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Ported Horn Kick | Q^be15

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OIL View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote OIL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Ported Horn Kick | Q^be15
    Posted: 09 February 2018 at 3:29pm
Hi,
I'm working on a new project, a 50*50*50cm 15" kickbin (125l).
As the size is limting the length of the horn to 60cm, I decided to go with a ported backchamber.
Here is a first simm with the B&C 15CL76:

I got one problem with the modelling in hornresp, tho:
How should I modell the throat area (Marked with '?').

Option 1: Specify the whole area as the throat chamber.
Option 2: Specify the driver bowl as a TC and add a very short duct segment before the offset driver input and a longer duct segment after.
Option 3:Specify the driver bowl as a TC and add a duct segment after it.

Which one resembles the real world the Best?
I went with option 3 as it was the most pessimitic and that's my nature LOL

Also I got a diffrent idea for loading:
Port the Back chamber in to the Throat chamber. I guess it would act like a Bass reflex cap, with a straped on horn in front, resulting in a high bandwith and good efficiency.
I got this idea from Föön; they have a 21" 2.2m horn, that has an F3 of 26Hz with a single cap (also a very small mouth). Shocked
Any Ideas how I can modell this in Hornresp? Did anyone ever hear of that loading before?

Thanks in advance!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gen0me Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 February 2018 at 7:57am
Input?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote OIL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 February 2018 at 12:22pm
Hi,
Last post was ver 0.03, which was a rough guess.
This is ver 0.04 and is based on the CAD drawing and fits the 125l perfectly.



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gen0me Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 February 2018 at 5:23pm
From reverse:

The port 2nd resonance is around 350hz.
And port it is very small for the anclosure It cant be reasoneably bigger with that Vrc and tunung. With this layout you could get rid of gap port and change into tube ports.

Check in hornresp help expansion types. They are not called after function of surface but traditionally.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bass*en*mass Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 February 2018 at 5:44pm
search for klipsch lascala, lots of www content covering those incl. HR inputs and more info.. if you want to use similar cabs on kick duty i would skip the ports and deal with the required horn size to cover your needs, rather than sacrificing/losing the good impulse response/low group delay!


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote OIL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 February 2018 at 6:06pm
Hi genome,
I'm not to familiar with ports as I always avoided them...
Port is tuned to 75Hz. Is there any difference with round ports compared to rectangular if ap/lpt is exactly the same?

I can't find anything in the Help with those keywords. I suspect you mean that l34 is parabolical; I don't understand why. Could you explain?

Will compare the two models.

Do you now anything about the alternative loading I thought about, because I'm really interested in it.

Thanks for your help!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gen0me Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 February 2018 at 6:58pm
Originally posted by OIL OIL wrote:

Hi genome,
I'm not to familiar with ports as I always avoided them...
Port is tuned to 75Hz. Is there any difference with round ports compared to rectangular if ap/lpt is exactly the same?

With 2.5cm on port the plywood cut on angle would be close but you would also probably have to add distance cause of start shape. Also if you want to make very awkward shape with widtch much longer to height it should tune even lower. Its better for impulse ofc but you cant tune lower here because port 2nd resonance will got into bandwidth(unmasked). Basicly already surface of the port is very very small.
If you want to compare port shapes sim compound horn and use rear as port the result of very not tube-like looking one would be similar to normal one in terms of characteristics (not frequency).

Originally posted by OIL OIL wrote:


I can't find anything in the Help with those keywords. I suspect you mean that l34 is parabolical; I don't understand why. Could you explain?

"A parabolic (Par) flatre should be used..."
Ctrl f in help there is more.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote OIL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 February 2018 at 7:30pm


I think that 125l liters outside volume is a bit to small to hit 80Hz...
But i still want to try the different loading before i give up and change the size. Does anyone have any information about this loading I mentioned in the first post?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MarjanM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 February 2018 at 8:12pm
Are you sure that driver will survive horn loading?
Marjan Milosevic
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https://www.facebook.com/pages/MM-Acoustics/608901282527713
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote OIL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 February 2018 at 9:29pm
Originally posted by MarjanM MarjanM wrote:

Are you sure that driver will survive horn loading?

What makes you question that?
To be honest I choose this one, just because it was one of the cheapest 15" Neo's available and XMax/PMax looked good for the price of 150€.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MarjanM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 February 2018 at 10:30pm
Because TS parameters are on the very edge of what a 15 made for horn loading should be.
Horns presents lot more stress to the cone then reflex boxes.
Marjan Milosevic
MM-Acoustics
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https://www.facebook.com/pages/MM-Acoustics/608901282527713
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gen0me Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 February 2018 at 5:58am
Originally posted by OIL OIL wrote:




Makes sense. The one with chamber Vtc seems smoother on sims.
Can you drop us impulse responses. They are much more important on kick. Group delays and excursion on 500W.

You could sim the first pic layout as offset driver just extending the Exp23 and changing S3.
You already noticed effect of Vtc chamber on sim.
Trying to reduce the volume in front can lead to more spiked characteristics.
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