Best way to fold a horn??... |
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James.L
Registered User Joined: 21 January 2009 Status: Offline Points: 20 |
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Posted: 26 February 2009 at 4:35pm |
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I've simulated a horn expansion in hornresp, and I'm now trying to draw the horn in Google Sketchup. I have a problem where
the horn bends, it is adding extra length to my horn, length that would be destructive to the final frequency response in relation to my simulation. So I guess my question is, what is the most accurate way to fold a horn? Here's an image of my design.. As you can see from the print screen, the first fold has added 18.1cm to my horn. This is because i rotated the horn by 90degrees from the inside edge of the horn. Google Sketchup tips and tricks would be appreciated. Thanks in advance, Jim. Edited by James.L - 26 February 2009 at 4:43pm |
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doober
Young Croc Joined: 03 January 2006 Location: Cornwall UK Status: Offline Points: 1118 |
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You need to fold around the mid point of the horn's cross section. I don't know how to do it with sketchup, but here's a good explaination of how to do it with autocad, and the principles involved.
http://www.centauriaudio.com.au/diy/hornfold.html Kieran |
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gwarntek
Registered User Joined: 17 November 2008 Location: South East UK Status: Offline Points: 766 |
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Into quarters haha sorry thats not very helpful i dont quite understand your question? the path of folding is inevitable, and i don't see a problem with going round 90 degrees. So if this i gonna happen you just need to reduce the horn length by the deisred amount? maybe make the cab a bit smaller (on your prntscreen from top to bottom) so depth in real life? just an idea though, im no expert... peace
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James.L
Registered User Joined: 21 January 2009 Status: Offline Points: 20 |
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Yeah i probably should've mentioned that I read that several times, and also the stuff on this forum about calculating the area before and after the bend (in the guide to hornresp and winisd topic), but I'm really aiming for sketchup level kinda stuff. I dont know autocad and im time restricted so learning it isnt feasable at the moment.
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James.L
Registered User Joined: 21 January 2009 Status: Offline Points: 20 |
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Hmm, by reducing the length from the throat end I would have to recalculate the horn expansion because the area of the throat and mouth obviously needs to be the same. Also by following this method that I have done each corner is going to be a section of straight horn with no expansion ie. the corner (horn fold 1) is going to have 18.1cm of straight horn. Its kinda hard to explain but im trying my best lol. |
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Deadbeat
Old Croc Joined: 12 March 2008 Location: Singularity Status: Offline Points: 3167 |
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'it is adding extra length to my horn, length that would be destructive to the final frequency response in relation
to my simulation.' In what way? PS See Mykey's scoops' for an example of how to go round corners.
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Away on extended leave.
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James.L
Registered User Joined: 21 January 2009 Status: Offline Points: 20 |
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I just presumed it would, especially at the thinner end. I'll remodel it in hornresp and see what happens.
Could you provide a link to Mykey's scoops please Deadbeat? Thanks for the responses so far, I really appreciate it. Jim. |
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Deadbeat
Old Croc Joined: 12 March 2008 Location: Singularity Status: Offline Points: 3167 |
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Folding a horn will increase LF response slightly at the cost of HF response.
No program I know (maybe FEA a bit) can really accurately model the effects of folds. However for a bass horn there is really no point in remodeling as the effects of a tiny bit longer horn will be negligible.
Mykey's scoops are the 'BULL', 'BULL-X', 'COW', and 'RHINO' in the 'scoop' section of this forum. When you fold, just try to keep the area expanding. |
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Away on extended leave.
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Dave Slater
Registered User Joined: 28 February 2004 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 373 |
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If you can snag yourself a copy of AutoCAD this really is the proper job
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tb_mike
Old Croc Joined: 01 October 2004 Location: New Zealand Status: Offline Points: 2744 |
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I didnt have autocad and refused to 'obtain it'. So i used qcad 1.5 and just did multiple iterations and learned how long to make each section just by doing it and learning how much path could fit and how it compared to the model.
I wouldnt worry about small 5% errors etc. According to Tom Danley the path length is actually not quite in the middle as the air mass affects it. But he mentions that approximating your exponential horn as a few conical steps makes no difference in the bass region-which makes things ALOT easier. http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread/t-80068.html Nice horns! Edited by tb_mike - 27 February 2009 at 9:24am |
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Centauri
Old Croc Joined: 29 November 2004 Location: Newcastle Aus Status: Offline Points: 1792 |
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As doober pointed out above, and outlined in my article he linked to, don't rotate from the inside edge - rotate about the centre line of the horn path. |
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James.L
Registered User Joined: 21 January 2009 Status: Offline Points: 20 |
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Hi all,
I'm now folding from the center path of my horn expansion, but I have a question, in sketchup how do i create a non-perfect curve. Like if I use the curve tool and drag it out it eventually creates a perfect circle, but i want the curve to be oddly shaped so that it matches my horn expansion if that makes sense. Here's a couple of print screens of the fold i've created. Before the fold from the center path: After I've created the fold: Heres a quick edit in photoshop to illustrate what i mean. The blue getting darker represents an increase in horn width from the inside edge, the further toward the horn mouth you get (or corner, since this is a fold): Edited by James.L - 03 March 2009 at 3:37pm |
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