7 laminates ply birch instead of 13 laminates
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Category: Plans
Forum Name: Scoops
Forum Description: One scoop or two ;-)
URL: https://forum.speakerplans.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=106380
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Topic: 7 laminates ply birch instead of 13 laminates
Posted By: heavydub
Subject: 7 laminates ply birch instead of 13 laminates
Date Posted: 06 July 2021 at 11:30am
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I am building my first superscoop. Unfortunately my wood seller has only 7 laminates 18mm birch panels, instead of 13 laminates as suggested in the scooper plan. Will this make a huge difference? I am more scared about sound quality than build resistance.
I know 13 laminates wood is more dense. If 7 lam is not enougth, could I renforce the external structure with 2x 18mm panels (on both sides and behind) to give more density and better isolation?
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Replies:
Posted By: csg
Date Posted: 06 July 2021 at 11:45am
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Are you sure he is offering you Birch? I wouldn’t be surprised if you are being offered WBP hardwood ply, which is definitely not the same thing
But, stick with 13 laminate, solid void free birch. BB/BB grade is considered the gold standard, however you can save a bit if you only are showing one side by using BB/CP grade which will have one face that will have greater imperfections/ knots etc. that can easily be filled or hidden inside the cab.
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“The fact is this is about identifying what we do best and finding more ways of doing less of it better”
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Posted By: heavydub
Date Posted: 06 July 2021 at 12:54pm
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I have news. Maybe I have the possibility to buy panels with this specs: Birch 18mm 13 laminates BB/CP WBP Marine
Do you think I can use this kind of wood to build the whole structure (internals and externals)? I probably can't find nothing better right now.
I am not searching for the best solution. But I am searching for something that could work very nice.
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Posted By: csg
Date Posted: 06 July 2021 at 1:39pm
That will be just fine, use the BB side on the outside obviously!…
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“The fact is this is about identifying what we do best and finding more ways of doing less of it better”
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Posted By: heavydub
Date Posted: 06 July 2021 at 1:43pm
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Awesome! Just another question: what does the "marine" spec means?
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Posted By: csg
Date Posted: 06 July 2021 at 2:21pm
Marine means that the ply is rated for maritime use, approved by Lloyds of london etc. WBP means that the ply should not delaminate when wet. You dont need or want marine ply for speakers.
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“The fact is this is about identifying what we do best and finding more ways of doing less of it better”
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Posted By: heavydub
Date Posted: 06 July 2021 at 2:33pm
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I don't need or want, ok. But it can be used for speaker box builds without problems? I mean, mechanical resistance, sound quality, density. I've heard it's more difficoult to cut too.
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Posted By: csg
Date Posted: 06 July 2021 at 3:41pm
Never used it for speakers, so i cant comment. I really would stick to the Birch, even if something else is slightly cheaper you will lose those savings bringing the finish up to the same standard as is quite easy with Birch
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“The fact is this is about identifying what we do best and finding more ways of doing less of it better”
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Posted By: VECTORDJ
Date Posted: 06 July 2021 at 9:54pm
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7 Ply Birch is only Birch on the two outer layers....13 ply Birch is Birch every layer...Way better.
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Posted By: JonB67
Date Posted: 06 July 2021 at 10:12pm
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Birch is stiffer, more stable, more void free, easier to machine, easier to screw into, cleaner cutting....
The extra money is worth it twice over.
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Posted By: citizensc
Date Posted: 06 July 2021 at 10:53pm
When I first got in to sound system stuff, people gave me the advice that I should just use birch. I thought it wouldn't be as important for my tops, I built them out of cheaper ply as I was on a tight budget. Within a year, they were turned in to plant pots and I had rebuilt them out of birch. I didn't save money, I wasted money and time. Honestly just use 13 laminate birch, you will not regret it!
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@voyager_soundsystem
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Posted By: heavydub
Date Posted: 07 July 2021 at 12:28pm
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Thank you everybody.
I've found new panels today.
Birch BB/BB quality 18mm 13 laminates
Everything looks good, but I am not sure that phenolic ply is ok. The seller told me that the wood is absolutely birch, the quality is the same as a non-phenolic panel. The only difference is in the glue used to attach each laminate. I guess and I hope that this will be just good to build boxes. What do you guy think? I've searched in the forum info about phenolic birch but I can't find nothing special.
Maybe (but I am not sure) using phenolic birch instead of non-phenolic ply could be better because box should better resist to humidity too?? But again, I don't know. I just hope this wood is ok for scoop building.
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Posted By: csg
Date Posted: 07 July 2021 at 6:16pm
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Are you sure this ply does not have a phenolic face, such as the shiny brown faced flightcase material favoured in Germany? Im guessing as you stated BB/BB it does not, but best to check. Other than that should be fine
Check out sheet material wholesale on google, minimum £500 order, but good prices and they deliver
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“The fact is this is about identifying what we do best and finding more ways of doing less of it better”
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Posted By: heavydub
Date Posted: 07 July 2021 at 6:46pm
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yeah, no brown faces. As I told, the seller said that the only difference is the glue used between each laminate. And I can confirm again quality is BB/BB. Moreover, provenience should be Sweden.
The seller is a wood seller, don't know nothing about speakers. He just said that for external usage he advice phenolic panels. If you are using it for internals, the simple birch without phenolic glue should be just fine.
But now normal is not available and panels dimention is smaller than the phenolic one. I'm in a hurry so I guess tomorrow I will buy phenolic panels. I will post pictures of them. |
Posted By: snowflake
Date Posted: 08 July 2021 at 9:32am
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I haven't used it but you might find phenolic board doesn't take glues the same way as regular ply. I gather it is very waterproof so might not absorb normal water-based wood glue very well.
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