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Baron Greenback View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baron Greenback Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Our new baby
    Posted: 14 April 2011 at 5:54pm
I reckon they look great, and for their intended purpose (seems pretty obvious to me) they look as if they are just what the doctor ordered, that is that they are: light-weight, compact, and capable of reproducing acoustic instruments and vocals with good clarity at a volume level that will be more than ample for thier intended venue placement (pub/wine bar/bistro etc). I think that a setup like this one can lend it's self to a less dominating listening experience which is just what a lot of people are after if they seek a more relaxed vibe!  Good work Tony, I think you are on to a winner there.

Edited by Baron Greenback - 14 April 2011 at 6:01pm
The doctor recons I'm paranoid... well he didn't say it exactly, but I just knew the bastard was thinking it!
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SamV View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SamV Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 April 2011 at 2:55pm
If it's purely for acoustic then I guess it can makes sense I suppose. I just didn't fancy their chances against other band members/instruments.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Steve_B Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 April 2011 at 12:18am

Sam,

If I can comment on your thoughts. These speakers are never going to compete with a conventional large PA, but not every application requires megawatts of power.

Tony and myself have exchanged a number of emails about this type of design since before Christmas. I forget who mentioned it first, but I had been interested because my wife wants a simple system that she can use when I am not about to set the equipment up. She has a friend who uses a Fishman solo performer system and asked if I could make something similar. From my point of view the system needed to amplify an acoustic guitar and vocals and would be used for a solo performer. Tony expressed an interest so one or two ideas were batted back and forth.

A broken leg before Christmas (I was discharged by the hospital last month) and an impending employment tribunal case in the New Year stopped any activity on my part, but Tony pressed ahead and ordered some drive units; so I get the benefit of listening to them before spending any money.

After measuring the speakers we listened to some acoustic material that I had recorded live. We know the 12” sub can pound with the best of them and were interested in how the two speakers integrated over the crossover region. The design has great promise for something so simple, with the ability to increase the number of drive units or stack cabinets if required.

We also discussed some further development ideas but you’ll need to watch this space regarding those. 

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goliath View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote goliath Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 April 2011 at 8:58pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote B.P.Sound Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 April 2011 at 8:27pm
Goliath please call me 07748 655 731 and empty PM's
http://www.londoneventrentals.co.uk/ https://www.facebook.com/LondonEventRentals
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SamV View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SamV Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 April 2011 at 5:48pm
Mmm I dunno Tony, I'm an avid fan of your design and style but 3" still seems wrong to me! Though I'm always open to be proven wrong.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Steve_B Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 April 2011 at 5:16pm

Uncle Steve here, to add a little to what the proud dad has already mentioned.

The set up and measurement that produced the above graph was done very quickly and could, depending on taste and time, be tweaked a little more. The amount of eq applied was minimal, Just three bands used. Two were very gentle with Qs of about 0.4. One to pull down a small lump centred around 2KHz and the other to compensate for a slight roll off below 400Hz. The only narrow bandwidth filter was to tame the peak at 10KHz. With no mics involved the original 10K peak might provide a little zing that some may like, but in live situations I always consider such peaks to be tempting fate re: feedback. For a mainly speech system the natural response could improve intelligibility.

For speed of set up (The cab was fitted with a 20mm threaded stand adapter which I didn’t have handy) the cab was placed on top of step ladders with the sub directly underneath. As such it represents closely a typical sub with pole mount positioning the little cab about 1.2m above the sub (single 12” bms reflex loaded)

The measurement mic was on axis between the two centre drive units. With this set up the phase alignment between the sub and mid/tops was achieved by simply flipping the polarity on the sub. No delay was used. Obviously for absolute phase on the kick the phase could be reversed on the mid/tops not the sub. That’s the thing with phase it is relative. The alignment without recourse to delay means that using a simple analogue crossover would be possible. With more time I would explore a variety of different cross-over slopes, mainly to look at how lower order filters would work with a view to using passive cross-overs. Last night was to give an idea how they worked with the 12” sub and the result was positive.

A quick,” that looks about 45 degrees off axis”, showed a gradual roll off in response above 8KHz.

For small, acoustic, vocal type applications this has potential for the basis of a simple system.
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Tony Wilkes View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tony Wilkes Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 April 2011 at 9:15am
OK new baby had its first day out yesterday to meet his Uncle Steve_B for a play on his Smaart machine, let him ride on top of a tame 12" sub and was really very happy with his progress.

After a few tweaks they managed 40-16000 pretty flat in a very civilised style with a X-over at 200hz.

Gonna work on getting him a brother now and have arranged to have another day out in a pub type environment where his Aunty Lynn is going to sing and play guitar for them and a few of his pissed-up playmates.

This is what he drew when we gave him some crayons, crayons and paper courtesy of Steve_B

No EQ on the Sub by the way.



More later

Tony


Edited by Tony Wilkes - 13 April 2011 at 10:38am
www.forteaudio.eu - BMS - db-Mark Processors - Lexon (SAE)
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Teunos View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Teunos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 April 2011 at 8:59pm
Originally posted by Baron Greenback Baron Greenback wrote:

Originally posted by Teunos Teunos wrote:

measurement mics always need phantom power, i don't think your sound card will be able to supply that to your mic. Cheap fix would be the behringer PS400.

No mate it's all good, the soundcard is an M-Audio FW410 (firewire) and it does have phantom power... Yey... something that I do not have to chuck more money at... I thought the day would never come... but if you would come down and go through the procedure with me at some point I would very much appreciate it, cheers.
Going a little off-topic here, sorry Tony. Nice soundcard, and i'd love to stop for a chat and a listen to help you along, but my location isn't very optimalWink.


Edited by Teunos - 10 April 2011 at 9:00pm
Best regards,
Teun.
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Tony Wilkes View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tony Wilkes Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 April 2011 at 7:20pm
Took longer than expected due to other projects,


www.forteaudio.eu - BMS - db-Mark Processors - Lexon (SAE)
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Baron Greenback View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Baron Greenback Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 March 2011 at 8:09pm
Originally posted by Teunos Teunos wrote:

measurement mics always need phantom power, i don't think your sound card will be able to supply that to your mic. Cheap fix would be the behringer PS400.

No mate it's all good, the soundcard is an M-Audio FW410 (firewire) and it does have phantom power... Yey... something that I do not have to chuck more money at... I thought the day would never come... but if you would come down and go through the procedure with me at some point I would very much appreciate it, cheers.
The doctor recons I'm paranoid... well he didn't say it exactly, but I just knew the bastard was thinking it!
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Ryan94 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ryan94 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 March 2011 at 6:31pm
Cheers for the reply tony, great project, might well have to build a pair in the summer. How much does the 3" driver cost?

Ryan
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