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How to parallel amps

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levyte357- View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote levyte357- Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 March 2018 at 4:40pm
Originally posted by imageoven imageoven wrote:

Originally posted by levyte357- levyte357- wrote:

I also think simple 2In/6out  Output LMS, would be a professional solution.


But totaly overkill compared to a couple of meters of signal cable linking the pheonix connectors.

A LMS would cost £200 +, would require 1U rack space and then another 8 x xlr connectors.


Used Behringer DCX costs less than £200.

No impedance worries, led display of signal fed to each amp, and limiter per amp, all configurable by PC.

"Sometimes simplicity is the shelter often retreated to, by the less able".
"Gentlemen, you can't fight in here, this is the war room!!".
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fatfreddiescat View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote fatfreddiescat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 March 2018 at 5:15pm
Originally posted by levyte357- levyte357- wrote:

Originally posted by imageoven imageoven wrote:

Originally posted by levyte357- levyte357- wrote:

I also think simple 2In/6out  Output LMS, would be a professional solution.


But totaly overkill compared to a couple of meters of signal cable linking the pheonix connectors.

A LMS would cost £200 +, would require 1U rack space and then another 8 x xlr connectors.


Used Behringer DCX costs less than £200.

No impedance worries, led display of signal fed to each amp, and limiter per amp, all configurable by PC.

"Sometimes simplicity is the shelter often retreated to, by the less able".


FFS, KISS
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mini-mad View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote mini-mad Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 March 2018 at 6:41pm
Originally posted by fatfreddiescat fatfreddiescat wrote:

Originally posted by levyte357- levyte357- wrote:

Originally posted by imageoven imageoven wrote:

Originally posted by levyte357- levyte357- wrote:

I also think simple 2In/6out  Output LMS, would be a professional solution.


But totaly overkill compared to a couple of meters of signal cable linking the pheonix connectors.

A LMS would cost £200 +, would require 1U rack space and then another 8 x xlr connectors.


Used Behringer DCX costs less than £200.

No impedance worries, led display of signal fed to each amp, and limiter per amp, all configurable by PC.

"Sometimes simplicity is the shelter often retreated to, by the less able".


FFS, KISS

+1,000,
2cables per euro connector and just feed one input into the next. 5 min job and it works.
If it sounds like a gorilla is trying to escape, turn it down.
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Elliot Thompson View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Elliot Thompson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 March 2018 at 6:55pm
Originally posted by serioussound serioussound wrote:

https://www.monacor.com/media/FLE/LSP102.pdf

Here is manual.

I cant really read out if it would work.

I ask because I already have one of this device at home.


If you have one at home, the most logical thing to do is to hook it up and listen if you achieve a degradation in the sound or not as you connect your 3rd, 4th and, 5th amplifier in the chain.  

I am a strong believer of using what you have at your disposal in your collection of equipment doing nothing at the moment before, buying another piece of equipment. This is why suggested using an LMS as an alternative if by chance, you had one lying about doing nothing instead of buying a distribution amplifier. 

Best Regards, 


 

Elliot Thompson
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serioussound View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote serioussound Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 March 2018 at 7:09pm
I thought this was a simple newbie question :)

But it seems little complex.

In professional bigger installations how do the pros doing it?
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Elliot Thompson View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Elliot Thompson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 March 2018 at 7:24pm
Originally posted by serioussound serioussound wrote:

I thought this was a simple newbie question :)

But it seems little complex.

In professional bigger installations how do the pros doing it?

A Distribution Amplifier. 

There are very few here that requires 5 - 20 amplifiers receiving the same audio signal. Those who need to accomplish such a task, use a distribution amplifier. 

Click On This Link To Get A Better Understanding Why Many Use Distribution Amplifiers

Best Regards, 

Elliot Thompson
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APW View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote APW Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 March 2018 at 7:42pm
If the amplifiers had an input impedance of 600ohm.... then yes, you need a distribution amp... however, the amplifier input impedance is high at 20K.

https://www.soundonsound.com/techniques/understanding-impedance

Read the section on "Voltage Matching & Bridging Inputs", the example talks about tape machines, however it's exactly the same for amplifiers, as the mixer cannot tell the difference, it just sees impedance.


Edited by APW - 13 March 2018 at 7:47pm
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Elliot Thompson View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Elliot Thompson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 March 2018 at 8:04pm
Originally posted by APW APW wrote:

If the amplifiers had an input impedance of 600ohm.... then yes, you need a distribution amp... however, the amplifier input impedance is high at 20K.

https://www.soundonsound.com/techniques/understanding-impedance

Read the section on "Voltage Matching & Bridging Inputs", the example talks about tape machines, however it's exactly the same for amplifiers, as the mixer cannot tell the difference, it just sees impedance.

You are looking at things from a simplistic point of view and it really does not work that way when it comes to chaining multiple amplifiers. I can assure you on that.  

It is better for serious sound to invest in a distribution amplifier. They are not expensive and will eliminate any second guessing.  


Best Regards, 



Edited by Elliot Thompson - 13 March 2018 at 8:09pm
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Risc_Terilia View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Risc_Terilia Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 March 2018 at 8:20pm
I just use a rack panel that I've wired with XLR ins splitting to 3 XLR outs each.  You can make it for a tenner and if you're getting quiet signal guess what you do?  You turn it up from the mixer!  Would I do this if I was sending control signals in a nuclear missile silo?  No.  Do a lot of people do this on a sound system?  Yes.  
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APW View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote APW Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 March 2018 at 8:22pm

Originally posted by Elliot
Thompson Elliot Thompson wrote:

You are looking at things from a simplistic point of view and it really does not work that way when it comes to chaining multiple amplifiers. I can assure you on that.  


FFS, he only wants to wire 5 amps together, he isn't doing the sound for Glastonbury.

And YES it dose work like that....

.... BTW I started my apprenticeship the year you were born as an electronics service engineer working in TV and AUDIO before moving into medical and industrial electronics sectors as a design engineer!!


Edited by APW - 13 March 2018 at 8:26pm
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mini-mad View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mini-mad Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 March 2018 at 8:39pm
Originally posted by APW APW wrote:

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<p ="Msonormal" style="margin-bottom:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt;line-height: normal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"; mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman";mso-fareast-:EN-GB">
Originally posted by Elliot<br />Thompson Elliot
Thompson wrote:


</span>



<p ="Msonormal" style="margin-bottom:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt;line-height: normal"><span style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman","serif"; mso-fareast-font-family:"Times New Roman";mso-fareast-:EN-GB">…</span>

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looking at things from a simplistic point of view and it really does not work
that way when it comes to chaining multiple amplifiers. I can assure you on
that.  </span>



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FFS, he only wants to wire 5 amps together, he isn't doing the sound for Glastonbury.

And YES it dose work like that....

.... BTW I started my apprenticeship the year you were born as an electronics service engineer working in TV and AUDIO before moving into medical and industrial electronics sectors as a design engineer!!


As I said +1000. Just parallel the Damn inputs across all the amps.. I assume they are stacked on top of each other anyway. Way to may people OVER complicating things. It truly is that simple and the signal cable between each amp will be less the 5inchs. 125mm for the Europeans.


You asked a simple question to a bunch of people of a broad spectrum of expertise. An LMS is overkill unless your having the separate amps doing different things..

If it sounds like a gorilla is trying to escape, turn it down.
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Elliot Thompson View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Elliot Thompson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 March 2018 at 11:04am

Originally posted by APW APW wrote:

Originally posted by Elliot
Thompson Elliot Thompson wrote:

You are looking at things from a simplistic point of view and it really does not work that way when it comes to chaining multiple amplifiers. I can assure you on that.  


FFS, he only wants to wire 5 amps together, he isn't doing the sound for Glastonbury.

And YES it dose work like that....

.... BTW I started my apprenticeship the year you were born as an electronics service engineer working in TV and AUDIO before moving into medical and industrial electronics sectors as a design engineer!!

 

Then you should know with electronic equipment the power supply plays a factor on its performance. And since you did not design the equipment in question, you cannot come to the conclusion that your method is going to work with no negative side effects.

 

 

Bear in mind what serious sound asked:

 

Originally posted by serioussound serioussound wrote:

I thought this was a simple newbie question :)

But it seems little complex.

In professional bigger installations how do the pros doing it?

 

For those that use multiple amplifiers to ensure no humming, no loss of output voltage, in addition to not overloading the processor during usage, we use Distribution Amplifiers. 

 

Serious sound is requesting the professional way of sending a signal to 5 amplifiers that do not offer an option of piggy backing from amplifier to amplifier. The audio processor serious sound that is sending the signal offers a singular output. Based on my experience of using 5 amplifiers to cover low midrange, a Distribution Amplifier is in order. That is the professional way of doing it.

 

Best Regards,

 

Elliot Thompson
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