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Bass bins with no cabinet?

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Category: General
Forum Name: Newbie Discussion
Forum Description: Newbie Discussion/Questions. Look less stupid here...
URL: https://forum.speakerplans.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=107709
Printed Date: 05 March 2024 at 1:14pm
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Topic: Bass bins with no cabinet?
Posted By: Lucasdude
Subject: Bass bins with no cabinet?
Date Posted: 19 February 2023 at 7:06pm
Evening all. I was musing the other day about the possibility of a pop up type bass bin, to save on various costs etc when I remembered this product from Celestion many years ago.

https://www.stereophile.com/floorloudspeakers/892/index.html" rel="nofollow - https://www.stereophile.com/floorloudspeakers/892/index.html

While it was obviously aimed at the (well heeled) home user, I'm wondering if there is any practicality at all in scaling it up for PA use. The design is essentially without a cabinet, and both baffles are simply bolted together with spacers. The claimed frequency response is to below 20hz, which certainly falls into the category of a real subwoofer to me! Perhaps some of you more techno minded than me can get your heads around the physics of it!



Replies:
Posted By: Contour
Date Posted: 19 February 2023 at 7:17pm
Google open baffle / dipole / w-frame 


Posted By: Conanski
Date Posted: 20 February 2023 at 5:03am
Originally posted by Lucasdude Lucasdude wrote:

I'm wondering if there is any practicality at all in scaling it up for PA use. 

Nope. In free air at sub bass frequencies a driver has it's lowest power handling and SPL capability.. by probably a factor of 100 or more, it is easily the least efficient way to utilize a driver one could come up with. 


Posted By: bob4
Date Posted: 20 February 2023 at 5:44am
The configuration bears some similarity with Ripole designs, although ripoles tend to have the drivers more closely spaced. 




Posted By: jazomir
Date Posted: 20 February 2023 at 5:00pm
I seem to recall hearing the pairing at a hifi show at the time these cabs were released. IIRC, and the specs bear this out, the bass cabs were very ineffiicient (82db according to the published specs) and needed a 3db boost at 20Hz to obtain a respose to 30Hz but at the show were driven by a pair of huge  mono amps so plenty of available welly. The result was very pleasing - paired with the tops they were reminiscent of Quad ESLs in both good and bad ways. The tops were  crystal clear and the bass was very clean, but a bit insipid - rather as if the cabs were on 'mute'. This sort of 'boxless' loading does produce a very nice sound - but there isn't a lot of it. Possibly using a very powerful driver and feeding it with huge amounts of power would work but not suitable for live work IMHO.  Compare this with the demo of Celestion SR1s and associated bins (drivers all developed using the same laser interferometry and with associated signal processing as with their hifi cousins) around the same time at  Ronnie Scotts - the place was thumping with loads of bass then the compere announced they were going to switch on the bass bins! If you like things loud then open baffle woofers are not the way forward. Just my 2 pence worth.

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For sidefills, can we have two enormous things of a type that might be venerated as Gods by the inhabitants of Easter Island, capable of reaching volumes that would make Beelzebub soil his pants.



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