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inside BEHRINGER DDM4000, 32bit Digi Mixer(update)

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nineleaves View Drop Down
Young Croc
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote nineleaves Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 January 2009 at 6:50pm
i like berry, tho like many i also recognise that they've more than taken libertys over 'cloning' other manifs products in the past & that quality control / build can be iffy from time to time.

i however do applaud them muchly so when they pull their thumbs out and come out with something 'original' & of high quality ;) :)
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Young Croc
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote nineleaves Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 January 2009 at 7:13pm
these ddm's are built like a sodding tanks ;)

time will tell on fader reliability ..but can be replaced dead easy with something known :)

there were issues with the djm-600 clone in that the faders were too smooth & free moving to use ! & curves were fixed & wrong according to many. also the effects didnt allow a sufficent level to be applied for some folks tastes. various things. 

Edited by nineleaves - 25 January 2009 at 7:14pm
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Young Croc
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote nineleaves Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 February 2009 at 9:18pm
Hi again,
finally had the time to run some diagnostics on this little unit to determine how far it can be pushed signal wise & heres the results gleaned with passable, but less than optimal equipment.
when discounting what anomalous distortion the measuring equipment adds to the data, id have to say this mixer certainly should perform pretty much to its spec sheet breakdown :)

the behringer blampf:

AUDIO INPUTS
Mic 1/2 (XLR, electronically balanced)
Max. input level            -14 dBu
Input impedance             2 kΩ
Phono (RCA)
Max. input level            -18 dBu
Input impedance             47 kΩ
Line (RCA)
Max. input level            +30 dBu
Input impedance             15 kΩ

AUDIO OUTPUTS
OUT A (XLR, balanced)
Max. output level           +21 dBu
Output impedance            200 Ω
OUT A / OUT B / TAPE (RCA)
Max. output level           +21 dBu
Output impedance            100 Ω
Phones Out                   max. 260 mW @ 100 Ω / 1 % THD
S/PDIF                       (coaxial, 16 bit, 44.1 kHz)

EQUALIZER
Stereo Low                  -? dB/+12 dB
Stereo Mid                  -? dB/+12 dB
Stereo High                 -? dB/+12 dB
Mic Low                     -12 dB/+12 dB, Shelving
Mic Mid                     -12 dB/+12 dB, Peak
Mic High                    -12 dB/+12 dB, Shelving

DIGITAL EFFECTS PROCESSOR
DSP                         2x Analog Devices Black Fin
AD/DA converter             24-bit Sigma-Delta/128-times
                              oversampling/Cirrus
Sampling rate               44.1 kHz
LCD display                 320 x 40 pixel
MIDI interface               5-pin DIN jacks In/Out/Thru

SYSTEM SPECIFICATIONS
Frequency response
Mic                         25 Hz – 20 kHz, +0/-3 dB
Phono                       20 Hz – 20 kHz, +0/-3 dB
Line                        20 Hz – 20 kHz, +0/-3 dB
Signal-to-noise ratio
Mic                         > 87 dB
Phono                       > 83 dB
Line                        > 102 dB
Distortion (THD)            < 0,009 % (Line – OUT A)
Crosstalk                   < -80 dB / 1 kHz (Line)

POWER SUPPLY
Mains voltage / fuse
100 – 240 V~, 50/60 Hz      T 1 A H 250 V
Power consumption            max. 20 W
Mains connector              standard IEC receptacle

DIMENSIONS/WEIGHT
Dimensions (H x W x D)      approx. 4 1/3" x 12 3/5" x 15 1/2" (110 mm x 320 mm x 392 mm)
Weight                      approx. 9.3 lbs. (4.2 kg)

MY Blamf:

the simple, general rule of thumb gleaned from the bench testing below:

* keep input signals on or below the yellow 0db mark to maximise resolution/quality of incoming signal, whilst allowing sufficent internal overhead to prevent effects and eqs clipping.

* keep output below +8db for cleanest sound, try setting the gain of your pa to match this (with limiting applyed beyond this).
* definately do not exceed 12db if you want your sound to remain clean.
* itll sound crap & youll probably break things attached to this, if you push it waay into the clip region ;)


The full breakdown:
NOTE: measured with ARTA & Saffire le soundcard, performance of unit may well be higher on accounts of distortion & noise floor.. as the figures quoted will include what marginal hash it generates too.
disregard the 156hz peak, this seems to have nothing to do with the mixer.

Also noise & 1k sine sources used as an arbatary standard of sorts for these tests, no notable increase/decrease in distortion was noted with changing frequencys.


dig out:
* noise floor - -105db 100hz, 4.1k, -110db 20k, -83.5db
* 1.15v pulse train, well defined edges.

Line IN (ch1):
line modes:
* full gain without raised output noise floor.
* With max gain - +14dbu/(-12dbfs)/1.81v (at 1k) without clipping.
   (shows +9 clipping on ddm)
* gain trim range - 40db
* freq resp appears to be ruler flat

phono mode:
* max gain noise floor - -75db 100hz, -94db 7k, -85db 20k

output a:
* +21 dbu before distortion.
* +8db on ddm meter (11v) cleanest sound setting. - (THD 0.011%, 21 dbu)
* +12db on ddm meter (14.5v) max 'clean' setting. - (THD 0.028%, 23.5 dbu)
* clip starts to flicker on ddm meter (23v). - (THD 0.83%, 27.5 dbu)   
* beyond clip on ddm (27v) power rail limit. - (THD 1.63%, 29 dbu)
* 27v peak, for 11v out (knob at 12 o clock) before marginal distortion rise.
* opamp lower power rail seems to collapse before upper.
* any output level, neglegible noise floor does not rise.
* scope measured hf noise, mostly out of audio band: 22mv/rms aprox, 45mv peak.

output b:
* +21 dbu before distortion.
* same breakdown as above.
* any output level, neglegible noise floor does not rise.
* scope measured hf noise, mostly out of audio band:
1500 NS cycle semi random sine noise (666.66KHZ)
115mv rms, 190mv peak

tape output:
as with b, but gain fixed to 1:1.

headphones:
15.5v out - clean output (+20.5dbu, thd 0.025)
18.5v clip limit (+25.5dbu, thd 0.11)
(no load)



Digital out, idle all inputs set to minimum level.


Phono in mode, with gain set to maximum.


Standard eq settings, low and high set to max gain.


Standard eq settings, mid set to max gain.


Standard eq settings, low and high set to min gain.
interestingly, the cuts slope rather than shelf as with gain.
after a little thought i concluded this is probably a better idea ;)


Standard eq settings, mid set to min gain.
around about -70db dip.


output a, at 11.5v.


output a, at 14.5v.


output a, at 23v.


output a, at 27v. rail limit.


headphone out 15.5v (no load)


headphone out 18.5v (no load)

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ceharden View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ceharden Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 February 2009 at 9:38pm
They do seem to have missed off the digital inputs though.  I like being able to connect CDJ's to DJM800's using SPDIF and thus avoiding the chance of the inputs being overdriven.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote nineleaves Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 February 2009 at 9:41pm
yeah, that is quite annoying, its a whole other chip to jam in there to add that tho.
frankly id like to see stacks of digital ins on all digi mixers.. tho the buggers (the whole industry) hasnt exactly embraced the sensible concept of avoiding multiple (a>d)>(d>a) processes.

there is a simple rule of thumb to keep it out of clip mode garanteed, dont push the level on the ins beyond 0db and you wont overload the desk period, eq boosts included :)

read back over this for the gain structure :)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tekasis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 May 2010 at 1:42am
Originally posted by wafflesomd wafflesomd wrote:

Awesome piece of kit.
 
the image
 
 
Had one of these briefly demo'd to me recently & from what I heard & saw, I agree too!
 
Anyone else tried them yet?
 
 
Originally posted by jbl_man jbl_man wrote:

Nice thread Nineleaves,well done.
Originally posted by norty303 norty303 wrote:

Excellent review
 
Clap
 


Edited by Tekasis - 14 May 2010 at 11:11pm
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paulus View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote paulus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 May 2010 at 10:24am
my only experiance was with the first one they did in light grey, pioneer copy,swapped the old djm 500 for the beri,changed no settings on x over and it did sound like some one had put a damp flannal over the compression driversConfusedbut seems like this one is a big improvment
 
TRENDSETTER SOUND SYSTEM
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nineleaves View Drop Down
Young Croc
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote nineleaves Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 May 2010 at 12:27pm


ah, yes.. thatll be the djx-700 ..everything about that one was -awful- ..really badly thought through.
Can assure you the ddm 4000 is a different kettle of fish.
Its pretty typical of behringer really, they make a handful of really good products, afew exceptional ones ..and then when they make lemons ..they dont half !


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AndyWave Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 May 2010 at 8:19am
Thanks for useful bits of information.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Beatdaddy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 May 2011 at 9:43pm
I'm thinking about getting one for gigs, anymore updates on reliability?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote starstruck Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 May 2011 at 10:06pm
Ive been DJing with one since they first came out. Zero problems, build qualitys great, sound quality is great, and tons of great features. I swear by it.
 
Ive had several 'Pioneer' only guys say they loved it .
 
Im even thinking about buying a second one to cover a bunch of hires Ive got coming up.
 
Kev
www.giantwii.co.uk - well somebodies got to do it :o)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Beatdaddy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 May 2011 at 10:27pm
Cool then!
I'll pick one up.
Been using a Djm 400 for our gigs , but need more channels.
Looks nice next to the pioneer cdj's :)
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