Psytrance music with scoops? |
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fat_brstd
Old Croc Joined: 23 August 2008 Location: Melbourne, OZ Status: Offline Points: 2126 |
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Pray do tell, how do you run them "properly"? |
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Tonskulus
Registered User Joined: 15 September 2017 Location: Finland Status: Offline Points: 425 |
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+1, how? Is there some magic or what.. I run mine from >1kW of class AB amplifiers, just to make sure there is enough control from amp side. However, drivers could be better (RCF LF18X400's) but they do ok. Crossed HP 30-35Hz LP 80-90Hz, 24db/oct. Some EQ added if needed. |
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toastyghost
The 10,000 Points Club Joined: 09 January 2007 Location: Manchester Status: Offline Points: 10919 |
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Because of the group delay curve kind of going the opposite way to other types of subs, a lot of the time the settings are not developed enough to make the most of the output, particularly in the upper region. Some careful measurements and application of EQ can minimise some ringing effects that can make people think they aren’t good at ‘kick’ when in fact they’re a lot better than a reflex in that region. Likewise for LPF type, slope, and most importantly, alignment.
You need to look at the acoustical data not just the electronic, essentially. Too many designs are only ever simulated, built and thrown into use without finishing the job. That last bit of effort can make the difference between a good box and a great one. What do you think the big boys do even with a reflex? Try measuring the DSP amp output data for a popular touring box sometime. Same goes for everything really, but in the past three years of LOTS of work with tapped horns as well as other types of sub, when run right they offer the tonal detail that a psytrance producer wants to be felt in their rolling chugga dugga thanks to low distortion and great cone control whilst still having some slam to the kick. What you do then still need is a metric truckload of 90-200 headroom to keep the dynamics of the snap of said kickdrun and that’s where a lot of the rigs in that market struggle too. It’s one of the reasons why F1 gets a lot of love, because if there’s anything a BPH does more than anything else, it’s that region |
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king david
Young Croc Joined: 17 January 2007 Location: italy Status: Offline Points: 1324 |
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did some psytrance events in the last 5 years, always with hogs and es18 and to be a diy system, producers and djs loved it
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toastyghost
The 10,000 Points Club Joined: 09 January 2007 Location: Manchester Status: Offline Points: 10919 |
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I wasn’t having a pop at DIY as a whole, there are some great boxes out there but in principle many of them are not a finished product per se. Hogs and ES18 benefits from the sheer number of systems that have used them and the BPH side of things being a known quantity by this point what with being over 30 years old - the fact they don’t do proper sub also lends themselves well to a sub that doesn’t do upper bass so well. But trust me, the difference you can achieve when they’re properly aligned and filtered is night and day, and it isn’t as simple as putting an LR24 on both cabs at day 70Hz. |
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king david
Young Croc Joined: 17 January 2007 Location: italy Status: Offline Points: 1324 |
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right!
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Jay michali
Registered User Joined: 10 January 2019 Status: Offline Points: 26 |
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Great read guys, Lots of good info in here. I’m replacing a reflex RCF system I’ve owned for a decade with something that really needs to get the psytrance sound right. I’ve only ever heard turbo sound and funktion1 systems get it right but they are hard to find and seriously expensive here in Canada. Looking for my next best bet. leaning towards some th-18 tapped horn subs under some es18’s. Toastyghost your comments on the tapped horn thing really caught my attention. Do you think I’m on the right path here? We don’t get a great variety of systems over here so I haven’t heard enough to make an educated decision. A secondary goal would be to sound decent for bass tunes as well, but primarily for psytrance.
Any thoughts?
Edited by Jay michali - 19 January 2019 at 5:19am |
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Tonskulus
Registered User Joined: 15 September 2017 Location: Finland Status: Offline Points: 425 |
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I think I'm keeping my hogs as main subs - for psytrance etc. They give proper, punchy sub-bass with brutal authority and something special which I like. Very good "throw" compared to reflex.
Well, have to find some better drivers tho (currently RCF LF18X400, nice warm sound but lacks some lowest notes/losing control - too high VAS / low BL for small chamber?).
ES18bph's will be my choice for kicks. Properly adjusted / tuned, hog + es combo really does good job for almost any music genre. 2 x HOG is amazing, so much bass from just two 18's.. 4 x HOG is mad. 8 x HOG is ridiculously insane. Edited by Tonskulus - 20 January 2019 at 7:47pm |
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