Skram vs. C2E - Subwoofers info research

MMJ of HOQS wrote: T6ss , I don't live in The UK   ...  Again I ask who are You?  Are you a cabinet builder in The UK?  The reason I ask is because there is one builder in particular (in The UK) who builds other sorts of cabinets and has been stirring up trouble lately because he feels threatened or insecure or whatever .... Probably freaking out because people keep asking him to build Paraflex cabinets   Anyway, You are just talking a bunch of trash with the passion of someone who has an agenda while hiding behind some vague internet handle , so you can understand my curiosity..  Your account has "new member" status , created on the 16th of February which is just a few days ago .... So did you create this fake name account just the purpose of jumping in on this discussion to spout off your garbage in here?   Did you really go through all of that trouble just to shoot us down?     We are trying to have a civil discussion here about technical matters  ....  Your nastiness isn't called for ....

We are trying to have a civil discussion here about technical matters  ....  Your nastiness isn't called for ...

MMJ of HOQS wrote:  Tss ,      I didn't join to troll anonymously  .... Big difference  ..

MMJ of HOQS wrote: You won't even bother to identify yourself ...  I don't have time for anonymous internet trolls hiding behind a vague alias ..    The internet is maggoty with such creeps . .   You aren't entitled to anything from me ..    I will say that You apparently also don't have a clue about how our process works, I am only the first step, but I do interact with other parts of the process where I can help  , and I receive constant reports & feedback ....  I pretty much eat, sleep, and live this and have for some years now without much of a break and momentum just continues to build for us , and that is for good reason  ....     People enjoy what we make. .

T6ss

The paraflex boxes have a lot of hype behind them and very little data that can be used to compare to other designs in any sort of meaningful way. I have not seen any direct comparisons between a paraflex box and other designs.

It seems that a lot of the crews who are building paraflex designs are very new to Sound System and do not have a lot of real world experience with a variety of designs (especially down here in Aus/NZ). The people building them do seem to be very happy with their performance but I was over the moon with the performance of the 12" scoops that were my first steps into the world of Sound System and I can now say with the benefit of hindsight and experience that those boxes were inefficient rubbish and I had no idea what a proper speaker box was capable of at that time.

I would be very interested in knowing if someone has actually heard multiple paraflex boxes loaded with different drivers and driven off different front ends and particularly if they have had a chance to hear them in the same space as another sound system. A good example of this would have been Sinai & Channel One at the Steel Yard back in December or Sinai & Iration in Leeds where they put the 21" paraflex up against the Iration double 21" subs which I believe are a Bandpass design. We all know that Huw/Sinai is a clever bloke and uses technology to get the absolute maximum he can out of his boxes but are they really miles ahead of every other type of box out there? Did Sinai thrash Iration on bottom end with half the number of sub drivers? Only someone who was present can say but somehow I don't think that is what happened at that dance.

If you take the best of the best drivers and put mountains of power up them by using the biggest amps available with the most advanced limiting that exists then they should be very very impressive, that is the whole point of using the absolute best of the best gear.

I would love to have the opportunity to hear some paraflex boxes but no-one around me has managed to build one that works. The only guy I know who has built one (a small 15" box, I think designed for kick, I do not know the exact plan he used) had his driver fail within 10 mins of turning it on. The cone/surround ripped from too much pressure on the driver but it was an old driver (around 20 years old) and probably not played with a suitable highpass filter so not unsurprising.

I regards to the OP the best way to decide on what sort of box to build is to go out and listen to as many different types of boxes as you possibly can. I must have heard 30 different sub designs before I decided on what I was going to build and what I wanted from my sound may not be what they want from their sound. As always sound is subjective and opinion often accounts for far more than raw undisputed scientific data. Personally I would never spend the amount of money that it costs to build a decent box on something that I hadn't already heard with my own ears as the worry about it not performing to spec would be too great for me to risk.

Finally can we stick to people reporting real world events that they were present at. If you are not present at an event where boxes are compared then do not make statements about what happened as 2nd hand information presented as being accurate is no use to anyone and creates false ideas of a design (be that positive or negative). This happened heaps with the scoop shootouts that I went to over 10 years ago when people who were not there tried to imply that one design was way louder than another even though the SPL measurements for all boxes were within 1dB of each other. Yes, there were variations in tone between the boxes but for raw SPL they all put out essentially the same level which was not surprising given that all the boxes had the same driver and were being driven off the same amp to the same clip point.