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ARE SCOOP CABS THE BIZ???
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mans1000 View Drop Down
Young Croc
Young Croc


Joined: 14 October 2004
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    Posted: 19 October 2004 at 11:37pm

hi chaps,just built 2 18" super scoopers which sound ok using eminence omega pro drivers.But in need of more weightline!!,I play mainly ragga,dub & r'n'b,I'm going to upgrade to Void 18's(are the 600w or 1000w better for scoops?)  would I be better off with a different type of cab(1850 folded horn?) or should I stick with the scoops?(I will be using 4 scoops a side eventually).

Any help would be great,Thanks.
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volcano View Drop Down
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Points: 106 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote volcano Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 October 2004 at 12:04am

Lick in the voids in the scooper if you play dub and r'n'b (even better with 2 a side)

For ragga (a lot of kick) it's the 1850 who could sound a bit better, but the scoops will sound also ok! (for dub the 1850's are a bit less, becouse they don't go so low, compared with the sooops in a stack)

It's first and for all a personel choice, the scoops play more coloured (in favour of heavey bass) and the 1850's play more neutral and don't go as low (mostly subjectif that is as the scoops boost at 80 Hz)
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mans1000 View Drop Down
Young Croc
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Having grown up listening to sound systems playing scoops(I like the bass they chuck out!),how will the 1850's favour in playing smallish venues,say 200/300 people?Could I use both ?say one stack of each a side?( 1 scoop,1 1850?)
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mans1000 View Drop Down
Young Croc
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Also how will the X1's cope with the type of music I play(I've read they go pretty low but I have'nt heard them)Do they drop more than scoops?
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volcano View Drop Down
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Points: 106 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote volcano Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 October 2004 at 12:18am

No, not a good idea, never use differnet cabs playing the same frequency!! will allways cause problems

If you are playing in smallish venues, the scoops are your choice (or a bandpass or a bass reflex) the 1850 horns are more for lager events. They will project the sound far. In smaller rooms the bass will bounce to and of the walls, causing interfering. also they don't sound good if you are standing near to them(the sound is still compressed).

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volcano View Drop Down
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The X1 goes véry low, but not very high, at 80 Hz they stop playing. So it depents at your tops. For the X1 you need heavy top speakers that can play 80 Hz at least (scoops can play up to 200 Hz, so your tops dont need to be very powerfull). What tops you are using now?
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Elliot Thompson View Drop Down
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Points: 5365 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Elliot Thompson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 October 2004 at 1:17am

Originally posted by mans1000 mans1000 wrote:

Having grown up listening to sound systems playing scoops(I like the bass they chuck out!),how will the 1850's favour in playing smallish venues,say 200/300 people?Could I use both ?say one stack of each a side?( 1 scoop,1 1850?)

If you grew up around Scoops, you know, you need at least 4 boxes to sound decent.

Two boxes is a waste of time. Build more boxes.

Although, I don't favor Scoops, I know they are unbeatable for Reggae Music. I grew up around Scoops as well. Systems using three columns having no less than six scoops in each column.

You need more boxes.

 

 

 
Elliot Thompson
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loophole View Drop Down
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x1 will also sound good with dub/reggae, and they are a lot more compact... but....
if you've already built super scoopers then you may as well stick with them. like others have said, if you are only going to play that kind of music, then superscoops are brilliant. also bear in mind, when people sl*g off scoops theyre usually talking about the old jbl scoop style designs, superscoops really are another league - obviously they still have some phase cancellation problems, but they have proper, long horns, and will go really loud and low.
though as elliot says, you need more. a stack of 6 superscoopers would be a very nice start to a reggae/dub system
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Andrew View Drop Down
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X1 can go another 1/2 octave above 80Hz, it just depends on what you run above it.
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mans1000 View Drop Down
Young Croc
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Originally posted by volcano volcano wrote:

The X1 goes véry low, but not very high, at 80 Hz they stop playing. So it depents at your tops. For the X1 you need heavy top speakers that can play 80 Hz at least (scoops can play up to 200 Hz, so your tops dont need to be very powerfull). What tops you are using now?

For mids I'm using 12" eminence(MT 102 type design(singles)) & for tops RCF compression drivers.Using a behringer X-over.The sound is still not as clear as I would like it to be.No problems with the bass as I'm only running 2 18" omega pro's(scoops) off a Audiohead AH24000 amp.Although the X-over is very versatile do I need to upgrade to something a little better?Going to upgrade to Void-1000 very soon but I don't want the system to sound too bass heavy as I play a lot of R'n'B,so I need some decent mid & tops that can match the Voids.Can anyone recommend anything(make /design) to balance things out that won't cost an arm & a leg?(I don't mind building some mids/tops as I had great fun making the scoops which Rumble even with the eminence drivers!!)What is a good amp to run mids/tops on(say 2 mids & tops a side)?

thanks
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mans1000 View Drop Down
Young Croc
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Originally posted by Elliot Thompson Elliot Thompson wrote:

Originally posted by mans1000 mans1000 wrote:

Having grown up listening to sound systems playing scoops(I like the bass they chuck out!),how will the 1850's favour in playing smallish venues,say 200/300 people?Could I use both ?say one stack of each a side?( 1 scoop,1 1850?)

If you grew up around Scoops, you know, you need at least 4 boxes to sound decent.

Two boxes is a waste of time. Build more boxes.

Although, I don't favor Scoops, I know they are unbeatable for

Reggae Music. I grew up around Scoops as well. Systems using three columns having no less than six scoops in each column.

You need more boxes.

More on the way,just testing the water to see how the first couple sounded(damn good!!)Can't wait to chuck in the Void-1000!!

 

 
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tb_mike View Drop Down
Old Croc
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Points: 2744 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tb_mike Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 October 2004 at 3:00am

Fact 1 :Scoops are nonlinear by design of being hornloaded on only one side of the cone.

Fact 2: Front loaded horns with rear sealed chambers are more linear.

Fact 3: We are used to nonlinear distortions being present in music-and because scoops were used in the past for these music types-it may not sound right if we use a more linear sub which doesnt add these distortions to make it sound warm.

Rog has commented on this elsewhere too-warm vs hard sound.

http://www.volvotreter.de/dl-section.htm 

"dinsdale horn design pt1/2p"

 

Cheers!

 

 
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