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Martin 215mk3 with pics

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Category: Plans
Forum Name: New Projects Forum
Forum Description: Forum for new speakerplans projects, in memory of Tony Wilkes, 1953 - 2014
URL: https://forum.speakerplans.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=102119
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Topic: Martin 215mk3 with pics
Posted By: Father-Francis
Subject: Martin 215mk3 with pics
Date Posted: 19 June 2018 at 6:27pm
since they are not easy to get, in good condition we are building six of them will upload some pics when I get home 

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Music is the strongest form of magic.(+45 31879997)blakmanpro@gmail.com, foa@sweetboxaudio.dk



Replies:
Posted By: bob4
Date Posted: 20 June 2018 at 4:16am
beautiful!! ClapClapClapClapClap


Posted By: Keen
Date Posted: 29 June 2018 at 12:33pm
nice to see double strength baffles Thumbs Up


Posted By: fatfreddiescat
Date Posted: 29 June 2018 at 1:15pm
Looking very nice, possibly add a brace between the handles on the access panels? A lot of pressure there and looks a lot weaker than the rest of the box.


Posted By: dylan-penguinmedia
Date Posted: 29 June 2018 at 5:36pm
Niiiiiice.


Posted By: Ionkontrol
Date Posted: 29 June 2018 at 5:46pm
I suppose everyone has seen these guys.....?

http://www.acevintagesystems.co.uk/" rel="nofollow - http://www.acevintagesystems.co.uk/




Posted By: nojunk
Date Posted: 03 July 2018 at 10:38am
Originally posted by Father-Francis Father-Francis wrote:

since they are not easy to get, in good condition we are building six of them will upload some pics when I get home 

who made these flat packs?
is the plan/cnc available free?
tx for any info!


Posted By: AM55
Date Posted: 04 July 2018 at 5:30pm
What is the ideal driver to load these with nowadays? What were they originally loaded with?


Posted By: Father-Francis
Date Posted: 07 July 2018 at 1:09pm
Originally posted by fatfreddiescat fatfreddiescat wrote:

Looking very nice, possibly add a brace between the handles on the access panels? A lot of pressure there and looks a lot weaker than the rest of the box.
I’ve thought about that I May have 12mm space 


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Music is the strongest form of magic.(+45 31879997)blakmanpro@gmail.com, foa@sweetboxaudio.dk


Posted By: Father-Francis
Date Posted: 07 July 2018 at 1:15pm
i have The cnc drawings and Work was done at a cnc Company 

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Music is the strongest form of magic.(+45 31879997)blakmanpro@gmail.com, foa@sweetboxaudio.dk


Posted By: IvCu
Date Posted: 09 July 2018 at 12:00am
What drivers are you using in them? Mines are loaded with pd1550's and the plan is the same as yours. 
Did u had a chance to lift them up? Big smile


Posted By: BP1Fanatic
Date Posted: 09 July 2018 at 9:56pm
Drop Beats Not Bombs....Thumbs Up


Posted By: Father-Francis
Date Posted: 13 July 2018 at 11:35pm
Originally posted by IvCu IvCu wrote:

What drivers are you using in them? Mines are loaded with pd1550's and the plan is the same as yours. 
Did u had a chance to lift them up? Big smile
Am loading them with Rcf MB15N401 they are not done but think they be like 80kg , it’s about 2&2/3 of a sheets we use on each cab .


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Music is the strongest form of magic.(+45 31879997)blakmanpro@gmail.com, foa@sweetboxaudio.dk


Posted By: IvCu
Date Posted: 17 July 2018 at 2:21pm
Originally posted by Father-Francis Father-Francis wrote:

Originally posted by IvCu IvCu wrote:

What drivers are you using in them? Mines are loaded with pd1550's and the plan is the same as yours. 
Did u had a chance to lift them up? Big smile
Am loading them with Rcf MB15N401 they are not done but think they be like 80kg , it’s about 2&2/3 of a sheets we use on each cab .

They really kick as a mule! Let me know what are your impressions, but i think you will like them, they are very efficient! 


Posted By: Father-Francis
Date Posted: 03 August 2018 at 9:25am
so it's time to go back to the box building after the summer holidays with the family . will keep you posted on results 

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Music is the strongest form of magic.(+45 31879997)blakmanpro@gmail.com, foa@sweetboxaudio.dk


Posted By: wilidapili
Date Posted: 24 August 2018 at 9:05pm
I am also in the process of building some Martin Audio 215 mk3 bins! You are much further in the process than I, which is why I would like to ask you some questions if it's ok!

- I started modelling with 18mm ply, but seems like you are using 15mm, any special reason for this?

- I have made a CAD drawing from the drawings that can be found on the forum. There were some parts which angles were not specified, and some measurements that I could not match with the drawings. I am a beginner builder, so I do not know how crucial they are. 

http://s1378.photobucket.com/user/wilidapili/media/martin%20audio%20215%20mk3%20copy_zpsbc8kcuw9.jpg.html" rel="nofollow">

Here's what my model looks like so far, still got some stuff to do. 

http://s1378.photobucket.com/user/wilidapili/media/Screen%20Shot%202018-08-24%20at%2023.01.25_zpsqsdmxyia.png.html" rel="nofollow">



If I asked really really nicely, could you send your CAD file to me? Beer Meanwhile, waiting for more build pics and info!! 


Posted By: Father-Francis
Date Posted: 24 August 2018 at 9:22pm
Originally posted by wilidapili wilidapili wrote:

I am also in the process of building some Martin Audio 215 mk3 bins! You are much further in the process than I, which is why I would like to ask you some questions if it's ok!

- I started modelling with 18mm ply, but seems like you are using 15mm, any special reason for this?

I've only used 18mm for everything I don't recall posting anything about 15mm . The drawing I used is this one 
http://hornplans.free.fr/martin_mk3.html 

- I have made a CAD drawing from the drawings that can be found on the forum. There were some parts which angles were not specified, and some measurements that I could not match with the drawings. I am a beginner builder, so I do not know how crucial they are. 

Here's what my model looks like so far, still got some stuff to do. 



If I asked really really nicely, could you send your CAD file to me? Beer Meanwhile, waiting for more build pics and info!! I'l be posting few more pics so , been kind of busy 


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Music is the strongest form of magic.(+45 31879997)blakmanpro@gmail.com, foa@sweetboxaudio.dk


Posted By: Father-Francis
Date Posted: 22 September 2018 at 10:35am
Will upload more pics soon 



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Music is the strongest form of magic.(+45 31879997)blakmanpro@gmail.com, foa@sweetboxaudio.dk


Posted By: concept-10
Date Posted: 22 September 2018 at 10:44am
Very nice Smile


Posted By: Dutchman
Date Posted: 23 September 2018 at 12:49pm
Beautiful box! How would this sound like against 6x martin 115? :) 
You care to share the CAD file in pm please? 

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We need more SPL!


Posted By: Father-Francis
Date Posted: 23 September 2018 at 6:01pm
Originally posted by Dutchman Dutchman wrote:

Beautiful box! How would this sound like against 6x martin 115? :) 
You care to share the CAD file in pm please? 
Funny you ask cause am asking myself The same we have 6*115martin i just loade Them with Pd 1550 and They came alive , The kick hit’s you damn good now so i can’t wait to finish the 215’ Tongue


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Music is the strongest form of magic.(+45 31879997)blakmanpro@gmail.com, foa@sweetboxaudio.dk


Posted By: doller
Date Posted: 24 September 2018 at 10:24am
Wiiidapiii Best thing that you can do is get a peice of mdf the size of the bottom panel. Then draw out on that with a good old pencil and a long ruler. You will be able to work out where you are wrong, I would think. Get a carpenters bevel too and a good old protractor. they still work. not digital I know but they work. Wheres my slide rule?


Posted By: BP1Fanatic
Date Posted: 26 September 2018 at 5:31pm
Awesome build Thumbs Up


Posted By: Father-Francis
Date Posted: 27 September 2018 at 9:17am
halfway there and I would like to finish joining this weekend sand them and start painting next week before it gets to cold , it’s been along time since I had these boxes Martin 215 , can’t wait to try them out, and which driver will work out of the two we have , 

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Music is the strongest form of magic.(+45 31879997)blakmanpro@gmail.com, foa@sweetboxaudio.dk


Posted By: discosucks
Date Posted: 27 September 2018 at 10:44pm
Awesome!! 


Posted By: wilidapili
Date Posted: 28 September 2018 at 5:31pm
Thanks for all the photos, looks like you'll have them running in no time!

Sooooo I discovered the stupid mistake I had made after I modelled the cab again, hehe. It was the side panels' length: I had drawn it to be 910, but it is 18mm shorter. This resulted in the 16mm difference in the drawing. I also scaled the original drawing in illustrator to quite closely match the real-life measurements to check the angles and lengths of the corner braces. Both of the braces are 45 degrees with the back panel. The brace touching the baffle is about 62mm from the back panel to the longer corner of the brace, like shown in the photo. 



On another note, have I understood correctly that the baffle and side panel look something like this?





Posted By: Father-Francis
Date Posted: 28 September 2018 at 10:05pm
that’s good you gotten that problem solved am on number five now , should be done tomorrow 😊

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Music is the strongest form of magic.(+45 31879997)blakmanpro@gmail.com, foa@sweetboxaudio.dk


Posted By: Waipy
Date Posted: 02 October 2018 at 9:39am
Hello there, nice to find this post as I have the same plans and going to start building a pair these days. Nice boxes you have there :)
Let me ask you, how are you connecting the speakers internally? in this cab the speakers are supposed to be connected in parallel into one output in the back of the cab, but i cannot get to the idea of how to do this. Could you show some photos? Would be very appreciated.

And by the way, thanks to all the users in here, been reading this forum for years without writing and has helped me a lot.


Posted By: Father-Francis
Date Posted: 02 October 2018 at 4:10pm
Originally posted by Waipy Waipy wrote:

Hello there, nice to find this post as I have the same plans and going to start building a pair these days. Nice boxes you have there :)
Let me ask you, how are you connecting the speakers internally? in this cab the speakers are supposed to be connected in parallel into one output in the back of the cab, but i cannot get to the idea of how to do this. Could you show some photos? Would be very appreciated.

And by the way, thanks to all the users in here, been reading this forum for years without writing and has helped me a lot.
thanks I am going to wire mine  as -1/+1 to one driver and -2/+2 for next driver I intend to use an  X4 Powersoft to run them , am in the process of sanding now will post some pics later 

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Music is the strongest form of magic.(+45 31879997)blakmanpro@gmail.com, foa@sweetboxaudio.dk


Posted By: Waipy
Date Posted: 03 October 2018 at 12:55pm
Thanks for the answer, but I explained myself wrong.

The question is: how are you gonna handle the wiring between drivers and the speakon? I cannot figure how to do the conexion withouth drilling the internal panels.


Posted By: DMorison
Date Posted: 03 October 2018 at 1:43pm
Originally posted by Waipy Waipy wrote:

Thanks for the answer, but I explained myself wrong.

The question is: how are you gonna handle the wiring between drivers and the speakon? I cannot figure how to do the conexion withouth drilling the internal panels.

You do drill the internal panels, route the wire through, then fill the hole with sealant if there's any gaps.


Posted By: Waipy
Date Posted: 03 October 2018 at 2:57pm
That clears everything, thanks.


Posted By: Digbethdave
Date Posted: 16 November 2018 at 1:30am
Check out ace vintage systems, he has at least 24 original boxes, that he has improved 


Posted By: FOO
Date Posted: 25 December 2018 at 8:28pm
Would it be possible to get the plans and files for this cab? I Havent seen these plans with double baffle before.

I would like to make them in singles.. Is this a good idea or does the drivers share the horn? 


Posted By: Father-Francis
Date Posted: 25 December 2018 at 10:41pm
Originally posted by FOO FOO wrote:

Would it be possible to get the plans and files for this cab? I Havent seen these plans with double baffle before.

I would like to make them in singles.. Is this a good idea or does the drivers share the horn? 
The drawing is here  http://hornplans.free.fr/martin_mk3.html" rel="nofollow - http://hornplans.free.fr/martin_mk3.html
The other plans you have to try figure out yourself 


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Music is the strongest form of magic.(+45 31879997)blakmanpro@gmail.com, foa@sweetboxaudio.dk


Posted By: boots-hifi
Date Posted: 26 December 2018 at 1:26am
No such thing as a free lunch!


Posted By: Father-Francis
Date Posted: 26 December 2018 at 4:59am
Originally posted by boots-hifi boots-hifi wrote:

No such thing as a free lunch!
You right about that Boots, we are a group of people working,on the system , I build someone draws so all team work . Nobody is going to be happy with me for giving their work out for free, companies here will charge around 3800kr to do a drawing like that . 


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Music is the strongest form of magic.(+45 31879997)blakmanpro@gmail.com, foa@sweetboxaudio.dk


Posted By: FOO
Date Posted: 26 December 2018 at 8:52am
I am not asking for a free lunch. I can do it by myself.
But that drawing does not tell it all. 
Its missing materiale thickness. Quite important 😁
And the Detail A do not give much information on where it is, and what it is. 
I can figure out its the baffle and the circular pattern is a cutout for the driver surround. But No info on how deep it should be. Some rather important measurements if you ask me 🙂

And then i can see you made double thickness baffle. 
Not a part of the plan. So that must mean some changes in volume and so on 🙂

I understand that alot of work had been put into it. And I do not ask for help for free. I am happy to pay for help. No questions about that 🙂
Cutting files and all that are not needed. But a detailed drawing that is complete would be a better starting point ☺️

3800kr for a drawing doesnt sound totally out of the Ball park.
Technical Engineers Arent cheap labor.. And the coffee dont Come cheap other 😉

Father Francis, are you based in scandinavia since you use kr? 🙂 


Posted By: wilidapili
Date Posted: 26 December 2018 at 10:09am
Originally posted by FOO FOO wrote:

I am not asking for a free lunch. I can do it by myself.
But that drawing does not tell it all. 
Its missing materiale thickness. Quite important 😁
And the Detail A do not give much information on where it is, and what it is. 
I can figure out its the baffle and the circular pattern is a cutout for the driver surround. But No info on how deep it should be. Some rather important measurements if you ask me 🙂

And then i can see you made double thickness baffle. 
Not a part of the plan. So that must mean some changes in volume and so on 🙂

I understand that alot of work had been put into it. And I do not ask for help for free. I am happy to pay for help. No questions about that 🙂
Cutting files and all that are not needed. But a detailed drawing that is complete would be a better starting point ☺️

3800kr for a drawing doesnt sound totally out of the Ball park.
Technical Engineers Arent cheap labor.. And the coffee dont Come cheap other 😉

Father Francis, are you based in scandinavia since you use kr? 🙂 

- Material thickness is 18mm

- If you read the whole thread with thought, you could see from posted photos where "Detail A" is. As I did a double baffle, I made the "letterbox" (rectangular hole) into the other 18mm ply, and the circle cut-out on the other 18mm ply. The circle cut-out was as specified on used drivers' measurements for "rear mount baffle cut-out". I didn't make any other groove for the driver to sit in "deeper" in the baffle. If you want that, you need to freestyle it yourself.

- Double thickness baffle changes the volume of the space where the driver is mounted, yes. How does it affect the end result? I don't really know... 


Posted By: Father-Francis
Date Posted: 26 December 2018 at 10:10am
Originally posted by FOO FOO wrote:

I am not asking for a free lunch. I can do it by myself.
But that drawing does not tell it all. 
Its missing materiale thickness. Quite important 😁
And the Detail A do not give much information on where it is, and what it is. 
I can figure out its the baffle and the circular pattern is a cutout for the driver surround. But No info on how deep it should be. Some rather important measurements if you ask me 🙂

And then i can see you made double thickness baffle. 
Not a part of the plan. So that must mean some changes in volume and so on 🙂

I understand that alot of work had been put into it. And I do not ask for help for free. I am happy to pay for help. No questions about that 🙂
Cutting files and all that are not needed. But a detailed drawing that is complete would be a better starting point ☺️

3800kr for a drawing doesnt sound totally out of the Ball park.
Technical Engineers Arent cheap labor.. And the coffee dont Come cheap other 😉

Father Francis, are you based in scandinavia since you use kr? 🙂 
am in CPH the thing is old cabs were done in 15mm finer I prefer to use 18mm ,and where possible , I make 2x18mm , makes my cabs sound better , hvor er du henne i Denmark ?


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Music is the strongest form of magic.(+45 31879997)blakmanpro@gmail.com, foa@sweetboxaudio.dk


Posted By: FOO
Date Posted: 26 December 2018 at 12:28pm
If its okay im gonna send you i mail.. Easyer to write in danish 🙂


Posted By: IvCu
Date Posted: 26 December 2018 at 5:03pm
Here, this will make some things easier. Be careful with angles and double check, good luck! 


https://3dwarehouse.sketchup.com/model/u9a6612bb-6843-4f19-88eb-396ded275aeb/215-mK3?hl=en " rel="nofollow - https://3dwarehouse.sketchup.com/model/u9a6612bb-6843-4f19-88eb-396ded275aeb/215-mK3?hl=en  ;





Posted By: FOO
Date Posted: 26 December 2018 at 5:20pm
Wow, thanks IvCu!!

Well i guess i have to learn how to use Sketchup then :D

I got Autodesk Inventor, so i will get cracking with sketcing and converting that file to Inventor instead.. Looks nice and tidy!


Thanks again man!




Posted By: IvCu
Date Posted: 26 December 2018 at 5:25pm
No worries! 

It's also possible to convert this file to cnc compatibility as well ;)   


Posted By: FOO
Date Posted: 26 December 2018 at 5:38pm
Well i will have a go at it :D

Can see that the double baffle is made out of 15mm sheets.


Do you know any way to convert it directly. That would save me some time.
Still have a bunch of work to do, double checking the whole thing :D


Posted By: Father-Francis
Date Posted: 26 December 2018 at 8:26pm
Originally posted by FOO FOO wrote:

If its okay im gonna send you i mail.. Easyer to write in danish 🙂
I got your mail, am at some Julefrokost , will reply as soon as I get home , you still didn’t say where you are Boss is it CPH too?


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Music is the strongest form of magic.(+45 31879997)blakmanpro@gmail.com, foa@sweetboxaudio.dk


Posted By: FOO
Date Posted: 26 December 2018 at 8:33pm
Thats fair :D
Gotta get that snaps and sild down the hatch before it gets bad :D

My bad.. 
Im based in Aarhus. Or rather just outside...


Posted By: FOO
Date Posted: 27 December 2018 at 9:53am
Is it a go or no-go to make them as halfs?

The middle divider doesnt go all the way to the front, so the drivers share the horn in some way ? 


Posted By: Father-Francis
Date Posted: 27 December 2018 at 10:31am
Originally posted by FOO FOO wrote:

Is it a go or no-go to make them as halfs?

The middle divider doesnt go all the way to the front, so the drivers share the horn in some way ? 
Risky I would say you might loose alot from doing that boss , why would you want to build it like that , balance will always not be very good, maybe better to build a different box, what do you want you box to do ? 


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Music is the strongest form of magic.(+45 31879997)blakmanpro@gmail.com, foa@sweetboxaudio.dk


Posted By: FOO
Date Posted: 27 December 2018 at 11:33am
It would be a easyer one man lift 🙂 but I guess your right. Better stick to the drawing. I have a faint memory about someone saying that the sound of the bins are partial because of the shared horn. But cant find that post any more. Might be another design Maybe.
But im gonna stick to plans 🙂

Im gonna look for drivers Today. Thinking of 18sound 15lw2400 or 15nlw9401. If they fit.
Or Maybe rcf. Pd is also Nice, but are a bit Hard sounding.


Posted By: Father-Francis
Date Posted: 27 December 2018 at 12:03pm
Originally posted by FOO FOO wrote:

It would be a easyer one man lift 🙂 but I guess your right. Better stick to the drawing. I have a faint memory about someone saying that the sound of the bins are partial because of the shared horn. But cant find that post any more. Might be another design Maybe.
But im gonna stick to plans 🙂

Im gonna look for drivers Today. Thinking of 18sound 15lw2400 or 15nlw9401. If they fit.
Or Maybe rcf. Pd is also Nice, but are a bit Hard sounding.
https://forum.speakerplans.com/martin-115-215-classic-115-long-throw_topic78156.html" rel="nofollow - https://forum.speakerplans.com/martin-115-215-classic-115-long-throw_topic78156.html  Someone asked kind of the same question nobody answered, I use pd1550 go lower and still high enough to meet my mid-top , most people i’ve heard of with these use Pd 1550 ,154, rcf MB15N401, there’s also the fane 15sb, they can all fit if you drop the metal handle which i’l drop in the future, since we are building more of them . 


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Music is the strongest form of magic.(+45 31879997)blakmanpro@gmail.com, foa@sweetboxaudio.dk


Posted By: doller
Date Posted: 03 January 2019 at 10:03am
Firstly really nice build. I really want to ask why would you build 215's. What is your motive? I say that because we are now in 2019 and there are much more modern enclosures. I have heard them many moons ago but have no memory of how they sound. I know people rave about them. are they still that good?
You haven't said a word about how they sound. Please let us know.
What hp and what lp? I know you have those 21's for the sub. But how high do you go to meet the f1's ?


Posted By: Father-Francis
Date Posted: 05 January 2019 at 9:18am
Originally posted by doller doller wrote:

Firstly really nice build. I really want to ask why would you build 215's. What is your motive? I say that because we are now in 2019 and there are much more modern enclosures. I have heard them many moons ago but have no memory of how they sound. I know people rave about them. are they still that good?
You haven't said a word about how they sound. Please let us know.
What hp and what lp? I know you have those 21's for the sub. But how high do you go to meet the f1's ?
The answer to your questions, are in the question itself, you say you hear people rave about them , 
1. The cab is proven, works good for lots of different setups, 
2. Talking about how they sound 🤭am not trying to sell them so no need for advancement, the sound as most people who have used them know , is still in the top five kick bins even made , if you are asking me , 
3. Look up the topics with Martin audio 215mk3 in here and on the net , as I don’t have time to answer stuff we’ve been thru for years , i’l End up writing a book on them . 
https://martin-audio.com/downloads/datasheets/215MkIIIBassHdatasheet.pdf" rel="nofollow - https://martin-audio.com/downloads/datasheets/215MkIIIBassHdatasheet.pdf
https://forum.speakerplans.com/can-martin-215-mk3-or-f2b-keep-up-with-es18-or-usb_topic89467.html" rel="nofollow - https://forum.speakerplans.com/can-martin-215-mk3-or-f2b-keep-up-with-es18-or-usb_topic89467.html
https://billfitzmaurice.info/forum/viewtopic.php?t=20538&start=15" rel="nofollow - https://billfitzmaurice.info/forum/viewtopic.php?t=20538&start=15
Read and learn , today many kicks run 18” or 15” some try 12” , not many do above 180/200hz without being honky , 
If you want to build some , I wouldn’t advise, they are heavy, best used in groups, and sound very good. 🤐🤬🏋🏿‍♂️🤭


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Music is the strongest form of magic.(+45 31879997)blakmanpro@gmail.com, foa@sweetboxaudio.dk


Posted By: doller
Date Posted: 09 January 2019 at 8:14am
thanks FF for the reply. One reason I asked why you would build a vintage cab as such, was I read a thread long ago on the lab horn. A member on here (well respected) Said 'why build a design that is 10 years old there are much more advanced cabs out there' . plus one on all the modern kick cabs. Just what I was thinking. Thanks again and I hope you enjoy them. JBL man says they will hit 800hz but not quite hi fi. LOL.


Posted By: MattStolton
Date Posted: 09 January 2019 at 10:57am
Originally posted by doller doller wrote:

... I asked why you would build a vintage cab as such...


AFAIK, the laws of physics haven't changed much in the last 15B years, if it worked then, should work now!

Only now we have silly power drivers and cheap watts too, and oodles of cheap DSP to fix anything that isn't fixed by ply and cardboard and magnets.

Sounds safer to use a proven design, just sourcing/researching driver choice, then spend months on potentially fruitless R&D?

Any design, old or new, is still a trade off between price, spl and band-width. Choose 2 out 3, and suffer the compromise on the third.


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Matt Stolton - Technical Director (!!!) - http://www.wildingsound.co.uk" rel="nofollow - Wilding Sound Ltd
"Sparkius metiretur vestra" - "Meter Your Mains"


Posted By: toastyghost
Date Posted: 09 January 2019 at 1:37pm
There are real-world products being sold that are variants of this design, in many countries. In some cases, making use of modern components, to get silly output. Hell, most of the 'modern' kick cabs are just variants of the same principle with slightly different design goals.


Posted By: njw
Date Posted: 09 January 2019 at 7:39pm
^^Isn't most Funktion One stuff just some old Turbosound from the 80's painted purple....?   

  To quote another member; I'll get me coat..... LOL

   

  


Posted By: toastyghost
Date Posted: 09 January 2019 at 8:58pm
Hey now, that's not fair. In the last couple years, they've found the 'scale' tool in SketchUp and released 24" and 32" versions too!



Posted By: MattStolton
Date Posted: 10 January 2019 at 10:51am
Originally posted by toastyghost toastyghost wrote:

Hey now, that's not fair. In the last couple years, they've found the 'scale' tool in SketchUp and released 24" and 32" versions too!



That would be funny, if it wasn't tinged with a knats grain of truth!

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Matt Stolton - Technical Director (!!!) - http://www.wildingsound.co.uk" rel="nofollow - Wilding Sound Ltd
"Sparkius metiretur vestra" - "Meter Your Mains"


Posted By: doller
Date Posted: 13 January 2019 at 9:08am
I am all for vintage. I would guess they sound fantastic. And look brutal. I think it depends on what you grew up on. I love that old in ya face kick. Much respect to mr francis. I totaly get his thinking. Just wouldn't want to lug them. I bet it's worth the pain however. Please keep posting to keep the dance stack off the top.


Posted By: toastyghost
Date Posted: 13 January 2019 at 1:05pm
Teenage me stood in front of a huge pile of F2B and that was the first time my jaw dropped from sound, so I have a soft spot for this sort of design. There’s nowt wrong with it!


Posted By: bob4
Date Posted: 13 January 2019 at 5:45pm
Originally posted by doller doller wrote:

Just wouldn't want to lug them.


Like labhorns....


Posted By: toastyghost
Date Posted: 13 January 2019 at 6:47pm
Originally posted by bob4 bob4 wrote:

Originally posted by doller doller wrote:

Just wouldn't want to lug them.


Like labhorns....


Pfft, you guys should try moving a real sub...



Posted By: Father-Francis
Date Posted: 13 January 2019 at 7:04pm
I don't overstand you think these are heavy , they aren't 115kg with the changes , anyway I don't do venues with stairs , If a venue has stairs they can carry the stuff on their own or pay extra for movers . work like a pro , 

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Music is the strongest form of magic.(+45 31879997)blakmanpro@gmail.com, foa@sweetboxaudio.dk


Posted By: doller
Date Posted: 13 January 2019 at 11:39pm
I would think that three of these are about the same size as two lab horns. Push out alot more sound I would think. So well worth the move.
Bob I only take the labs to out door and big Gymnasium type events now. Have done stairs not any more. Trying to move on from them. Just need time to build something else. Got 12x18inch drivers waiting.


Posted By: doller
Date Posted: 13 January 2019 at 11:40pm
Toasty > Yer! that's a lug.


Posted By: FOO
Date Posted: 24 January 2019 at 8:55pm
Any progress on this project Francis? 😄


Posted By: Robbo
Date Posted: 25 January 2019 at 12:00pm
Originally posted by toastyghost toastyghost wrote:

Teenage me stood in front of a huge pile of F2B and that was the first time my jaw dropped from sound, so I have a soft spot for this sort of design. There’s nowt wrong with it!



Kyle--Was that by any chance on a Deep Purple tour a long time ago?


Posted By: MattStolton
Date Posted: 25 January 2019 at 1:49pm
Originally posted by toastyghost toastyghost wrote:

Teenage me stood in front of a huge pile of F2B and that was the first time my jaw dropped from sound, so I have a soft spot for this sort of design. There’s nowt wrong with it!


I am fairly sure if you stood in front of it today, with all your experience, you would still be impressed - 2x15", 500W (peak!) each driver, essentially flat from 40-200, and 107dB 1W/1m!

If you wanted more,
Originally posted by Martin Audio Data Sheet Martin Audio Data Sheet wrote:

"...an additional sub-bass system is useful where high energy levels of energy are required below 40Hz, for example for special effects."


Martin FSX, 2x18", 101db @1 W @ 1m... in big enough stacks "...full output is maintained down to 28Hz..."

As I keep bleating on about, the laws of physics haven't changed; just our fashion for systems measured in MWatts (despite still only making 135+ish dB) and able to reproduce 20Hz like 100Hz.

For live music, the instruments haven't changed that much, only the keyboard and electronically synthed noise will ever create 20Hz, so what is the point?!?

Our desperation to produce that 20-40Hz octave is really distorting our attention away from efficiency, as much as sound quality in other pass bands.


There is a lovely bit in the Martin F2 User guide, where it compares Box A, Box B and Box C.

Box A - 107dB 1W/1m 1000W, Ten cabs in 3 foot of truckspace

Box B - 102dB 1W/1m 1200W, 12 cabs in 3 foot of truckspace

Box C- 102dB 1W/1m 1600, 9 in 3 feet of truckspace.

To produce same SPL as 10x Box A, you need 26 Box B, or 20 Box C. And amplifiers...Twice as many lorries for same SPL...

Obviously Box A is the F2B!


/High Horse
/Rant
/Coat being off

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Matt Stolton - Technical Director (!!!) - http://www.wildingsound.co.uk" rel="nofollow - Wilding Sound Ltd
"Sparkius metiretur vestra" - "Meter Your Mains"


Posted By: fatfreddiescat
Date Posted: 25 January 2019 at 1:54pm
One of if not my favorite all time bass sections, lovely sounding with phenomenal impact.


Posted By: Earplug
Date Posted: 25 January 2019 at 2:01pm
Originally posted by MattStolton MattStolton wrote:



As I keep bleating on about, the laws of physics haven't changed; just our fashion for systems measured in MWatts (despite still only making 135+ish dB) and able to reproduce 20Hz like 100Hz.

For live music, the instruments haven't changed that much, only the keyboard and electronically synthed noise will ever create 20Hz, so what is the point?!?

Our desperation to produce that 20-40Hz octave is really distorting our attention away from efficiency, as much as sound quality in other pass bands.


There is a lovely bit in the Martin F2 User guide, where it compares Box A, Box B and Box C.

Box A - 107dB 1W/1m 1000W, Ten cabs in 3 foot of truckspace

Box B - 102dB 1W/1m 1200W, 12 cabs in 3 foot of truckspace

Box C- 102dB 1W/1m 1600, 9 in 3 feet of truckspace.

To produce same SPL as 10x Box A, you need 26 Box B, or 20 Box C. And amplifiers...Twice as many lorries for same SPL...

Obviously Box A is the F2B!


/High Horse
/Rant
/Coat being off



Clap Clap Clap Thumbs Up Clap Clap Clap




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Earplugs Are For Wimps!


Posted By: Robbo
Date Posted: 25 January 2019 at 2:05pm
F2B is my favourite bass cabinet of all time and I have always preferred the sound of it compared to a mk3 bass horn.
The other good reason for having F2B cabinets is that they are very small for what they can kick out--almost half the size and a lot lighter than a mk3 and also great for truck packs.
The only reason why there are no copies of them knocking about is due to their rarity and not many people hearing them used in anger, as has been discussed in depth before on this forum.
I have a personal hate of the Martin mk2 bass horn as they are extremely "honky" and virtually impossible to get some serious punchy bass out of them even when stacked six high.


Posted By: FOO
Date Posted: 25 January 2019 at 4:36pm
Francis, what drivers did you settle on?

I know you have been talking about PD 1550 and RCF MB15n401. 
But Why the RCF? 5,5mm Xmax??

I am still looking into drivers, but 18sound 15lw2400 and 15nlw9401 still tickles my thoughts.


Posted By: Father-Francis
Date Posted: 25 January 2019 at 6:00pm
Originally posted by FOO FOO wrote:

Francis, what drivers did you settle on?

I know you have been talking about PD 1550 and RCF MB15n401. 
But Why the RCF? 5,5mm Xmax??

I am still looking into drivers, but 18sound 15lw2400 and 15nlw9401 still tickles my thoughts.
I’v Had abit too many things up my sleeve so I still need to sand them put some handles on then I can test, 


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Music is the strongest form of magic.(+45 31879997)blakmanpro@gmail.com, foa@sweetboxaudio.dk


Posted By: Father-Francis
Date Posted: 01 April 2019 at 9:36pm
So did abit of work on the boxes , we soon there



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Music is the strongest form of magic.(+45 31879997)blakmanpro@gmail.com, foa@sweetboxaudio.dk


Posted By: concept-10
Date Posted: 02 April 2019 at 7:02am
Nice 


Posted By: luthier
Date Posted: 02 April 2019 at 8:48am
Looking good Thumbs Up


Posted By: Father-Francis
Date Posted: 03 April 2019 at 9:17am
Thanks guys , I know it's taken some time ,but you know good stuff takes time.
i know one be asking themselves why I got 4 holes in each cab , reason is I don't want loose cables in the cabs , one speaker will be wired 1+1- and the next 2+2- , so when using amps like the X4 ,depending on how many we are using a 4x4mm cable into the first cab and links for the rest and no loose cables inthe box making all kinds of noise , painting starts in the weekend , spraybooth ready and 30kg of warnex ready, so more pics next week 

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Music is the strongest form of magic.(+45 31879997)blakmanpro@gmail.com, foa@sweetboxaudio.dk


Posted By: Waipy
Date Posted: 19 May 2021 at 9:54am
Hey Father-Francis, can't send you a PM yet so I'll reflood this topic...

did the handles fitted nice in the hatch part? i did some calculations long ago for a pd1550 and if they were correct those two wont fit. but that was long ago and i am about to build one.

i thought also on placing two retractile handles in each side were the one that is not in the hatch is if i cant put the ones in the hatch


Posted By: Father-Francis
Date Posted: 13 May 2022 at 7:06pm
so build is long done we got 6 of these kicking about the place, anyway, in afew weeks we should be getting our hands on 4xphilishaves. so next up will be building a nice top for them , any ideas that doesn't cut off peoples heads like the old Jbl ,that martin used in the system before,need something that can keep up two philishaves per side  

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Music is the strongest form of magic.(+45 31879997)blakmanpro@gmail.com, foa@sweetboxaudio.dk


Posted By: Tinnitus Rex
Date Posted: 13 May 2022 at 8:43pm
Beautiful woodwork there!! and they ARE killer bins !
In my experience... three is not high enough to effectively use Philishaves.
 Phillishaves will sound best one aside as they create a highly efficient point source.(stacking more gets exponentially more difficult and needs to be done vertically)
 Ideally, they would be tilted downwards as to not dispose of half of their glorious sound to entertain the pigeons.
The half sized "lady shaves" are a better format but do not sound the same as the co-entrant 2x12  philis ( a ground breaking design even now ! ) They both use  a "phase plug" ( it isnt ) which is basically the same as any compression driver uses to recombine in time the diaphragms area  and then squish it through a smaller exit into a horn . The drivers that martin used had a very shallow dome that fitted the (very heavy) resin "compression  bung".......
As with a lot of things we could say " It was so good ,they had to stop making it!! "  (edit,  sarcasm alert!)
There are far more practical mid hi solutions that will out perform this format , bearing in mind that height will give you more of an initial advantage , and wont try to kill you lifting it .


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"couldn't we just like... use headphones?"


Posted By: Father-Francis
Date Posted: 13 May 2022 at 11:26pm
Originally posted by Tinnitus Rex Tinnitus Rex wrote:

Beautiful woodwork there!! and they ARE killer bins !
In my experience... three is not high enough to effectively use Philishaves.
 Phillishaves will sound best one aside as they create a highly efficient point source.(stacking more gets exponentially more difficult and needs to be done vertically)
 Ideally, they would be tilted downwards as to not dispose of half of their glorious sound to entertain the pigeons.
The half sized "lady shaves" are a better format but do not sound the same as the co-entrant 2x12  philis ( a ground breaking design even now ! ) They both use  a "phase plug" ( it isnt ) which is basically the same as any compression driver uses to recombine in time the diaphragms area  and then squish it through a smaller exit into a horn . The drivers that martin used had a very shallow dome that fitted the (very heavy) resin "compression  bung".......


I hear what you are saying but lots of old pics and some new , i find more than one per side , here is an example 
http://acevintagesystems.co.uk/" rel="nofollow - http://acevintagesystems.co.uk/
I'd say if they did it then it shouldn't be a problem , 
the ones I looked at have phase plugs, and it's kind of a vintage rig we are putting together . 
As with a lot of things we could say " It was so good ,they had to stop making it!! "
There are far more practical mid hi solutions that will out perform this format , bearing in mind that height will give you more of an initial advantage , and wont try to kill you lifting it .


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Music is the strongest form of magic.(+45 31879997)blakmanpro@gmail.com, foa@sweetboxaudio.dk


Posted By: Tinnitus Rex
Date Posted: 14 May 2022 at 12:19am
Cool ,I hadnt seen that before,some nice stuff there  , but that first picture shows what I mean height wise ,who wants a philishave full in the face and how far do you think thats gonna throw? and the lower hf boxes too. It would be ok for a kids party thoughTongue Build two more 215s and your above the problem Smile
An interesting solution for 3 x215s ,Martin did some tall 3x12" with a 2".Very retro !


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"couldn't we just like... use headphones?"


Posted By: Father-Francis
Date Posted: 23 May 2022 at 4:30am
Originally posted by Tinnitus Rex Tinnitus Rex wrote:

Cool ,I hadnt seen that before,some nice stuff there  , but that first picture shows what I mean height wise ,who wants a philishave full in the face and how far do you think thats gonna throw? and the lower hf boxes too. It would be ok for a kids party thoughTongue Build two more 215s and your above the problem Smile
An interesting solution for 3 x215s ,Martin did some tall 3x12" with a 2".Very retro !

Do you mean these 
https://martin-audio.com/downloads/datasheets/F2systemdatasheet.pdf" rel="nofollow - https://martin-audio.com/downloads/datasheets/F2systemdatasheet.pdf


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Music is the strongest form of magic.(+45 31879997)blakmanpro@gmail.com, foa@sweetboxaudio.dk



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