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PD.186 / 186.2

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    Posted: 03 March 2014 at 6:22pm
Hi all, 

Precision Devices have changed reference for the 186 to 186.2, technical data have some big evolution too... 

I contacted them to get more informations... 

"The PD.186/2 has caused some confusion for our customers along with publication of new data for our 2014 catalogue. Firstly allow us to explain the updates to the speaker data on our website and in our new 2014 catalogue. Along with many updates to our production processes and workflows, we have recently appointed a new technical engineer and part of his remit was to re-test and document all of our speakers technical data as they stand today, data we published in the past was inherited from the previous company owners and often used differing testing processes or equipment. Our 'new' data reflects all drivers being subjected to the exact same tests and conditions using the same test equipment and standards.  Unfortunately during this process we identified that some of the old speaker data was either incorrect or parameters had slightly shifted due to changes in component parts from our suppliers that we were not notified about and were beyond our control. After further investigation we have discovered that most of the changes occurred several years ago, therefore previously published data was not entirely accurate and the reality is that if you have a driver that is less than 5yrs old then the 'new' data will most likely apply. We can also confirm that we have tested all drivers in enclosures to ensure they perform correctly using the old and new data, which we are happy to report they do.  

Now for the PD.186 and the new PD.186/2…. We can confirm that the only difference between the PD.186 and PD.186/2 is the speaker chassis, the /2 uses our new 18" chassis design. The new chassis design increases the product depth by approx 10mm and also removes the 'hidden' inner fixing holes found on the original 186 under the gasket. Because of the increased depth re-cone kits are not interchangeable between the PD.186 and /2, however we are committed to still producing re-cone kits for the original PD.186 to support owners of these drivers. So in answer to your question, yes you can still use the PD.186/2 in a PD.186 enclosure design, you can also mix and match the two drivers, although we recommend balancing them out across enclosures to ensure best performance. I.e. If you have a 2x18 cab and  2x 186 and 2x186/2 put one of each driver into the cabs not 186 in one and 186/2 in the other."


Unfortunatly, we can't test our new boxes (with 186.2) for now...

Maybe someone have already check it with a good microphone..?

BR, 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bee Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 March 2014 at 7:48pm
cheers for the info, and is the same as other members have already pointed.Clap

Edited by bee - 03 March 2014 at 7:50pm
https://www.elements-audio.com
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote fourway hornloaded Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 March 2014 at 3:23pm
So basically any recently manufactured PD186 has the 'new' parameters.
That's quite bad, if you ask me.

Judging the 'old' datasheet, I would have considered PD186 a similar driver to L18P300 and 18LW1400. ~180 gramms of MMS, medium BL, Qts around 0.3.

Now all of a sudden it's got 190 gramms of MMS and a Qts over ½ ‼ Like a car speaker.
Who would have bougth any such speaker to use it in a horn or band-pass horn design, like many of us have?

Can anyone comment to the PD186-RCF-18sound comparison?

Originally posted by levyte357- levyte357- wrote:

Originally posted by stephan stephan wrote:

Hello,

i want to built some 186 horns but i only can get the newer pd.186/2 drivers with different TSP. Is it possible to use these for good results?
Thank you!

PD.186                           PD.186/2
Fs 27 Hz                         Fs 34 Hz
Re 5.5 Ohms                      Re 6.19 Ω
Qts 0.312                        Qts 0.52
Qms 7.75                         Qms 10.77
Qes 0.326                        Qes 0.55
Vas 353 Litres                   Vas 195 litres
Mms 184 g                        Mms 203 grams
Sd 1150 cm2                      Sd 1134 cm2
Cms 188 μm/N                     Cms 106 μmn
BL 22.94 T/m                     BL 22.2 T/m
Xmax 10.5 mm                     Xmax 10.5 mm
Vd 1.20 Litres                   Vd 1.20 litres
Reference Efficiency 2.05 %      Reference Efficiency 1.33%



Just corrected that for you.

http://www.mh-audio.nl/Reference.asp - http://www.mh-audio.nl/Reference.asp
Wink




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote levyte357- Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 March 2014 at 3:46pm
Maybe we should wait for someone to try pd186-2 in 186 horn, then see what result is.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Aztor Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 April 2014 at 9:16am
Originally posted by levyte357- levyte357- wrote:

Maybe we should wait for someone to try pd186-2 in 186 horn, then see what result is.

In the first post. Didn't he say that if you have a PD186 that is less than 5 years then it's the same as the v2, minus the chassis. It that is correct there is a lot of ppl with the v2 already. I can comfirm that the less than 5 year old works like a charm. 

The Qts of 0,52 is annoying. ConfusedShocked
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote levyte357- Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 April 2014 at 11:02am
Originally posted by Aztor Aztor wrote:

In the first post. Didn't he say that if you have a PD186 that is less than 5 years then it's the same as the v2, minus the chassis. 

Nothing beats seeing New driver tested in cab you are intending to use, before buying it.Wink

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Aztor Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 April 2014 at 10:20pm
Originally posted by levyte357- levyte357- wrote:

Originally posted by Aztor Aztor wrote:

In the first post. Didn't he say that if you have a PD186 that is less than 5 years then it's the same as the v2, minus the chassis. 

Nothing beats seeing New driver tested in cab you are intending to use, before buying it.Wink


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ArthurG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 April 2014 at 2:31pm
Originally posted by Aztor Aztor wrote:

The Qts of 0,52 is annoying. ConfusedShocked
why ?
for an intended reflex driver, high qts is fine...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote levyte357- Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 April 2014 at 12:27pm
Originally posted by ArthurG ArthurG wrote:

Originally posted by Aztor Aztor wrote:

The Qts of 0,52 is annoying. ConfusedShocked
why ?
for an intended reflex driver, high qts is fine...

Many people used old PD186 in Folded horns, BPH cabs.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ArthurG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 April 2014 at 2:54pm
Originally posted by levyte357- levyte357- wrote:

Originally posted by ArthurG ArthurG wrote:

Originally posted by Aztor Aztor wrote:

The Qts of 0,52 is annoying. ConfusedShocked
why ?
for an intended reflex driver, high qts is fine...

Many people used old PD186 in Folded horns, BPH cabs.
186 was always intended as a reflex driver and this where it sounds the best (I know a dozen of companies using it this way and the cabs sells very well). 
For horns and BPH, they are much better choices ...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote levyte357- Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 April 2014 at 4:45pm
Originally posted by ArthurG ArthurG wrote:

186 was always intended as a reflex driver and this where it sounds the best (I know a dozen of companies using it this way and the cabs sells very well). 
For horns and BPH, they are much better choices ...

You are of course entitled to your opinion, of where "you think it sounds best", and for "BHP" there are better choices.

However owners of newly built 186 Horns, would be very dismayed, to find newly bought drivers may not work in cabs, the previous version did.





Edited by levyte357- - 28 April 2014 at 5:02pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ArthurG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 April 2014 at 5:20pm
Originally posted by levyte357- levyte357- wrote:

Originally posted by ArthurG ArthurG wrote:

186 was always intended as a reflex driver and this where it sounds the best (I know a dozen of companies using it this way and the cabs sells very well). 
For horns and BPH, they are much better choices ...

You are of course entitled to your opinion, of where "you think it sounds best", and for "BHP" there are better choices.

However owners of newly built 186 Horns, would be very dismayed, to find newly bought drivers may not work in cabs, the previous version did.
My opinion is made of real testing and measurements in my laboratory, as any engineer doing his job. 
So I have no idea of what you are talking about. Original 186 and V2 are the same, only chassis change. From the start, this driver had a high qts (>0.45). Datasheet was wrong. 
The day you will truly measure parameters in real life, instead of believing on manufacturers marketing sheets, you will have an heart attack LOL


Edited by ArthurG - 28 April 2014 at 5:22pm
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