I've finally overcome myself to post a feedback on my four 1850s I build last automn...
ya, I know, it's been a while ...and actually I've not even finished all four yet, as two of'em two still miss their paint job...
First thing i did after a couple of weekends working on them was mounting the speakons so I could fire them up and judge if I should like how they sound...

Since then, they've been in action, tho not properly finished (which as a matter of fact keeps bothering my ego on and on...) 

Anyway, they really amaze my...after testing the first one (the one I build as a prototype) I've liked its kick in the first place...but after hooking up all four I got literarily blown away!!

In a block of four, they go pretty low, tho not so low as my two 18" sub reflex cabs, but remarkable lower than only the first, single 1850 I mentioned above.  

After all, they are not even loaded with the speakers they are designed for...("NOOBIE!", ...yes I can actually hear over the internet).

I use some Monacor SPH-450TC, I've bought over the 'net, the seller being as ignorant about speaker building as I was. 
I really struck a bargain, since they were only part in a larger deal and I initally didn't intend to buy them. The seller threw them in to conlude the deal we made on a 2nd hand IMG Stageline amp. In the end I payed 80.- CHF (=35£) for one speaker only to excperience a big surprise after I did a bit of a search online. 

I found the SPH-450TC as the Top-of-the-range speaker of monacor's product lines (yeah, well... monacor, any of you UK-people even ever heard of it...?).
I knew, they were only selling OEM far east stuff but when I found the retail price for one SPH-450 listed as 780 CHF (=350£, ok, a genuine 1850 costs more than that, I agree...) I thought I really hit the jackpot this time....

In the first rush, looking for plans to put some wood around those babies, I took the first result google gave me for "speaker plans"...and that is how I really found enlighment (even although I have to confess, that this has happened not at one dash but rather a bit at a time...).

Naïve me, I grabbed the first plans following the order they were listed on speakerplans.com (that's a "Speaker plans"/"Horn plans"/""1850 Horn", isn't it...).
Plus they gave me the nastiest look a speaker could ever give you ("...coool, man, one big opening [also known as the 'mouth' I learned much later...], one can't see the speaker, this's weird...I'm going to be A-class with those bins, man " etc, etc...). My decision was quickly made, plans got printed and asap wood for one prototype was bought.

I started with no more wood-working skills I've had as a graduated student from grammar school three years before (yess, you guess right, I after all knew how to get a nail into a block of wood - and that was about it...).

Finally I finished (...) my four SPH-450TC-loaded 1850s and learned a lot about processing wood - and as a side effect I got infected with the speaker-nutter virus...
My two kitties (four-legged species) love those towers of carpeted cabs I stock in the PA-warehouse that used to be my living room ages ago...  

to come back to topic and to find an end here, then:
   
I use my four 1850s whenever it's possible in the typical stack of four (2 wide with their longer side to the floor, 2 high).
They're being fed a stereo signal (should I change that?) coming off a simple 2-way crossover. Depending on what tops I use, I cross them as far up as to 150 hz, giving my real air pressure with lot's of kick, yessir!

Using a stone-old digital delay unid, I delay the signal for the tops for 4.62~ms, this being the delay I considered the best one. I could only rely on my ears, but I think, it's ok so far.

I have to say, crossing them over (the 1850s) so high only sounds good when they get a relatively high amount of power, in my terms speaking about >400-500w each.  
If not, they tend to sound honky and hollow in upper bass range, so if I don't go to loud, I cross them @ 70-100hz, let the tops do the kick range, using the 1850s as subs only.

I run them off a MacroReference, 2 bins a side, giving me two times approx. 1100-1200wRMS @ 4ohms = 500- 600wRMS per cab.
The could need even more than that, I'm afraid.

But up to now, I'm quite happy, since they are my first build I'll ever love them!

Thanks for reading my confession;

(I really hope I could make some of you smile or even laugh sometimes... )
[but don't mistake me for another speaker-magician around here...]

Now I'm going to get a couple of hours of sleep, 've kept building up my workshop from 11:00pm yesterday up to now...

THX!!

benjamin

gotta find my camera...

so far

benjamin

4.62ms seems good, i calculated that theoretically the delay should be 4.66, thats almost the same!!

 

 

http://www.speakerplans.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=13133 - HERE

Hello Speakerplanners!

Thanks everybody for their friendly welcome
& sorry for my long "radio silence".
I've been really busy these days since carneval's started around here (=lots of work for me...).

However...I finally managed to put a few pics on the net.

here we go:
 
 

side panels are made of OSB - and that's something I can hardly recommend to anybody to do likewise... I simply bought it because it was the only wood my local DIY had on stock that saturday afternoon...

One can forget to ever do a proper paint job on OSB... I tried to fill/sand one (!) side panel (out of 8) and it cost me about four hours work and 500g of filler. I didn't go on that way, since then the cabs have been used "the way they are"...

I routered those handles holes (you can see them good at the lower left cab)...they're in the mouth area of the horn system... so are the in any way affecting the sound of the box (e.g. pressure loss...etc)?
I'm only asking because after all I'm still just a newbie, 'specially in horn theory (however the cabs sound good to me...but as I said in earlier posts, I haven't got any reference).

What do you think?

Here's another one of my 2nd system consisting of four cervin vegas (can't remember the correct model name) & some elder peavey tops.





The tops weight a ton (about 160lbs/74kgs) & they're really efficient. Their only fault is their lack of midbass (they play only above 300hz...). So I got to find a filler for the freq range from 100 to 300 hz ) It doesnt sound good to use the CVs up so heigh. Got a pair of old AAC Elis eating up space in my ex-ling room.



I've never managed to set up a three way system so far and I haven't got a proper LSM to delay all speakers correctly...However I hould give it at least a try (one day, that is...).

Replies & any advices are welcome!

Thanks!

benjamin

I guess that's due to a lower speaker sensitivity (the Monacor SPH-450TC have around 93dbs whereas the PD 1850 's got estimately 98dbs).

So that's allready a bad start for constructing speakers, but I didn't know this as I started my build.
However, I can cross over my 1850s as far up as about 160-180hz, let them play in the kick range, and - yess lord - they do that very well! 

I need to feed them a good amound of power to let them perform, right now it's 500-600w a cab, and they could still need more (I'm guessing up to twice that).
Firing the CVs in a block of four in a similar setup (i.e. 2 cabs @ each channel off an stereo amps delivering 1000-1200w @ 4ohms/channel)  , they give you more air pressure for wattage, meaning they're more efficent.
Also they 'go lower' than the 1850's, so to speak.
In my personal opinion they go pretty low for a horn-style
bass/sub cab (they can compete my 18"s reflex-cabs) 

As a demerit, if I can say so, I can only use them as subs, also only up to 70-90 hz.
That's where they sound good IMO. Anything above a 100, 110hz doesn't work with the CVs as good and precise as with the 1850s.
So there you might need a seperate kick/filler cab, covering 100-200hz.
The 1850 is more flexible here!
No problem to go for a pretty four-stack (...-wall) of 1850s and put your tops (e.g. a simple 15"/2way) directly on top of them.
Even the slim wedge shape design of the CV's (i like that design, btw.) allows one to create a central bass cluster that doesn't eat up that much height as the 1850's do (better to place in front of stages).

To come to an end, I have to say as a conclusion, the CVs and the 1850 (my modification)
are a different kind of cabs.
CVs good for sub use, but ev. need a kick-filler; 1850 a astonishing allround-bass cab, performing excellent up to around 180hz, if they have to.
Anyway I must say I didn't use the correct speakers for the 1850s!
Nevertheless they're first-rate bass cabs, I wonder how they'd sound with the right speakers in them...

so much to that!

thank you Mr. Mogale, if you ever read this, the 1850 is a GREAT cab!!

hope I could help...

benjamin

Yupp, one day then, when I'll have time 'n money to do so...

Anyhow, I ain't got a clue yet, where to get them from...!
PD's seem abit hard to find, especially in these neck of the woods...

(and yes, they cost some serious money, methinks...)

After all I read here on this forum, I think there are maybe only two possible "real" drivers for the 1850, namely the mentioned PD1850, plus Void's big bertha 1000 (can't remember the correct name...).  

For using other speakers, the 1860 cab would be a better choice (which is in some way just a 1850 mod to better fit [accustically] a variation of several speakers).

However, the 1850 loaded with the right speaker would be the real deal to me...

benjamin