mt122 comparison

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   hi there, 
im bran spankin new to the forum but i have been researching alot about speakerplans.com for the past few months. 
im interested in knowing what the mt122 sound like with the sn-12b woofers and the sd750 hf driver . what are they similar to on the market today? jbl sr? ev qrx? eaw la series? any comments would be great.
im looking for a good pair of long throws to use with 4 cerwin vega ab36 subs. 
2 of these subs on each side at 1400 program, and 1 of the mt122s at 1200 program with a good powerful hf driver sounds pretty balanced to me. 
im going to drive the system with either a driverack 260 or driverack pa. 
ill have the system triamped too.
the qsc 3402 seems like a good amp for these mt122s. and a 1202 on highs looks good too.
ive never really heard of p-audio until i found this website. are these speakers any good. im more familiar with jbl and eminence speakers.
are there any other woofers i can use with these cabs?
thanks,
jason

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drummerboy Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Registered User Joined: 23 April 2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 30	Post Options Post Reply Quote drummerboy Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Topic: mt122 comparison Posted: 23 April 2005 at 12:50am
	hi there, im bran spankin new to the forum but i have been researching alot about speakerplans.com for the past few months. im interested in knowing what the mt122 sound like with the sn-12b woofers and the sd750 hf driver . what are they similar to on the market today? jbl sr? ev qrx? eaw la series? any comments would be great. im looking for a good pair of long throws to use with 4 cerwin vega ab36 subs. 2 of these subs on each side at 1400 program, and 1 of the mt122s at 1200 program with a good powerful hf driver sounds pretty balanced to me. im going to drive the system with either a driverack 260 or driverack pa. ill have the system triamped too. the qsc 3402 seems like a good amp for these mt122s. and a 1202 on highs looks good too. ive never really heard of p-audio until i found this website. are these speakers any good. im more familiar with jbl and eminence speakers. are there any other woofers i can use with these cabs? thanks, jason
	drummers can run sound too!!

james folkes Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Old Croc Joined: 08 January 2005 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 3064	Post Options Post Reply Quote james folkes Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 18 May 2005 at 8:06pm
	hmm, you know i'd never noticed that the mt122 was specced for p- audio, particularly odd since i've been building some single driver variants and have been staring at the plans for several months! i guess i'd always assumed they were pds. we started with a huge pile of (mckenzie gp) drivers and then chose cabs, which might go some way to explaining this oversight. anyway, why is this relevant to your question? well i was having a conversation recently where someone said the speakerplans designs aren't the trickest or most finnicky in the world, more that they are just good reliable proven boxes. our single 10 scaled variants of the mt122 have sounded fantastic on first testing, did we get lucky or are the horns just solid sensible designs? the p audio neo jobbies at �80 each will probably trounce anything from eminence (going on my experiences of eminence) and are rated at 100dB efficiency (that's 100 railways if you're reading a site google translated from german!). it's probably worth paying that bit more to get them because they will be significantly louder than offerings in the 96/7 range. simply comparing the paramaters of the two p-audio driver's suggested indicates there might be room to move here. a word of warning though, mine are seriously directional. if your dancefloor is not letterbox shaped you may need two a side. james. ps, are you quoting program power in the same way i understand it? i.e. half of r.m.s.?

Fushion Julz Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Registered User Joined: 19 August 2004 Status: Offline Points: 647	Post Options Post Reply Quote Fushion Julz Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 19 May 2005 at 10:53am
	They were originally specc'd for use with PD123er drivers and Beyma CP800Ti comp driver... Recently had a shootout where MalX had his PD123er/Paudio 750 versions and I had my Paudio SN12b/Beyma CP800Ti versions to compare... To my mind, there was little or no difference between the PD123er and the Paudio SN12b...The comp drivers, though, showed up a bigger difference...The Beymas are certainly more efficient and they sound "bigger"...The Paudios, though, are a bit sweeter sounding...less ultimate extension, but how many people care about over 16Khz that much? I suppose it all comes down to cost....The Beyma CP800Tis are hugely expensive as compared to the bargain (by comparison) Paudio sd750 In the mid driver, there is less of a price difference...both are (in the UK at least) similarly priced...However the SN12b is a Neo driver and a fair bit lighter than the PD123er.... I have to say I will disagree with James on directionality....If you set up stereo stacks too far apart you can and will get a central "no mid or hi" zone...other than that, they seem to cover the claimed 60deg horizontal spread quite adequately...Perhaps that was the bit that didn't "scale" well to a 10" design! If you want 10" mids, I'd build the MT102 design as it is significantly easier to build and smaller when completed, too.... I've heard these in operation by Messy sounds and, although I can't remember what they were loaded with, they sounded very sweet indeed on top of PD1850s....
	FUSHION SOUNDSYSTEM www.fushion.org.uk

james folkes Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Old Croc Joined: 08 January 2005 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 3064	Post Options Post Reply Quote james folkes Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 20 May 2005 at 7:22am
	i thought they were 40 degrees horizontal dispersion, that's what it says on the plans... actually i had found that figure to be about right from subjective 'head bobbing' tests, but i do consider that to be rather directional. i definitely bow to julz's superior knowledge though as he has been living with the boxes for a lot longer and has heard them deployed in many different ways. if one a side covers quite a big area this is cool. you're probably right about the scaling, but i can't give a full assesment of mine until the other 4 are glued and screwed and we have our full array. you are also probably quite right about the mt102 too, it's just that we wanted a single 10 trapezoidal horn cab and scaling seemed to be a good idea at the time. if the p-audio and pd drivers sound the same then for god's sake get the neos! james.

Fushion Julz Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Registered User Joined: 19 August 2004 Status: Offline Points: 647	Post Options Post Reply Quote Fushion Julz Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 20 May 2005 at 9:34am
	Nah...you are correct...my typo...'tis 40 deg horizontal.... However, they spread well enough. We used to use a single pair, in stereo stacks, in a room about 10m wide by 25m long with the stacks about 7m apart. Slightly angled inwards so the side of the box was parallel to the walls they covered the room admireably. The only obvious hole in the mid response was right in the centre of the stacks in front of the DJ position....but then the monitors acted as fills anyway... I thnk in wider rooms...or at least wider apart stacks, a second pair would be needed for optimum coverage
	FUSHION SOUNDSYSTEM www.fushion.org.uk

Dom Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Old Croc Joined: 25 February 2004 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1700	Post Options Post Reply Quote Dom Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 20 May 2005 at 1:51pm
	To be honest the directionality of the box will be primarily dependant on the chosen horn for the compression driver and your chosen crossover point as you'll notice that the highs will drop off a lot sooner than the lower frequencies. We never did polar plots for our MT122 horns, but we did some the other week for a porn horn, and although that only has a 35 degree horizontal dispersion you can see how the low end is a lot less directional than the tops. 12" Porn horn 1.5" porn horn (stopped after 40 degrees as it's so directional...) Scale is 1db per line btw...
	"It sounded like a million fire engines chasing ten million ambulances through a war zone and it was played at a volume that made the empty chair beside me bleed."

rich, ind.st Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Young Croc Joined: 14 January 2005 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1096	Post Options Post Reply Quote rich, ind.st Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 20 May 2005 at 2:29pm
	hi all, having had 2 of the single 10" mt122 variants in my living room for a few days in a 3 way set up with some small jamo moniters doing the highs and a dual 10" 6th order bandpass/ horn hybrid sub it obviously wasnt the ideal set up, the sub doesnt really like playing above 100 hz (it does it just sounds a bit wrong) and stanaloone tweeters would have been better, however once time aligned its was sounding very sweet when implemented in a pa setup the mids will only have to play down to around 250hz as they will be sat over some martin 215's or altrnatively the selenium straight 15" bass horns , when completed in a few months (hopefully sooner) we'll possibly be trying them out this weekend , will be interesting to see how they sound when turned up .... i will conceed that these boxes are not fun to build, and also that the vertical side flares do require a mitre of around 3 degrees on the top and bottom edges to fit correctly (despite argueing vehemently about it being horizotal plane and all :-) )
	music is god

Timber_MG Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Registered User Joined: 27 March 2004 Location: South Africa Status: Offline Points: 1454	Post Options Post Reply Quote Timber_MG Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 21 May 2005 at 3:31am
	@Dom could you please mail me some high-res versions of those pics? If you measured them like that you'll no doubt have more data...my e-mail is audionut _AT_ tuks.co.za. Please? If these are for real I would rather use a larger waveguide up top to better match power response as at 2khz the ear is very sensitive and the power reponse of the combo doesn't even come close to matching. One can also see the directional pattern suffereing from diffraction artefacts up high.