Speakerplans.com Homepage
Forum Home Forum Home > Plans > New Projects Forum
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - Kick/Bass Bin-cabinet for 90-360hz
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login

Kick/Bass Bin-cabinet for 90-360hz

 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <1 456
Author
Message
smitske96 View Drop Down
Young Croc
Young Croc


Joined: 16 February 2016
Location: The Netherlands
Status: Offline
Points: 1085
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote smitske96 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 October 2018 at 7:55am
Originally posted by Keen Keen wrote:

Originally posted by RoadRunnersDust RoadRunnersDust wrote:

The dual 12” of the PM60s are completely gutless in my experience Confused
not surprising, the numbers never added up on the low end of those things

How would you think they add up then? It's designed as a top cabinet only, and clearly states it's not fully hornloaded down to 80 Hz.
Back to Top
RoadRunnersDust View Drop Down
Young Croc
Young Croc
Avatar

Joined: 03 December 2013
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 560
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RoadRunnersDust Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 October 2018 at 11:06am
Originally posted by smitske96 smitske96 wrote:

It's designed as a top cabinet only, and clearly states it's not fully hornloaded down to 80 Hz.

I mean it’s gutless in the band it’s designed to work in!
Back to Top
Jo bg View Drop Down
Young Croc
Young Croc


Joined: 08 March 2017
Status: Offline
Points: 552
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jo bg Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 October 2018 at 11:38am
i think we (intended as most operators on this forum, but with due exceptions) are used to a different sound, with a more prominent bass than most people on psw and soundforums, who usually gather more to rock or other live genres with less bass buildup.
another example is danley sm80, it gets a lot of praises for live but i doubt anyone here would use a 140hz top without a dedicated kick for a heavy dancing night.
so maybe gutless is just too flat, good for faithful reproduction, but doesn't kick like a mule.

maybe i remember wrong, but wasn't element audio using pm60 on the sides on a carnival float this year, but with added kickbin guts, so with a highr cutoff?
if so, anyone can comment on their sound in that enviroment?
Back to Top
RoadRunnersDust View Drop Down
Young Croc
Young Croc
Avatar

Joined: 03 December 2013
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 560
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RoadRunnersDust Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 October 2018 at 11:53am
Good point but my main bag is rock/live and I still think the 12” section of them is entirely useless 😅
Back to Top
bass*en*mass View Drop Down
Old Croc
Old Croc
Avatar

Joined: 03 September 2009
Location: "unknown"
Status: Offline
Points: 4009
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bass*en*mass Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 October 2018 at 7:48pm
care to get into details "RoadRunnersDust"?
Which Setup have you tried, what is it that you missed 100-600hz, do you know of a similar sized option to cover the passband better, more efficiently in the same size?

curious what exactly you mean with "gutless"
Back to Top
RoadRunnersDust View Drop Down
Young Croc
Young Croc
Avatar

Joined: 03 December 2013
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 560
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RoadRunnersDust Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 October 2018 at 1:17am
LOL Sure "bass*en*mass"

Sat on top of a pile of 721s they consistently sounded like they may as well not have been there. No punch or impact in the lower end of their response and for the little you could hear of them as they approached the crossover to the BMS they sounded very boxy and thin. Not made any better with a couple of 215s between them and the 21s.

As far as a different option for covering 100-600, no. It's tricky to compare something that simply doesn't work to an effective solution.

As far as a nominal "upper-bass through to central-mid" bandwidth goes, they'd get absolutely annihilated by a pair of 12" Flood Low-Mids.
Back to Top
toastyghost View Drop Down
The 10,000 Points Club
The 10,000 Points Club
Avatar

Joined: 09 January 2007
Location: Manchester
Status: Offline
Points: 10920
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote toastyghost Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 October 2018 at 1:36am
Sounds like poor alignment of a ported horn LF section with a bandpass horn to me, not very complimentary phase before you add filters for a start.

They’re not gonna kick you in the nads but they’ll have a snap and there’ll be some LF content for warmth. Again, better crossover and alignment helps make that shine.

Edited by toastyghost - 31 October 2018 at 1:37am
Back to Top
RoadRunnersDust View Drop Down
Young Croc
Young Croc
Avatar

Joined: 03 December 2013
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 560
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RoadRunnersDust Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 October 2018 at 2:48am
Fair point, Kyle.

Even on their own with the BMS they just sounded a bit "not-there".

Obviously disparate levels but on a even-tonality contest even an Sx300 would run down to 100Hz more convincingly LOL
Back to Top
Sinai Sound View Drop Down
Young Croc
Young Croc
Avatar

Joined: 09 November 2009
Location: Sheffield
Status: Offline
Points: 631
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sinai Sound Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 October 2018 at 9:03am
As I already had a big pile of 12NDL76 doing nothing, and already am using 4594HE in my boxes I've had a mate build me a PM90

So I can see for myself whether it's actually good or not 
Back to Top
Timebomb View Drop Down
Old Croc
Old Croc
Avatar

Joined: 11 October 2004
Location: Lancaster
Status: Offline
Points: 2716
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Timebomb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 October 2018 at 9:15am
I tried a couple but i never got a ported midbass horn to work and sound nice,  also as Kyle mentions there will be steep phase distortion at the lower end of there pass band which could make alignment quite tricky, i would try very steep 48dB/oct filters so there is as little overlap as possible as the phase response of the turbos and PM60s in that range will be quite different, so best to align them over a narrow band to minimise any destructive interference.  

 
James Secker          facebook.com/soundgearuk
James@soundgear.co.uk               www.soundgear.co.uk
Back to Top
fatfreddiescat View Drop Down
Young Croc
Young Croc
Avatar

Joined: 15 October 2010
Location: N.E.Wales
Status: Offline
Points: 1081
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote fatfreddiescat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 October 2018 at 9:30am
EAW KF850 has 15” horn section that will cover that range, Pete 'Nova' built his equivalent of the 850 with 2 x 12’ s facing each other, similar to the early Martin 215, Pete's approach would probs be worth exploring although he ported his to use as a one box solution but doesn't have to be ported. If you are OK with horn response then it shouldn't be too hard to build a box that will give a second order Butterworth type response  HP roll off at 90Hz that you can tune to  LR4 with a B2 at 90Hz
Back to Top
Futur3boy View Drop Down
New Member
New Member
Avatar

Joined: 18 September 2018
Location: Bristol
Status: Offline
Points: 8
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Futur3boy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 November 2018 at 11:13am
Yes roadrunner they were, and some other copys as well. Going to get some usb2's this weekend then will see what, if anything, I want between them and the sls920's. Only really tested the 920's at home so far, but found they get a bit honky up to 200 when the bass gets driven on the mixer. On the other hand I've read about people using them well with just usb2's so will test it out before getting MORE speakers :)
Might be after some more sls920's if all goes well, if anyone has any they want to part with?
Thanks for any info as well guys, newbie trying to find my way.
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <1 456

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Forum Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 12.06
Copyright ©2001-2023 Web Wiz Ltd.

This page was generated in 0.078 seconds.