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levyte357- View Drop Down
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Points: 7520 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote levyte357- Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 August 2022 at 6:18pm
Originally posted by Matty309 Matty309 wrote:

not quite, the power density of a top of the line double 18 is better than a top of the line scoop.


And what Cab design, and driver combination, would you class as a top of the line Scoop !?
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jammin75 View Drop Down
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Points: 2315 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jammin75 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 August 2022 at 8:39pm


LOL
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JonB67 View Drop Down
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Points: 1363 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JonB67 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 August 2022 at 10:09pm
Didn't tony wilkes (RIP Tony)and someone else from the forum do a head to head between a double q18 and a hog scoop? 

It's on post on the forum here somwhere iirc. I'll see if i can find it.  
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Matty309 View Drop Down
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Points: 116 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Matty309 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 August 2022 at 10:48pm
I'm not sure what double 18"s your comparing them to, must be terrible. 

I compared a single hog loaded with void v18-1000 vs a Martin audio sx218 (18tbx) and the double 18 is significantly louder and more full sounding, it's tighter, warmer and goes lower. 
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Matty309 View Drop Down
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Points: 116 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Matty309 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 August 2022 at 10:54pm
None :D . But in all seriousness, all designs are tradeoffs but the hog scoop is a pretty good balanced enclosure in terms of characteristics. 

Scoops are good and super efficient I just think if you have the amp power ( money) you can't beat reflex subs for everything. They go low, sound great and get loud if driven with a modern class D amp.
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levyte357- View Drop Down
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Points: 7520 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote levyte357- Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 August 2022 at 11:11pm
Originally posted by Matty309 Matty309 wrote:

None :D
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Matty309 View Drop Down
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Points: 116 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Matty309 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 August 2022 at 11:15pm
😂 I say that but at boomtown there was a 3 rigs comprised of  scoops and I could hardly breathe so there's that.
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Points: 10715 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote toastyghost Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 August 2022 at 1:56am
Originally posted by smitske96 smitske96 wrote:

@jammin75

Did someone ever do some test with a standard like CEA2010 etc? Such tests would give clear data to see a cabinets maximum limit. It removes the users own perception which can be really really colored.



Production Partner have tests of the KS28 at 10% distortion with multitone burst signals. Danley have M-Noise data for several of their subs, which is also distortion limited.

The BC218 in a double (BC418) also has 13Hz extension on the KS28, and much more rear rejection. Flip one of the KS28 around and then do the comparison…
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levyte357- View Drop Down
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Points: 7520 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote levyte357- Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 August 2022 at 10:36am
Originally posted by Matty309 Matty309 wrote:

😂 I say that but at boomtown there was a 3 rigs comprised of  scoops and I could hardly breathe so there's that.

I said years ago, even though Scoops are great, if you are doing high profile concert, real pro will not be using Scoops, so I understand for many pro applications, 2x18 reflex, gives the flat response FOH Engineers prefer, so just just piling them up, gets the job done.

However for niche applications, like Roots Reggae and Dub dances, Scoops excel.

Especially where there is a box per sound limit, like 4/6/8.

Also in venues where there is only Consumer ring main available to the sound dude, you have possibly ropey 32a available through multiple13a plugs, so efficient cabs are key.

Tottenham Green Leisure Center, has a sports hall, that can hold 5000 people, and has ridiculously high ceiling, regularly used for Reggae Dances, but only has 13a plugs, however myself with my mate's sound, regularly shook the place to bits, with just 8x Scoops.



Edited by levyte357- - 06 August 2022 at 2:16pm
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smitske96 View Drop Down
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Points: 893 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote smitske96 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 August 2022 at 11:59am
@toasty

I am aware of those, but i have never seen any comparable measurements for some scoops etc.
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jammin75 View Drop Down
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Points: 2315 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jammin75 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 August 2022 at 4:11pm
Originally posted by levyte357- levyte357- wrote:

Originally posted by Matty309 Matty309 wrote:

😂 I say that but at boomtown there was a 3 rigs comprised of  scoops and I could hardly breathe so there's that.

I said years ago, even though Scoops are great, if you are doing high profile concert, real pro will not be using Scoops, so I understand for many pro applications, 2x18 reflex, gives the flat response FOH Engineers prefer, so just just piling them up, gets the job done.

However for niche applications, like Roots Reggae and Dub dances, Scoops excel.

Especially where there is a box per sound limit, like 4/6/8.

Also in venues where there is only Consumer ring main available to the sound dude, you have possibly ropey 32a available through multiple13a plugs, so efficient cabs are key.

Tottenham Green Leisure Center, has a sports hall, that can hold 5000 people, and has ridiculously high ceiling, regularly used for Reggae Dances, but only has 13a plugs, however myself with my mate's sound, regularly shook the place to bits, with just 8x Scoops.



Clap   try the same with 4 double 18's LOL
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luton_soundman View Drop Down
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Points: 4288 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote luton_soundman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 August 2022 at 8:42pm
Originally posted by JonB67 JonB67 wrote:

Didn't tony wilkes (RIP Tony)and someone else from the forum do a head to head between a double q18 and a hog scoop? 

It's on post on the forum here somwhere iirc. I'll see if i can find it.  

No idea about that. But he did ave some great words to say when he heard 4 of my scoops destroy 12 high power 18s in reflex cabs designed for them off of a big pile of Labs Embarrassed 30 page thread on it...
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