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186 horn in Hornresp

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mstep77 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mstep77 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 July 2007 at 4:16pm
http://img338.imageshack.us/img338/486/spl186horntr7.jpg
 
thats the spl response i've got so far, clearly not quite right.
 
Anybody know what is wrong with the input parameters above, i modelled according to the annotated plan on the previous page?
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Young Croc
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Contour Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 July 2007 at 7:53pm

Well I don't think your simulated response is that far of.

Best regards,

Walt

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mstep77 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mstep77 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 July 2007 at 7:58pm
cheers walt
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Wrighty View Drop Down
Old Croc
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Wrighty Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 July 2007 at 12:15pm
Okay, here's my attempt. It's still not quite right. I've tried playing about with where the segments start and end but I'm bored now!

I drew the whole thing in AutoCAD so I could work things out more easily. The throat chamber includes an allowance of 3 litres for the driver cone and the rear chamber includes an allowance of 7 litres for the driver and a bit for the back panel (to round it to the nearest litre).

Here's how I split it up:




Here are the Hornresp parameters for the standard 600mm wide version:




And here are the parameters for my 500mm wide version:




And finally, here are the plots. Black is 500mm, grey is 600mm:




Edited by Wrighty - 03 July 2007 at 12:18pm
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gingerbiscuit69 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gingerbiscuit69 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 July 2007 at 12:51am
so wheres the advantage of the 500mm version?

not as efficient down low, and that 3db loss is a pottential waste of efficiency!! i assume your midtops are 500mm so you wanted them to match?

nice to see why they are honky up higher, on the plan they are flat to 200hz, this shows otherwise (i xover at 125hz to avoid the honking).

am still working on a better design for a PD186, so far managed to get a flat response 40-175hz from a marginally smaller box. looks like a punisher/186 hybrid inside. after testing and measurment on a prototype ill post some pics and results. also working on making this design for dual 18" so im 'forced' to take too much sub to pub type gigs hehehehe......
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Wrighty Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 July 2007 at 1:18am
Storage space mainly. At the moment, I've got a pair of PD186 loaded T18 clones and although they did sound awesome at the Summer Solstice gig I did, I think I can do better.

550mm is the absolute max cabinet width I can get away with. Reducing the 186 horn by 100mm brings the total cab width down to 536mm. Allowing for hardware protrusions and/or covers, this is perfect. Coincidentally, this is the width that my 15" reflex subs will be when I get round to rebuilding them, so they'll sit nicely on top as low-mids.

The other option I was looking at was a pair of Punishers, but I already have a couple of PD186 drivers in the T18s, so thought I'd save money by recycling those.

Also, I'm not fully converted to the thought of being able to bung 2500W of Crown into a pair of 12" drivers and not see smoke. I like the 5 inch voice coil of the PD186. I like the PD186's 97dB efficiency, compared to the Ciare's 91dB. I can see the reason for using a 12" driver because it offers advantages from the point of view of the horn design, but there's gotta be a catch!
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gingerbiscuit69 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gingerbiscuit69 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 July 2007 at 1:26am
ill pm you soonish once i get everything sorted, this will deffinatly interest you!!
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Old Croc
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Wrighty Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 July 2007 at 1:43am
Ok, nice one! I've been playing about with some figures in Hornresp too, but I was looking for an easy option so I don't end up having to build loads of prototypes. I'm sure the bloke in B&Q hates me. He never seems terribly impressed when I go over to the panel saw with a couple of sheets of ply and a cutting plan...
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mstep77 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mstep77 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 July 2007 at 3:22pm
I'm guessing a bit, but if you reduce the cabinet with then all of the s1-s4 will decrease by the same factor and so all the flare rates and stuff will be the same so it shoud sound alright.
But same as stacking lots of horn mouths together you loose on sensitivity and flatness of response.
Ginger have you designed this horn in half space?
whats the average sensitivity of your idea?
Looking forward to seeing it

Matt
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Old Croc
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Wrighty Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 July 2007 at 3:47pm
I'm awaiting Ginger's plan too. In the mean time, I came up with this:





If I can work out how to fold that up in a box, I'd be quite happy with that. The 4000cm^2 mouth equates to 500mm wide, 800mm high front of cab (internal).

I did think about whether it was possible to make the 186 deeper and taller to compensate but it requires a fair amount of calculation and even then, may not be quite right.


Edited by Wrighty - 11 July 2007 at 3:50pm
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mstep77 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mstep77 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 July 2007 at 10:31pm
nice one mate, that looks very respectable.
Do you know how to calculate the mouth/throat area at a give distance away from the throat which satisfies the exp flare tangent that you have specified in this model?

Best regards

Matt


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Old Croc
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Wrighty Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 July 2007 at 12:52am
I managed to come up with something pretty damn close to that exponential model, using 4 conical segments but it was just a case of plugging numbers in until I got a schematic and a graph which looked similar. I've come to the conclusion that folding horns requires a lot of patience.
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