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MS-18 ..Mini Scooper

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levyte357 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote levyte357 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 January 2009 at 3:35am
Originally posted by mykey mykey wrote:

Clap
looks like a wembley B-line but would sound better



"Who am I? I'm the guy who does his job.. You must be the other guy".
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mykey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 January 2009 at 5:55am
Originally posted by staiper staiper wrote:

Thanx mykey :)

Here I make effort and do it..

There is sim of Turbomax 1000 in the Rhino and MS-18 .. live together in perfect harmony Smile



Black MS-18 , Gray the Rhino .. ( you see black line is darker LOL)
I can give you a better resoponse for the Rhino by changing the HR inputs to
S1  803
S2 2238   con 123.50
S3 2238   con   52.50
 
VTC 71000
ATC 1220
 
I feel if you do this you will lose that HORN/SCOOP sound, and will end up sounding like a W b-lineDead
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levyte357 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote levyte357 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 January 2009 at 2:58pm
Originally posted by mykey mykey wrote:


 I can give you a better resoponse for the Rhino by changing the HR inputs to
S1  803
S2 2238   con 123.50
S3 2238   con   52.50
 
VTC 71000
ATC 1220
 
I feel if you do this you will lose that HORN/SCOOP sound, and will end up sounding like a W b-lineDead


Yes, but surely only the inputs applicable to the design are relevant?
"Who am I? I'm the guy who does his job.. You must be the other guy".
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staiper View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote staiper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 January 2009 at 8:10pm
..hmgh..

First.. It is impossible to compare (as design)  MS-18 with  Wembley.
Wembley b-line cabinet have ridiculous path (it is hard to even call it "horn" ) with series
changing positive and negative flare rates and at the end port (mouth??) is barely
larger than at the beginning (if it is possible to define where exactly real beginning is).

 From my point of view Wembley b-line cabinet is badly and strangely designed cabinet - do not know what designer tried to achieve with this ConfusedConfused .. I see this as big BR cabinet with one a bit oversized brace at middle of top panel...

MS-18 is proper mini scoop (I also do not want to name mini scoops as "horns" due to their very hybrid behavior BR/BLH )
All elements are clearly defined ..chamber, throat , "horn" (with proper expansion) ..and "mouth" .
Only reminiscent thing between those two is last segment of "horn" with no expansion rate (parallel).

MS-18 is designed to be as much as possible easy-to-do ..but with no compromise on intended goal-performance.

Due to miniscoop (all) design, pryncipe  and operating freq. range that last segment of horn is really acoustically too small to make any difference on final output quality/characteristic.
.. I mean it is easy to tilt that panel a little bit down and make last segment with a bit of conical expansion ..but that will complicate cabinet building and will no make difference at the end.

BTW ..one may make entire (for example exponential)  bass-horn of series of segments with no expansion (of course each following segment have larger cross section than previous one .. to approximate expansion). At the end you will get same result as with true exp flare. This is applicable only to bass/sub bass horns... Mr.Danley have experimented with this and have write some (forum)texts and conclusions.

.. oh ..again I write long, boring texts to read Tongue

Best wishes, Stipe

edit: grammar Embarrassed



Edited by staiper - 18 January 2009 at 8:45pm
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CHAMPION View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CHAMPION Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 January 2009 at 10:29pm
Straip..put the other Mini version, small/medium chamber one !
 
i will be making them next month, drivers standing by for testing


Edited by CHAMPION - 18 January 2009 at 10:30pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mykey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 January 2009 at 3:02am
"MS-18 is proper mini scoop"
 no disrepspect, its a horn, its not a scoop
 
you're not from the UK or Jamaica, you are a European
 
I grew up around blues parties and scoops
if you want to call it a scoop, put a curved scoop in it? 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mykey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 January 2009 at 3:03am
you're bang on about the W B-line cab Staipe, its one terrible cab
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote staiper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 January 2009 at 11:04am
Originally posted by mykey mykey wrote:

"MS-18 is proper mini scoop"
... its not a scoop
 
you're not from the UK or Jamaica, you are a European
 
I grew up around blues parties and scoops
if you want to call it a scoop, put a curved scoop in it? 


Smile Yes ..I know that curved part contributes a bit in the "scoop" name  .. but how to call them..

I look at "scoop" in PA world more like second name for Rear Loaded Horn technique. ..So do not think that only that curve defines is something scoop or not. ..For example if one make Super Scooper with one or two straight panels instead curved.. It is not scoop anymore?!? Tongue .. also than, first plan on first page of the Rhino is not Mini Scoop than ?? Smile

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mykey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 January 2009 at 3:24am
yes thats why I said make it with the scoop if your woodworking skills are better than ok
they will all sound good, and thats what counts
 
I didn't mean to sound sh*tty, sorry 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jaya000 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 January 2009 at 3:41pm
Nice design.
How about an image of input screen of HR.
This will help us to avoid any mistakes for customization.
Also can be used for learning horn design.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jaya000 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 January 2009 at 2:47am
what will be the difference if i make the modification as in the picture of the file :
http://img152.imageshack.us/my.php?image=mini18drawingyd0.pdf
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mykey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 January 2009 at 3:12am
it will effect what the designer wanted to achieve
 
this will deduct air volume from the chamber, but as far as sound, 'I' have found that it speeds things up a little
 
I did this in the original Bull-X and the Cow, is that where you got the idea?  


Edited by mykey - 23 January 2009 at 3:13am
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