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Reverb in large hall

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munkey View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote munkey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 June 2017 at 8:29pm
Thanks for all the great advice. Will be making tilt boards and looking at putting stacks in all four corners. If it was my venue or we were doing every weekend, I would def sort out drapes
the midtops!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote _djk_ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 June 2017 at 11:59pm
"I have found using multiple full-range tops at different locations (Four Columns Minimum) will greatly reduce the reverberation while not losing a lot of SPL."

I find the exact opposite to be true, only one sound source improves intelligibility.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PatM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 June 2017 at 2:03am
Got to agree fabric is the way forwards. My suggestion is to use some exhibition carpet dropped down the back wall. The weight of it will be very effective, but a nightmare to rig. If there are girders somewhere handy it'll be easy, otherwise you'll need some scaff.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote shagnasty Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 June 2017 at 2:13am
I don't want to state the obvious but the guy is doing one night a week, turning up with a 7.5 tonner of sh1t carpet and slapping it about the place will do 3 things:-

i) Bust his budget
ii) cause a HUGE fire hazzard, my experience of exhibition carpet is it isn't too well fire doped, in free air it would burn like petrol.
iii) cause 1 night a week to become zero after his first 12 hour in 8 hours out epic balls up.

In real terms without budget for truss, lodestars, quad thickness wool surge and crew to make that happen, any acoustic treatment is a non-starter for a one nighter, I used to rig drape for a rave in Crystal palace (after the guy that though he could rig f--ked the ceiling) and that little project cost £1800 20 years ago, so i think that my just be a bad idea.

Re-pointing/positioning stacks, SPL management are all free and free is about the budget for live night in my experience.





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Simon FTF View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Simon FTF Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 June 2017 at 11:23am
I have tackled this issue before by using multiple sources as mentioned.

You can decode to them as stereo pairs if you want, I used a first order ambisonic decoder with a pan pot encoder for a little control, then used precedence to bring the image back to the front. in this instance there were four stacks of Mid top/ sub.  Bass was mono but each stack slightly phase shifted.

Anything you can do to increase the direct sound will improve intelligibility and sound quality, an easy way of doing that is by reducing the critical distance; an easy way of doing that is simply reducing the distance from anywhere in the crowd area to a speaker = more speakers.

If you have time, more advanced processing such as difference channels / hafler circuits can be used to good effect, and these are not so difficult to make either with dsp or opp amps.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote matty w Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 June 2017 at 6:01pm
When I setup in a large wharehouse I struggle like ha
So many things messing up your sound ,not to mention corrugated steal roof pannels ratteling like mad !

Definitely agree your pissing against the wind with drapes for a one night a week gig with limited budget !

Speaker placement is everything , u can either bring the rig into the middle well away from the walls , that works to a degree or and use delay stacks !

Get your tops up high and angle down !

Use multiple tops with tight controlled dispersion as low in frequency as possible , so u can direct the sound

Biggest issue is the bass imo , use decent horn bass cabs with a tight sound , if ur bass is already wooly , the warehouse will completely loose the definition in your baseline !

Try one bass cab on a long speaker lead and literaly wheel it about the venue untill u find somewhere that it sounds most inteligable , that's your bass stack location

Getting your bass to align with your tops is your biggest task ,might Evan be better off putting the subs in corner tbf , may need more eq but Atleast you havnt got a delayed reflection of your subs coming off the rear wall .

Just experiment , good luck
Black to black , red to red , blue to bits ....

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pasi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 June 2017 at 10:54am
Originally posted by _djk_ _djk_ wrote:

"I have found using multiple full-range tops at different
locations (Four Columns Minimum) will greatly reduce the reverberation while
not losing a lot of SPL."

I find the exact opposite to be true, only one sound source improves intelligibility.


100% agree. Mono has always been the best on reverbing rooms where not much can be done for the acoustics.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 4D Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 June 2017 at 12:06pm
Originally posted by munkey munkey wrote:

A local rock venue is now allowing us to do nights in there. The trouble is that the accoustica are terrible. Its a large space (I dont know the dimensions) and the most beautiful of rigs sounds terrible in there. What are the possible solutions other than hanging heavy drapes all the way round (its huge so not really a financially viable option)? Will corner loading the rig into two stacks, facing opposite corners help much? Would having a stack in all 4 corners help? Any other suggestions?

Many thanks


Find another venue..
DMZ. "The bass was intense. Girls were literally running up to stand next to the subs"
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ceharden Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 June 2017 at 12:29pm
In halls which have no soft surfaces, I have found that draping one end (usually behind the stage) does give some improvement.  If you can remove one reflective surface it will make a difference.  However in most cases I was putting truss up anyway for lighting/starcloths so the extra effort was minimal and was partially done for aesthetics anyway.

Paying attention to the dispersion of your mid-tops and avoiding the walls will help and as already mentioned, angling them down to keep them off the far wall will help too.  That way once you do get punters in, the majority of the sound is directed towards a nice soft, irregular surface rather than the hard reflective walls.

If you do want to do more draping and will be working in the venue regularly then getting some wires installed on the walls so you can just cable tie the drapes up will make it easier.  When I used to work at the University we regularly did live and DJ gigs in the halls.  We used to drape most of the walls with surgewool and it was definitely nicer to mix with the drapes up.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RoadRunnersDust Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 June 2017 at 4:11pm
Originally posted by munkey munkey wrote:

What are the possible solutions other than hanging heavy drapes all the way round (its huge so not...financially viable option)?


Have people forgotten how to read? LOL
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ceharden View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ceharden Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 June 2017 at 6:52pm
Draping is probably one of the cheaper options and you don't need to do the whole room to get some benefit, only remove parallel reflective surfaces, i.e. two sides.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote toastyghost Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 June 2017 at 8:15pm
Yeah to be frank two 30ft x 12ft drapes with pipe and tank traps should cost about £100 to dry hire. Do the side walls nearest the stacks.

Edited by toastyghost - 17 June 2017 at 8:16pm
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