Mobile 12V Sound System (Bike Mounted) |
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Jimi Handtrix
New Member Joined: 18 August 2019 Location: Berlin Status: Offline Points: 7 |
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Posted: 18 August 2019 at 6:33pm |
Hey y'all! I've been thinking about constructing a sound system for a while now, and thought I might begin with a bike-mountable mini-rig. I've only just began reading up on the subject, but I think I have a general idea of how I want it to look, sound and function. I have a few general questions to start off with, so I can put together a list of all the main components I'll need. I'm not quite sure what cabinet design(s) I should use - I was thinking about something which will fit 1x 15", 2x 10" or 8", and 4 or more tweeters, plus stow-room for battery, amp, etc. (preferably at the bottom). Does it make sense to have a scoop design (which would add more height and probably some weight as well), or would a more compact bass reflex design suffice for the sub? Not really trying to go under 50-60hz anyway. Also, I would optimally like to have 1 single cabinet that fits everything, but I can see the obvious transport benefits in being able to separate the sub cabinet from mids/tops. What are your thoughts?
Here's a list of things I'll need as far as I can tell.. anything important I'm forgetting?
Optimally I would like to have a multi-channel mixer (Allen & Heath / Soundcraft) with sends for external effects, and a Pioneer CDJ to play from, but I realize this may be hoping for a bit much. Is there anyway to run such devices on a 12V supply, or is it completely out of the question? And what alternatives could there be for sound output to the amp? If the only option is playing from an IPhone / Ipad / MP3 player it would kind of take the fun out of it! =D Looking forward to hearing your thoughts! < ="text/">
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slaz
Old Croc Joined: 27 November 2009 Location: London E2 Status: Offline Points: 2713 |
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REMEMBER....POLITICIANS AND DIAPERS SHOULD BE CHANGED OFTEN AND FOR THE SAME REASON
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Jimi Handtrix
New Member Joined: 18 August 2019 Location: Berlin Status: Offline Points: 7 |
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I had a brief glance at that thread - will be sure to read through everything 12v / bike related in the forum (in due time)! Would either one of the batteries I mentioned above be good for powering a similar setup for 6-10 hours? I'm not sure how to tell if it's a "starter" battery or a "leisure" battery - is there any specific characteristic to tell them apart? And would there be anyway to get an actual dj setup (mixer & CDJ) running on a 12v setup? Thanks!
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slaz
Old Croc Joined: 27 November 2009 Location: London E2 Status: Offline Points: 2713 |
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I'd say running for 10 hours (at max/close-to-max volume) is gonna need at least double that battery capacity. Leisure batteries are usually described as AGM or gel battery .... starter batteries are "flooded". You possibly get a small dj mixer in a rucksack - dunno about the CDJ though. Power-wise - well there are certainly some compact mixers that rundirectly from 12V DC (not sure about DJ mixers with A-B cross-fader though). The CDJ .... I think you'd have to use an inverter for that ... which means more space/weight and more battery power. I set up an old netbook (Asus eeePC) with virtualDJ and programmed some effects into it. Stuff like rewind, bass cut, siren etc. which lend themselves to reggae style .... much more compact, and with good battery life if you disable wi-fi, bluetooth, ethernet. |
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REMEMBER....POLITICIANS AND DIAPERS SHOULD BE CHANGED OFTEN AND FOR THE SAME REASON
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studio45
Old Croc Joined: 16 October 2007 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 3863 |
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Pioneer amp is a good choice. You won't need any other active crossover to run a 2-way system. But you will need a passive crossover inside your mid-tops to seperate the mid frequencies from the treble.
To estimate battery life, assume that when playing music at full volume, your continuous power output is about 12.5% of the rated maximum output of your amp (this is because music contains loud bits and quiet bits). So for that amp rated at 600 watts into 4r, the equivalent continuous figure is 75 watts. Multiply this by an (assumed) 80% efficiency figure for the amp, and you are at about 94 watts continuous draw from the battery. This is about 7.8 amps. So a 50AH battery could be expected to last about 6.5 hours if you drain it all the way to flat. However, consider whether you really need to play at full volume for the whole party - if you can spend some time playing at 50% or 75% power, you can add another couple of hours onto that. I know from experience that trying to put any more than 50Ah of lead acid batteries on a bike trailer makes it a complete PIG to tow around, especially uphill. You will struggle to get the combined weight of your bass bin, amp and midtops below 30kg, so adding 18kg of battery onto that makes for a serious load. And remember to keep the weight down low, otherwise you will fall over going round corners ;) Faital Pro make some good drivers for mobile applications. Look at their 15" neodymium offerings for your bass bin, and the 4FE35 for a cheap mid-top solution (think *arrays*....) As for box designs, I have had great success with tapped horns for bass - but people often go for reflex, and that can be great too.
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Studio45 - Repairs & Building Commotion Soundsystem -Mobile PA
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wakemasia
Registered User Joined: 17 May 2019 Status: Offline Points: 13 |
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I have a mobile PA and we usually play from an XDJ board which is powered from a laptop running on its own battery.. usually lasts for about 5-6h. Works pretty good and I get about 12h (the rest of the time we play from a phone) from an 80Ah AGM battery with about 1kW RMS. This is, staying over the recommended 11,2V that are recommended to preserve the battery's life. Recently I got a second battery and a sinus inverter with 300W to run a bigger lights and DJing setup but this is probably overkill. Good luck and post pictures! |
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Daniel S
Registered User Joined: 08 January 2013 Location: Sweden Status: Offline Points: 160 |
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Try the Pioneer XDJ 700, they run on 12v from a wall wart. There's plenty of mixers as well that run on 12v. Or you could always go with some DJ controller that is USB powered. |
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Distortion is evil
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Jimi Handtrix
New Member Joined: 18 August 2019 Location: Berlin Status: Offline Points: 7 |
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Hey again,
I'm finally getting closer to the construction of the sound system I've been thinking about, and wanted to ask about specific driver combinations. I'd like to build a Cubo15 (using 18mm birch ply), and then 2 separate cabs for 2x 8" drivers and 3-4x 1" drivers (probably using somewhat thinner birch ply). I've been looking at the following drivers from Eighteensound: - 15ND930 - 8NMB420 - HD1050 Do you think this combination would make sense? Or what would your suggestions be for use of a Cubo15 and corresponding mid/high drivers? Also, how would I route the signal through a miniDSP, using a Pioneer GM-D8604? Is it possible to sensibly split the signal into 3 ways with the DSP and this amp, or will I need a passive crossover after the amp for the mids / highs? Thanks in advance!
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SamV
Old Croc Joined: 21 October 2008 Location: London Status: Offline Points: 8707 |
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Ok so you shouldn't need 3-4x 1" drivers. Typically Most 1" can keep up with 2x 8-12" mid drivers, which in turn will take two subs to balance out. Check out the sensitivity numbers. The only reason to use more driver is for coverage, but then you might come into issues of combing which may or may not be an issue for you. The next thing is that you'll need a channel of amplification per DSP channel with a max of 4ohm load. So my choice would be to go with 1 cubo (4ohm driver) running bridged, 1x 10/12" cab and a 1" CD. If weight isn't an issue then you can double up on the mids and HF if you're using 8ohm drivers to bring it to 4ohm per channels which is what that amp is optimised for. You wouldn't want to put two HF units on the same face though until you pay attention to their dispersion patterns.
Now on the control side, I would high pass the the mids from around 85+hz and make the sub switchable. That way you don't always have to have the sub on to conserve power, and the mods still have a bit of thump. I would also high pass the subs around 50hz. It'll gain you a lot of battery life without much noticeable sub loss in most conditions. Bike sound systems are all about choosing the right compromises to suit your needs. Edited by SamV - 12 May 2020 at 12:37am |
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Shortrope
Young Croc Joined: 08 July 2013 Location: Ireland Status: Offline Points: 1232 |
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Denon recently brought out a savage Battery powered all in one DJ controller the Prime go...spicy money though.
I’ve had great results with using Deejay on an iPad with a Traktor Audio 2 mkII sound card, you’ve all the effects and fun to mix on. Also, have you looked into making up your own Lithium ion battery packs from 18650 cells, it’s not as complicated as you’d think.
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My Tinnitus is coming along nicely!!
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Jimi Handtrix
New Member Joined: 18 August 2019 Location: Berlin Status: Offline Points: 7 |
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So after spending the past 2 weeks or so in the shop, the sound is up and running!! And it was even sounding quite decent for a first sound check.. still a lot of optimizing to do of course. My next goals are to get install some grills, get someone over to help me properly measure delay times & SPL, etc., install capacitor, wire everything up a bit tidier, figure out how to power the t.Racks 4x4 DSP from a battery (preferably without buying a pricy inverter), and get everything set up on the bike trailer!
*Edit: I can't for the life of me seem to get the image uploaded here, so here's a link to my website where I'll be posting some pictures and info! www.abassodyssey.com/sound-system/
Edited by Jimi Handtrix - 28 May 2020 at 12:11pm |
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SamV
Old Croc Joined: 21 October 2008 Location: London Status: Offline Points: 8707 |
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The DSP is 12v native, so all it needs is an inline fuse, and it can be connected directly to the battery. Just chop the able it comes with in two, and add a connector to each cut end, that allows you use it mains powered if you need to, and then make up another cable to go to the battery.
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