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Heat problems!?

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Crazy Dane View Drop Down
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    Posted: 18 October 2010 at 4:29pm

I an about to build some punishers.

But the dealer i am about to buy drivers from, says that there has been som reportet problems with heat in the punisher.

If i use the 12.00SW speaker in the Version 2 Punisher, will i get problems with speakers overheating?

Ore was that only a problem in the Version 1?
Best regards... Frank
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Mircea Bartic View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mircea Bartic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 October 2010 at 5:17pm
Only the first version cabinet with the second generation drivers suffered from heat issues.
The cause was lack of ventilation to the voice coil because the second generation speaker was deeper.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote toastyghost Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 October 2010 at 6:00pm
Originally posted by Mircea Bartic Mircea Bartic wrote:

Only the first version cabinet with the second generation drivers suffered from heat issues.The cause was lack of ventilation to the voice coil because the second generation speaker was deeper.


Not 100% correct - the v2 cab with current drivers still gets very hot and I've only seen one dead Punisher that wasn't due to overheating the VC.

They can't take 1000w RMS all night long.
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Crazy Dane View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Crazy Dane Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 October 2010 at 6:09pm

That sucks :(

What about if i use the Neodymium driver instead?
Best regards... Frank
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Timebomb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 October 2010 at 6:22pm
Neo wont make much difference, the problem is the small closed rear chamber, it gets hot over long periods of time at high power,  there is no way for the heat to escape and it gets hotter and hotter and cooks the driver. 

I run mine on about 700W each and ive never had a problem, the drivers can take 700W in the punisher, just dont clip the amp. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Timebomb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 October 2010 at 6:24pm
Originally posted by toastyghost toastyghost wrote:

Originally posted by Mircea Bartic Mircea Bartic wrote:

Only the first version cabinet with the second generation drivers suffered from heat issues.The cause was lack of ventilation to the voice coil because the second generation speaker was deeper.


Not 100% correct - the v2 cab with current drivers still gets very hot and I've only seen one dead Punisher that wasn't due to overheating the VC.

They can't take 1000w RMS all night long.


What failed out of interest?  did you get the former to hit the back plate?
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abbotsmike View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote abbotsmike Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 October 2010 at 6:46pm
Aluminium access panel with heatpipes onto the magnet an option?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote toastyghost Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 October 2010 at 7:42pm
Originally posted by Timebomb Timebomb wrote:


Originally posted by toastyghost toastyghost wrote:

Originally posted by Mircea Bartic Mircea Bartic wrote:

Only the first version cabinet with the second generation drivers suffered from heat issues.The cause was lack of ventilation to the voice coil because the second generation speaker was deeper.


Not 100% correct - the v2 cab with current drivers still gets very hot and I've only seen one dead Punisher that wasn't due to overheating the VC.

They can't take 1000w RMS all night long.
What failed out of interest?  did you get the former to hit the back plate?


Ten points to that man! Last time I ever ran them below 42Hz 48dB L-R.

Originally posted by abbotsmike abbotsmike wrote:

Aluminium access panel with heatpipes onto the magnet an option?


The access panels sit side by side - even with spacers to ensure a bit of airflow you'll find the top cabinet is a lot hotter than the others.

I believe Timebomb here looked into piping the vent out to the mouth of the horn but I'm not sure why a prototype was never made. Going from 700w to 1000w+ isn't giving you a noticeable difference to my ears anyway, it's all lost in power compression because of the heat.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Crazy Dane Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 October 2010 at 8:02pm
What about a ali heatsink placed in the mouth of the horn folding?

Underneath the driver ore on the panel next to it.
See link...
http://peecee.dk/upload/view/271296

I'm working with CNC milling, and could make some heatsinks that maybe could absorb some heat?

 
Best regards... Frank
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote vzummer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 October 2010 at 10:57pm

Crazy Dane, you're absolutely right, for example have a look at VOID sub (rear):

http://www.voidaudio.com/product_detail.asp?id=76

Though, heatsinking is a separate branch of physics and engineering; and demands dedicated calculations and modelling. I'm looking forward to implement similar solution in 15" W-bin. I think the task is not so critical and accurate calculations can be omitted. Just using common sense.

This is how it could be:


Cast or milled aluminium (or its alloys).

Could be aided (even replaced) with two side panels. Speaker access panels could be made from such heat radiator.

For best passive ventilation all fins should be vertical at this point ov view.

Maybe this configuration is even better that 1st, because:

1) increased dissipation surface (two panels instead of one)

2) additional infrared (heat) radiation transfer due to radiators closely placed to magnet

Anyway, who's got money and is someway fanatic can place all three of them.

Sorry for kiddish sketches, don't have forces to draw precise at night =)

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nachural Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 October 2010 at 10:38am
Ideally the heatsink would have to be in thermal contact with the driver.
it's all just cardboard and magnets really
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SMP Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 December 2013 at 12:08am
I am currently considering the dynamics of this problem and may have a solution
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