto 8 basses and maybe 4 more in a cpl of months. already got 4 single 15's but i keep blowing the mids on them. 2 are just good enough for 2x 18s. but, not for 4 x 18's. but basic idea is to be able to do multiple events at the same time and if required use everything at once, and 12 basses at 1 event is the limit i see my self going to atleast for another year or 2. thanks, matt |
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MHayes
Registered User Joined: 15 April 2019 Location: U.K Status: Offline Points: 19 |
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thanks corell. i did look at them as well as PAF212 + many others.
only thing is that they are single 12's/14's when i am using my 15" top (usually 2 bass with 2 tops per side) for most genres its fine and i absolutely love the way the whole system sounds. only when i play techno on them i have to considerably down the highs and lows to get decent mids. it's only when im playing techno i have managed to get the mids blown. when i'm using 8 basses, i usually rent 2 dual srx tops and use 2 15s as center fills and 2 as side fills. that is the only reason i think BS tek's wont be enough. Thanks, Matt
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cravings
Old Croc Joined: 30 January 2007 Location: Ireland Status: Offline Points: 7441 |
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my heart will always be with building rather than buying.. but they're right about second hand kit these days. one thing to bear in mind is that home built speakers have no real resale value. you'd spend a lot building these but you won't be able to sell them for anything close to what you spend on building them. . but any of the EAW / fk1 type tops mentioned, they might depreciate a bit but you'll almost certainly be able to sell them on for pretty close to what you bought them for in a few years.
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Cyklist
Young Croc Joined: 14 December 2007 Location: Ireland Status: Offline Points: 707 |
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what waveguide and DSP are you using?
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purple monkey dishwasher
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MHayes
Registered User Joined: 15 April 2019 Location: U.K Status: Offline Points: 19 |
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Agreed Cravings, that the resale will certainly be more than that of a home brew. but, I don't think ill be selling them as space is not an issue.
another thing is that if its home brew, I don't really have to care about dry rentals. - if something happens I know where to get the parts from and less hassle over oems. -chips/dents/box fell over 20ft, no worries, just paint it or make a new box. -less chances of theft over res 4 :D -also lets take into consideration that I got of JM-Sat 212 or pm 60s, that like 20-25 kgs vs 40-45 kgs res4. -I can buy 2 res4s or make 4 jm-sat212 or pm60 (rcf 950). I can do 2 events rather than just 1 with res4 if need be. and I don't want to be lugging a 40+ kg top box when I'm doing a slightly small scale event that needs only 2 basses per side. -doing a corporate event, I certainly don't want to be taking something that came out of an action movie set. + many more advantages and there are disadvantages as well that I haven't listed. for me, having 2-3 dedicated system for specific event is a long term goal. also buying high-end branded equipment is something that needs to be earned (not money wise) which I'm still learning. I am more than happy to be handed over factory preset and other goodies cos I have paid the price for the full system. but only after I have acquired enough knowledge to not need it. thanks, matt |
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corell
Young Croc Joined: 19 August 2013 Location: Berlin Status: Offline Points: 1161 |
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Hey Matt,
what single 15" are you currently running? I personally find that i can bring 3-4x 18" BR subs per Top (single high grade 12" -15") for techno music. About 2x 18" BR per Top for Live. So curious to hear what theproblem is in your case. |
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MHayes
Registered User Joined: 15 April 2019 Location: U.K Status: Offline Points: 19 |
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HK Audio L115's.. bought them used.
never used for live events, only for dj events with different genres. most crowd is for techno events in the range of 350 - 600 max. usually lows are over powering and I usually have to turn it a notch down (around 6db if indoors and 3bd for semi outdoor events) so that it sounds clean. but when I do that the overall energy is too low and I'm being asked to increase the overall volume, which the speakers (mids) cant take. so I end up bringing the lows back (usually around the last one hour) up to 0 db and at this point the sound is bassy and personally gives me a headache, its like your living next door to a club and all you hear is vibration. (hope I explained well). the crowd and the event organizer are happy with this and all I get is compliments. I'll be doing this again next week. and as always they will be too drunk to notice what I did there in the last 1 hour. but, I am looking at not having to do that in the future. thanks, Matt
Edited by MHayes - 18 April 2019 at 1:17pm |
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corell
Young Croc Joined: 19 August 2013 Location: Berlin Status: Offline Points: 1161 |
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Can you post a picture of the 15" used in the HK Audio Top? Would like to check whether it was thermal or machanical damage (if you have blown them, you probably took them out aswell ;) )
The BS Tek (and also JM Sat) is a WHOLE different beast than the HK audio. The HK is an entry level speaker, probably with a 2,5" VC and ~3mm xmax for the 15" and a way to high crossover point to the small 1" so that the midrange suffers. This is the case 95% of time with budget 15" tops. The BS Tek has a 3" VC 1,4" HF (probably costing as much if not more than the whole HK cab) crossed at 1,2 kHz and the 14NDL76 has like 8mm xmax and great midrange reproduction. I guess its at least 6db louder than the HK, closer to 10dB for equal distortion figures. I would be really surprised if 4 of them would not be enough for 8x 18" BR. I usually run 2 of them (or similar tops) (one per side) for techno and honestly feel like the bass is limiting, not the MF/HF. And i run some pretty decent 18". ;) Problem with 212/215 boxes is that it needs an even bigger HF and horn so that you can have a low crossover point to prevent heavy vertical beaming. You are looking at BMS4590 or 4" VC drivers here (same as in the PM60). Even then, you will not have a very mulitfunctional box as it wont have any more than 30-40° vertikal dispersion throughout the crossover region, which is not that suitible for infills/monitoring etc. Whats really limiting with a direct radiating top is the "throw", not the SPL. |
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MHayes
Registered User Joined: 15 April 2019 Location: U.K Status: Offline Points: 19 |
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Thanks corell, this makes it so simple for decision making.
main issue was comparing my tops or any other similarly priced ones. without knowing the drivers used in it or other basic parameters and all just mention 128db peak, 131bd peak etc. which doesn't make any sense without a&b comparison which I don't have the option for. so now I'm almost set on bs-teks or jm-sat singles and save the money on duals for a better dedicated system for larger crowds in the future. not worried about the throw for now as I'm not doing mini concerts with 1000 attendees. for all my events the main focus area is just the dance floor and even if there are 700 ppl attending I just want to be able to give the best sound to about 300 or less in the front and I'm usually clear about this with the organizers. Also, I don't have a pic of the woofer. I usually give it back to the guys I bought it from to get it fixed. also I doubt they know what to look at. they just see if it's blown and know how to recone it. Thanks, Matt
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IvCu
Registered User Joined: 16 August 2014 Location: Netherlands Status: Offline Points: 26 |
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I'm using Martin audio 215mk3 and 2x othorns. Even when everything is on full tilt, PM90 still has plenty of headroom
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