Has anyone modeled the punisher with Hornresp

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    S1 - 249 cm2 (accurate)
S2 - 2632 cm2 (accurate)
Exp - 175 Lt (very close.T=1)
Vrc - 30 Lt (25-35 but little change in SPL graph from altering these)
Vtc - 10290 cc3 (very close)

Whatever i changed (except of S1 or S2 which are accurate) SPL graph doesn't flatten out.The 102 db 1W/1M seems real in 2 x Pi environment and occurs around 60Hz.

Edited by DrWoofer.com - 18 August 2007 at 4:03pm

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DrWoofer.com Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Registered User Joined: 08 August 2007 Location: Greece Status: Offline Points: 59	Post Options Post Reply Quote DrWoofer.com Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 18 August 2007 at 4:01pm
	S1 - 249 cm2 (accurate) S2 - 2632 cm2 (accurate) Exp - 175 Lt (very close.T=1) Vrc - 30 Lt (25-35 but little change in SPL graph from altering these) Vtc - 10290 cc3 (very close) Whatever i changed (except of S1 or S2 which are accurate) SPL graph doesn't flatten out.The 102 db 1W/1M seems real in 2 x Pi environment and occurs around 60Hz. Edited by DrWoofer.com - 18 August 2007 at 4:03pm

kpippen Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Registered User Joined: 04 July 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 174	Post Options Post Reply Quote kpippen Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 20 August 2007 at 3:10am
	Hello Dr. Woofer I noticed that you used 2.0 X Pi for your radiation angle... I would recommend 1.0 X Pi if the horn cabinet is on the floor and against the wall...or 0.5 X Pi if it's corner loaded.... Also,...how certain are you of the VTC (volume throat chamber) number that you used?... I could be wrong but it seems a little high to me... Here are some graphs that I came up with: http://www.speakerplans.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=11044... Cheers, Kevin Edited by kpippen - 20 August 2007 at 3:13am
	turn on, tune in, drop out Hey Nipper,...we gotta have more cowbell!!!

DrWoofer.com Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Registered User Joined: 08 August 2007 Location: Greece Status: Offline Points: 59	Post Options Post Reply Quote DrWoofer.com Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 20 August 2007 at 2:54pm
	I have posted a long post describing the volume calculations and when i pressed Post Reply it got deleted.I'm so upset.I won't type it again.Sorry. The Blue area is the Vtc i believe and after calcualting again is 11,245 Lt

Contour Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Young Croc Joined: 03 March 2004 Status: Online Points: 677	Post Options Post Reply Quote Contour Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 20 August 2007 at 6:08pm
	Hello DrWoofer, You could also paint the whole horn blue... More common practice would be to count only the volume directly in front of the woofer as Vtc, where the edge of the cone ends, the horn starts. I also have my own theory on how to handle this question (where starts the horn?) but for now I keep this knowledge to myself because I have never read an explanation like this. But I can give you a clue, what is typical of a horn? What makes it different from a transmission line for example? Make a comparision with a horn with a 'letterbox' thoat. Best regards, Walt Edited by Contour - 20 August 2007 at 6:08pm

DrWoofer.com Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Registered User Joined: 08 August 2007 Location: Greece Status: Offline Points: 59	Post Options Post Reply Quote DrWoofer.com Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 20 August 2007 at 10:48pm
	So according to that you said the Vtc must be the crossectional area of the wood(or wood circle)the cone fires in. So it should be : Vtc=Pi x R^2 x Height=3,14 x 14,8^2 x 1,5=3,14 x 219,04 x 1,5=1,031 Lt The S1 will be then : S1=(50cm-(10,3cm)x2-(1,5cm)x4)x5cm=(50cm-20,6cm-6cm)x5cm=117cm^2 And the horn length is increased by 60cm about. I'm i close to reality???

DrWoofer.com Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Registered User Joined: 08 August 2007 Location: Greece Status: Offline Points: 59	Post Options Post Reply Quote DrWoofer.com Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 20 August 2007 at 11:14pm
	And the simulation goes better this time with a flatter response like this

kpippen Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Registered User Joined: 04 July 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 174	Post Options Post Reply Quote kpippen Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 20 August 2007 at 11:47pm
	Try 1.0 X Pi or 0.5 X Pi and it'll get even better...but still not flat enough in my opinion... Kevin
	turn on, tune in, drop out Hey Nipper,...we gotta have more cowbell!!!

DrWoofer.com Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Registered User Joined: 08 August 2007 Location: Greece Status: Offline Points: 59	Post Options Post Reply Quote DrWoofer.com Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 20 August 2007 at 11:51pm
	Isn't 2 x Pi halfplane as Walt's plans say? It is 102 db in halfplane and that's the value in 2 x Pi simulation. Why to simulate in 1 x Pi or 0,5 x Pi? Edited by DrWoofer.com - 20 August 2007 at 11:51pm

kpippen Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Registered User Joined: 04 July 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 174	Post Options Post Reply Quote kpippen Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 21 August 2007 at 8:07pm
	Hello Dr. Woofer, There is some good reading in the following thread under "Kick-Start Hornresp" that explains the differences of 2.0 X 1.0 X and 0.5 X Pi very well... http://www.speakerplans.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1314 Kevin
	turn on, tune in, drop out Hey Nipper,...we gotta have more cowbell!!!

puffah Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Registered User Joined: 31 December 2006 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 78	Post Options Post Reply Quote puffah Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 26 October 2007 at 9:37am
	has anyone tryed to build a larger punisher with the p audio sd-15, sd-18, sd-21. or the caire 15" instead of the 12??? Are there any drivers in the us besides the lab12 that is cheap. Dealer price is cheap on those the p audios and caire are pretty spendy here in the us. Thanks nate
	vicious bass since 1988

adambomb Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Old Croc Joined: 10 April 2006 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 3220	Post Options Post Reply Quote adambomb Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 26 October 2007 at 2:24pm
	sorta same question twice.. in short drivers in horns like the punisher are more like pistons.. the surface area of the driver matters little compared to Xmax and BL... in this kind of cab.
	www.freespeakerplans.com

Mark James Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Old Croc Joined: 15 January 2006 Location: rig side Status: Offline Points: 5306	Post Options Post Reply Quote Mark James Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 26 October 2007 at 8:29pm
	and the lab12 dont work well inthese cabs, also the ciare dont work in a lab sub either, a look at teh t/s gives us a big hint why...... they are utterly different drivers!!!
	insert silly sentence here