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Old Croc
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Joined: 03 April 2006
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Points: 1552 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote login4 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 January 2012 at 7:53pm
i think it would be unfair to compare the two in the configuration at st. pauls as the usb 2's were stacked each side and slightly behind the the punishers (due to staging postitioning)  , so effectively the punishers were sat in the power ally.

also there was a serous lack of real power from the venue.
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Points: 2716 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Timebomb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 January 2012 at 10:31pm
Id expect the USB2 to have better sensitivity in smaller stacks, and the punisher to be better in larger stacks, USB2 will likely run into mechanical compression long before the punisher, especially with that RCF driver, 5mm overhang IIRC? And thus distortion should be higher.  Would be interesting to do a side be side test, ive got access to some Funktion 118s i will have a go in the summer,  from experience with them i think the punisher sounds a lot better though. You cant beat a proper horn imo...
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Young Croc
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Points: 526 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote inter-sound Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 January 2012 at 11:26pm
Originally posted by toastyghost toastyghost wrote:

Perhaps I'm just a bit oldskool but I'd say not having them both firing into the same space, with a lot of concrete and walls, and a load of Stasys X just a few metres away would have been a more accurate test, even without your inebriation tampering with the results.

Remember, the plural of 'anecdote' is not 'data'.


next time all the conditions are absolutely perfect, which is all the time when comparing systems in a linkup i will make sure i have a straight head on, perhaps i should have phrased my opinion differently, "on the day i thought the 8 punishers outperformed the 12 usb2s but this could be down to preferance or the surrounding environment" maybe one day ther will be an event wher the systems are facing oposite directions in a open field    
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Points: 2716 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Timebomb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 February 2012 at 12:45am
You really need to have both systems setup in a big open space and switch between them, playing both at the same time will cause destructive interference.
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Young Croc
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Points: 526 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote inter-sound Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 February 2012 at 1:17am
Tht would be ideal, do such wonderfull things take place? A true sound battle. Ther are alot of systems i would like to hear against one another, also some diy bass cabs against the big brands out ther..
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Points: 10919 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote toastyghost Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 February 2012 at 5:06am
Originally posted by inter-sound inter-sound wrote:

Originally posted by toastyghost toastyghost wrote:

Perhaps I'm just a bit oldskool but I'd say not having them both firing into the same space, with a lot of concrete and walls, and a load of Stasys X just a few metres away would have been a more accurate test, even without your inebriation tampering with the results.

Remember, the plural of 'anecdote' is not 'data'.


next time all the conditions are absolutely perfect, which is all the time when comparing systems in a linkup i will make sure i have a straight head on, perhaps i should have phrased my opinion differently, "on the day i thought the 8 punishers outperformed the 12 usb2s but this could be down to preferance or the surrounding environment" maybe one day ther will be an event wher the systems are facing oposite directions in a open field    


Well done, you grasped my very obvious point.
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Originally posted by inter-sound inter-sound wrote:

Originally posted by toastyghost toastyghost wrote:

Perhaps I'm just a bit oldskool but I'd say not having them both firing into the same space, with a lot of concrete and walls, and a load of Stasys X just a few metres away would have been a more accurate test, even without your inebriation tampering with the results.

Remember, the plural of 'anecdote' is not 'data'.


next time all the conditions are absolutely perfect, which is all the time when comparing systems in a linkup i will make sure i have a straight head on, perhaps i should have phrased my opinion differently, "on the day i thought the 8 punishers outperformed the 12 usb2s but this could be down to preferance or the surrounding environment" maybe one day ther will be an event wher the systems are facing oposite directions in a open field    


The USB2s were getting 500 watts each at st pauls. The Punishers were 2 a side off an inf8 mk1.

@ time bomb - I'm not sure about your comments on mechanical compression. The design of the horn will have a direct effect on cone excursion. I presume you have not simulated or tested the USB2 so are unable to quantify any speculation.

The RCF loaded cabinet has very well defined upper bass range. The punisher simply has not. Cetainly above 90Hz. 140Hz your dreaming.

I'll await Davey Ts response as the creator. We did A/B them against F1 218s.

Tom


Edited by tomschute - 01 February 2012 at 8:36am
Out to lunch... stableaudio@hotmail.co.uk
www.stableaudio.co.uk
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Points: 1428 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote davey t Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 February 2012 at 10:12am
You'd have to listen to a cab design a lot to get a proper comparison. All i can say is that every time I've heard punishers they've been painful and uncomfortable to listen to. Loud - yes, but too much upper bass. Again, this depends upon how they are run and what xover points were used. 

We used our 8 RCF loaded USB2s at a warehouse "club night" a while back. Driven by 3 channels of INF8. Suffice to say, they were the loudest stack in the room vs 4xlabs, 4xstasysx, 4xthunderidge etc.. and the loudest stack for its size I've ever heard. Did sub very well but not quite the low end of the labs I know and love. Very powerful. 

Also had 6 out a while before that which held its own against 4 labs. As with all these comparisons the other stack may not have been run as well. 

I think a lot of the output is to do with the RCF drivers, they are very very good and would sound amazing in many cabs or reflex, properly powered like they were. They sound very different to the USB2s Tom had at carnival. 

Thumbs up for the Inf8. I've not had a chance to use them much before but they do push the drivers well.... when they're not broken. 

finally, vs the F218 I would expect the USB2 to sound pretty much the same with the same driver in both and more powerful but not as "tight" with the RCF driver. Does this make sense? The qts value has a lot of effect upon the sound in bandpass horns. 



They're all good cabs and will all perform roughly the same used and driven properly. If I had to choose I would go for USB2 with RCF driver because you can push them that much harder and don't have to worry so much about blown drivers.

there are my thoughts :) 
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Young Croc
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Points: 526 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote inter-sound Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 February 2012 at 11:29am
Originally posted by toastyghost toastyghost wrote:

Originally posted by inter-sound inter-sound wrote:

Originally posted by toastyghost toastyghost wrote:

Perhaps I'm just a bit oldskool but I'd say not having them both firing into the same space, with a lot of concrete and walls, and a load of Stasys X just a few metres away would have been a more accurate test, even without your inebriation tampering with the results.

Remember, the plural of 'anecdote' is not 'data'.


next time all the conditions are absolutely perfect, which is all the time when comparing systems in a linkup i will make sure i have a straight head on, perhaps i should have phrased my opinion differently, "on the day i thought the 8 punishers outperformed the 12 usb2s but this could be down to preferance or the surrounding environment"
maybe one day ther will be an event wher the systems are facing oposite directions in a open field    


but you failed to grasp myne

Well done, you grasped my very obvious point.
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Points: 15 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GRIDLOCK Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 February 2012 at 6:22pm
hi davey, me and a friend had 2 usb2s from you a while back and have lost are proof of ownership. i have spoke with stableaudio to see if they can issue one but they could only issue YOU with one,  as YOU made the transaction with them. im writing to ask if you could get this from them, and make one up for us, for the transaction we made with you. would it be ok to have a number for you so i can explain this a little better :)  please get in touch soon as this is a matter of... 
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Originally posted by davey t davey t wrote:

You'd have to listen to a cab design a lot to get a proper comparison. All i can say is that every time I've heard punishers they've been painful and uncomfortable to listen to. Loud - yes, but too much upper bass. Again, this depends upon how they are run and what xover points were used. 

We used our 8 RCF loaded USB2s at a warehouse "club night" a while back. Driven by 3 channels of INF8. Suffice to say, they were the loudest stack in the room vs 4xlabs, 4xstasysx, 4xthunderidge etc.. and the loudest stack for its size I've ever heard. Did sub very well but not quite the low end of the labs I know and love. Very powerful. 

Also had 6 out a while before that which held its own against 4 labs. As with all these comparisons the other stack may not have been run as well. 

I think a lot of the output is to do with the RCF drivers, they are very very good and would sound amazing in many cabs or reflex, properly powered like they were. They sound very different to the USB2s Tom had at carnival. 

Thumbs up for the Inf8. I've not had a chance to use them much before but they do push the drivers well.... when they're not broken. 

finally, vs the F218 I would expect the USB2 to sound pretty much the same with the same driver in both and more powerful but not as "tight" with the RCF driver. Does this make sense? The qts value has a lot of effect upon the sound in bandpass horns. 



They're all good cabs and will all perform roughly the same used and driven properly. If I had to choose I would go for USB2 with RCF driver because you can push them that much harder and don't have to worry so much about blown drivers.





I agree, we took 6x usb2 subs outside linked up with 4x labs and 2x usb1 subs, the usb2's sounded alot better in the low end and higher frequencies (please note the labs may of been set up incorrectly) it was surprizing how loud and how clean the usb2's were, i had a listen to Toms at bristol carnival and can not relate between the two as the sound was very different, maybe this was because of settings or perhaps different drivers might be the case.

Second outing we decided to take all 8 subs and my gosh did that put some of the rigs to shame, i managed to borrow two infinite 8 amplifiers, although one of them had a channel down i think it was still a fair amount of power to play with.

I agree the combination of a well built cab with a slightly larger volume with this state of the art RCF driver makes a good combination, i have heard and played with punishers many times and usb2's are much more pronounced and full sounding.

I would love to play with the RCF driver with different designs as it's an awesome piece of kit.

Wow tablets are hard work maybe i will get the keyboard.

there are my thoughts :) 






Edited by Limited - 04 February 2012 at 3:39pm
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Points: 1428 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote davey t Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 February 2012 at 5:41pm
Originally posted by GRIDLOCK GRIDLOCK wrote:

hi davey, me and a friend had 2 usb2s from you a while back and have lost are proof of ownership. i have spoke with stableaudio to see if they can issue one but they could only issue YOU with one,  as YOU made the transaction with them. im writing to ask if you could get this from them, and make one up for us, for the transaction we made with you. would it be ok to have a number for you so i can explain this a little better :)  please get in touch soon as this is a matter of... 
RIG OR NO RIG.  I.E POLICE.               
thanks
07547595606... Edd


U sure u don't mean usb1? I never sold any one a usb2
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