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Need input for Bike build on tight timeline

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Category: General
Forum Name: 12v Powered Systems
Forum Description: From Mini-rigs to ICE, all your low voltage audio needs here...
URL: https://forum.speakerplans.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=104109
Printed Date: 26 October 2020 at 1:38pm
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Topic: Need input for Bike build on tight timeline
Posted By: areohbe
Subject: Need input for Bike build on tight timeline
Date Posted: 07 August 2019 at 4:41pm
I am embarking on my first bike build. I've got an ambitious timeline. I'm hoping to take my new rig to Burning Man at the end of the month.

My inspiration is thanks to David Forbe's wonderful http://www.cathodecorner.com/loudbike/index. - Loud Bike Project. I have the same cargo bike setup. 

On David's bike, the drivers are pointed in opposite directions to provide front and rear sound. I am planning to point all of my main drivers towards the rear to maximize the fun when the bike is parked.  If possible, I'd love to have some small mid range/tweeters pointing to the front so I can enjoy the music while I ride the bike.

A few questions I'd love opinions on from the experts:
  1. Since the woofers take up the entire surface area of the tube enclosure, is it reasonable to mount the tweeters in a separate enclosure mounted on top of the woofer tubes? What is optimal spatial arrangement for open air sound?
  2. I am fairly technical, but am out of my comfort zone with audio/electrical/hardware. It seems like a JAB2 or JAB3 can dramatically simplify a build. I think it eliminates the need crossovers? What modern upgrades would you make to Dave's setup to optimize for ease of use and simplicity?
  3. Dave uses 12"? Will this be a noticeable difference over a 10" woofer? Or is this an opportunity to save some weight?
  4. If I move the speakers to the rear, what is a good option for forward pointing drivers with decent range?
  5. What's the ideal power system to get me: 1) at least 8-12 hours of playback 2) battery that can be recharged via solar 3) at least 1 usb power/cigarette output

Here's my current shopping list:
  • Woofer (x2)
  • Rear Tweeters (x2)
  • Front Speakers (x2)
  • AMP 
  • Wiring
  • USB/Cigarette power port
  • Battery
  • Solar Panel
  • A bunch of other things I am missing?
I don't need world class sound but I def want folks to be impressed at the quality and volume coming from a bike. Smile 

Any help of my questions or filling out my shopping list would be greatly appreciated.



Replies:
Posted By: SamV
Date Posted: 07 August 2019 at 7:18pm
1. Perfectly fine and infact its a better option.
2. Good idea and very cost effective.
3. For the same given power and specs, a 12" driver will be more efficient. The more low end you want the more conage you need, whether it be a bigger driver, or multiple smaller drivers. That thaid if you want low down grunt, you need at least 8-10" minimum.
4. Maybe add a small full range driver facing forwards on the same mounting as you're planning to put the tweeters. Double check phasing.
5. Think about how long you need it to last and work around that. If you make it so that packs back be swapped out even better. Weight is also a big issue. Solar charging is tricky to get right unless you have a big bank of batteries and decent panels.

I'd also look into battery protection/visual feedback so you know when to stop using them. Think about weight and handling. Oh and fuses, fuse the mainlines. And a switch or two. Depending on source you may also need to look into line drivers to boost source signal.


Posted By: areohbe
Date Posted: 07 August 2019 at 8:04pm
Thanks you SamV!

After seeing this bike build, I am second guessing myself. This is a full Boom and would prevent the need for the cargo trailer on my bike.

After reading a bit more about the bipole design of the Boominator, I am wondering if rear facing speakers only is a good approach. It does saves weight.

If I went with rear only, I was considering finding a way to add a sub. Will I get a much richer sound profile having a bipole setup that it's a no brainer to trade off for whatever small amount of low frequency I can squeeze out of sub with rear speakers only?


Posted By: Keivn.Pawlus
Date Posted: 08 August 2019 at 9:13pm
Hello! I think the link to David Forbe's Bike projekt might be broken

2. A built in Dsp/crossover could be very useful and is easy to use. One thing though is that you will need more channels on the amplifier. A normal stereo speaker with bass and tweeter would need 4 channels with a dsp. If you use a passive crossover you would only need 2 channels.  

5. For the usb you will need 5v. Im building a system right now out of two Makita batteries in series so I have 36v. I use one voltage regulator to step down the voltage to 5v. It works very vell. I have this one(  https://www.ebay.com/itm/3A-DC-DC-Buck-Step-down-Converter-Voltage-Regulator-5V-48V-to-3-3V-6V-9V-12V-24V/322915236206?hash=item4b2f3f796e:g:UGcAAOSwAaJaJJOl" rel="nofollow - https://www.ebay.com/itm/3A-DC-DC-Buck-Step-down-Converter-Voltage-Regulator-5V-48V-to-3-3V-6V-9V-12V-24V/322915236206?hash=item4b2f3f796e:g:UGcAAOSwAaJaJJOl  ) 
But there are ones avalible with usb outlets from the beginning.

Makita batteries also have all the protection electronics inside them so I never have to worry about overloading them 


Posted By: SamV
Date Posted: 09 August 2019 at 2:51am
Originally posted by areohbe areohbe wrote:

Thanks you SamV!

After seeing this bike build, I am second guessing myself. This is a full Boom and would prevent the need for the cargo trailer on my bike.

After reading a bit more about the bipole design of the Boominator, I am wondering if rear facing speakers only is a good approach. It does saves weight.

If I went with rear only, I was considering finding a way to add a sub. Will I get a much richer sound profile having a bipole setup that it's a no brainer to trade off for whatever small amount of low frequency I can squeeze out of sub with rear speakers only?

It depends on the drivers you use. In my opinion (I've built 11+ portable systems for critical mass, burning man and various others) anything below 60hz is a bit of a waste outdoors. Sure it sounds nice up close with a bunch of mates but it's a waste of power as it dissipates too quickly when you have 50+ people around you who all want it louder and you've decided to go sub instead of extra full ranger.

My last big system had 4x 12" subs tuned to 62hz, they peaked at 92hz, 6x8" giving 360degree of sound and a bunch of motorola piezos to save on power, it worked incredibly well but then it had two 110ah batteries. It was a fcking pain to cycle 30+ miles though LOL but it did out last the after parties.


Posted By: markie
Date Posted: 09 August 2019 at 2:00pm
How about something really simple but with exceptional quality.

1). 2 x Volt 8" dual concentrics. 150 watts each with 92dB sensitivity, and in a 20 litre cabinet will give -3db of 50Hz. Or you could double up in 2x8 angled front cabs for a 600 watt system.

2). Volt 10" BM251.3. 200 watts each 95dB sensitivity. In a 35 litre cab will get down to 60Hz (-3dB). You'll need to add a small compression driver and a passive crossover. The 8s have a crossover built in.

No need for extra amps, or active crossover, simple builds and quality to blow your mind.


-------------
If it's got wheels or tits it's gonna cost a fortune


Posted By: areohbe
Date Posted: 09 August 2019 at 7:00pm
Alright, the following parts are set to arrive today:
  • Goldwood GW-1058 10" Pro Woofer (4)
  • Piezo Tweeters (4)
  • USB charing port
  • Voltmeter
  • 12v toggle switches for AMP, USB, and voltmeter
I am going to go with a "modular" Boominator design. Two cabinets with 4 speakers each and separate containers for everything else and the battery. Keeping it simple and planning to put in on a Wike heavy duty bike trailer.

I still am little fuzzy on:
  1. Which amp?
  2. What else I need in addition to the amp?
I'm currently looking at the: AOSHIKE 2.1 Channel TPA3116 (https://amzn.to/2KnwBy6).
  • Is this a good option? A lot of the reviews say it really needs 24v. Is that because they are using inefficient speakers?. Will I'll be ok with a 12v SLA?
  • I _think_ I can wire the driver/piezo in series with a resistor between the driver and the piezo. Is that accurate? Do I need a crossover?
If the AOSHIKE is not optimal, what else do I need to round out my setup? Whatever amp I get, I'd like to be able to easily add a volume control knob.

Thanks for all the help.

(Here's the correct link to David's bike: http://www.cathodecorner.com/loudbike/index.html)



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