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Printed From: Speakerplans.com
Category: Plans
Forum Name: New Projects Forum
Forum Description: Forum for new speakerplans projects, in memory of Tony Wilkes, 1953 - 2014
URL: https://forum.speakerplans.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=30258
Printed Date: 26 February 2024 at 7:42am
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 12.06 - https://www.webwizforums.com


Topic: .
Posted By: cyte
Subject: .
Date Posted: 03 September 2009 at 9:30pm
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Replies:
Posted By: adambomb
Date Posted: 03 September 2009 at 10:07pm
How the hell did you get the Stasys X plans? Rog gunna be mad!!

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http://www.freespeakerplans.com" rel="nofollow - www.freespeakerplans.com


Posted By: cyte
Date Posted: 03 September 2009 at 10:46pm

haha, do you think he'll believe me that I came up with this plan myself? I can't believe its THAT similar to the stasys X. I'd quite like to build it without infringing on his patent!!


Posted By: minaximal
Date Posted: 03 September 2009 at 11:08pm
your lower ported chamber will act as a helmholtz absorber, and would be effective to take a peak out of the combined response in the short and long horns.

it will not produce higher frequencies, and getting the two horns outputs in phase is almost? impossible.

unless you can simulate or know the maths and are a good guesser, the design as is above would be a pig to proto and get sounding nice.

but why not have a go, and see what you think.

p.s. good luck


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Subs + Barges = :)

http://www.metaacoustics.com" rel="nofollow - www.metaacoustics.com



Posted By: cyte
Date Posted: 03 September 2009 at 11:25pm
I thought it might do that, but I didn't know it was called a helmholtz absorber! thanks.
As for prototyping, i'm probably going to try some serious simulation and maths before I go anywhere near a saw. This is more a learning exercise for me than anything. I designed a simple band pass sub a while ago and learnt a LOT from that, so now i'm stepping up my game a bit!

thanks for the help


Posted By: fuzzylogic
Date Posted: 04 September 2009 at 12:36am
Do the maths ,get some dimensions going on,and there is a saw and three sheets of ply at the workshop with your name on it!

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NEIGHBOURHOOD SOUNDSYSTEM
Infinitely baffled.



Posted By: cyte
Date Posted: 04 September 2009 at 12:56pm

nice one! it'll probably be a while before I come up with a working plan though! What time are you loading up today? Give me a shout.


Posted By: Taterworks
Date Posted: 18 September 2009 at 4:10am
This looks like something you'd need Akabak to simulate. Hornresp can do combined back and front horns, but I've never played around with that functionality.

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The Gearmonger


Posted By: ericlee
Date Posted: 21 September 2009 at 7:12am
Good! Design is good!


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I am Manufacturer owner from CHINA


Posted By: bitzo
Date Posted: 21 September 2009 at 11:02am
Originally posted by Taterworks Taterworks wrote:

This looks like something you'd need Akabak to simulate. Hornresp can do combined back and front horns, but I've never played around with that functionality.

you can with compound driver arrangement. But for the 3 chambers vent you need akabak at all.

cheers, bitzo


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http://www.unitedroots.it - United Roots SoundSystem site


Posted By: char355
Date Posted: 05 February 2010 at 3:01am
Did this project ever go any further?

its similar to something I've been thinking about.

I've never seen the inside of the stasys x but i suspect my design is very similar, how close can it be without getting in trouble?




Posted By: FlipC
Date Posted: 05 February 2010 at 6:14am
I wouldn't worry about it to much less you cut one up and copied it per bat-em.
Not like the HD15 or the C, G, etc are original. Just a known design arranged for specific driver.



Posted By: char355
Date Posted: 05 February 2010 at 7:24am
Good, like i said, never seen the inside I'm just guessing. I was impressed with the ones I've heard so thought i would see if i could come up with something similar. its a series-tunes bandpass / horn hybrid. The bandpass part is easy enough to design and so is the horn but i have no idea how they would work together. hopefully someone could point me in the right direction?

something nice and complicated for when i cant sleep at 7 in the morning!


Posted By: mobiele eenheid
Date Posted: 05 February 2010 at 8:03am
Look at it as a overall band pass enclosure: The series tuned bandpass giving output centered around 30-40 Hz (much like an ordinary reflex) and the horn part coming in around 50-80 Hz. The more so as frequency increases from that point.
 
Off course making an AkAbak-script will make it even easier. I can look one up for you, or can you do it yourself?
 
Best regards Johan


Posted By: char355
Date Posted: 05 February 2010 at 8:38am
Thanks Johan. i've never used Akabak though, everything i've done so far has been with winisd, bassbox pro and hornresp (still trying to get my head around hornresp tbh). maybe its something i should look at before attempting this. still relatively new to speaker design in general too but i think im picking it up quite quickly.

this is what i have so far, different internal ports though.




Posted By: mobiele eenheid
Date Posted: 05 February 2010 at 9:39am
Looks good!
 
Hornresp is easier and quicker to work with then AkAbak. Ussually the order is WinISD Pro/Bass Box Pro, Hornresp, AkAbak. Hornresp allows you to make a port assisted horn, the change of horn/reflex parameters can be compared to previous results in the blink of an eye. AkAbak is the only program (that I know about) that will make you use parameters for the second chamber and port that make any sense. It's kinda slow to work with though but the possibilities are endless.
 
Hornresp allows you to make a port assisted horn and export it as an AkAbak script. The only thing you have to do then is to put a second chamber and port between the radiator asigned to the original (= first) port and the rear chamber.
 
Personally I got better results with a large rear chamber (say 150 liter plus for an 18") and the secundairy port shorter then the first.
 
See my next post for a script ;)
 
Best regards Johan
 
 


Posted By: mobiele eenheid
Date Posted: 05 February 2010 at 9:41am

Def_Const
{
S1  =      555e-4; 
S2  =     4200e-4; 

L12 =       90e-2; 

Vtc =    40000e-6;
Atc =     2550e-4;

Vrc =      165e-3;
Lrc =       30e-2; 

Lpt =       15e-2;
Ap  =      555e-4; 

Vpc =       55e-3;
Lpc =       12e-2;

Lpt2 =      25e-2;
Ap2  =     555e-4; 

|Parameter Conversions:

Sd  = 1225.00e-4; 

Arc = Vrc / Lrc;

Apc = Vpc / Lpc;

Ltc = Vtc / Atc;
}
|=====================================================================================

|Network node numbers for this horn-loaded vented-box system:

|                                                                     0-Voltage-1
|                                                                                      |
|Radiator(1)-99-Port-2-Chamber-3-Port-4-Chamber-5-Driver-6-Chamber-7-Segment-8-Radiator(2)

|=====================================================================================

Def_Driver 'Driver'
  Sd=1225.00cm2
  Bl=24.73Tm
  Cms=1.39E-04m/N
  Rms=4.89Ns/m
  fs=31Hz 
  Le=2.30mH
  Re=5.00ohm
  ExpoLe=1

System 'System'
  Driver Def='Driver''Driver'
    Node=1=0=6=5
  Radiator 'Port outlet'
    Node=99
    SD={Ap2}
    Label=1
  Duct 'Port tube 1'
    Node=3=4
    SD={Ap}
    Len={Lpt}
    Visc=0
  Duct 'Rear chamber 1'
    Node=4=5
    SD={Arc}
    Len={Lrc}
    Visc=0
  Duct 'Throat chamber'
    Node=6=7
    SD={Atc}
    Len={Ltc}
    Visc=0
  Waveguide 'Horn segment 1'
    Node=7=8
    STh={S1}
    SMo={S2}
    Len={L12}
    Conical
  Radiator 'Horn mouth'
    Node=8
    SD={S2}
    Label=2
 Duct 'Port Chamber'
    Node=2=3
    SD={Apc}
    Len={Lpc}
    Visc=0
  Duct 'Port tube 2'
    Node=99=2
    SD={Ap2}
    Len={Lpt2}
    Visc=0

 
With the script highlighted: Sum: Acoustic Pressure: In these tabs, voltage 2,83 V for 1W/1m, showing phase gives a good idea of the final tuning.
 
With the script highlighted: Inspect: Excursion: In these tabs, select driver (diaph) driver, range ordinate say 0 - 2,5 cm and 90 V input voltage roughly equals 1000 W (into 8 ohm, see Hornresp guide in the newby-section for details).
 
Best regards Johan


Posted By: char355
Date Posted: 05 February 2010 at 9:58am
Thanks. I'm playing around with making the rear chamber larger but don't want to make the horn shorter or the overall size larger. think I'm in over my head with this design though, I'm still learning a lot of the basics. maybe someone else might be interested in the design and do some work for me! Wink


Posted By: staiper
Date Posted: 05 February 2010 at 10:46am
Looks very "X" Smile
I have tested one with similar system but a bit different folding schema  (but single driver version, chipboard - for test only)
Works like charm, SPL+ depth + rapid kick .
Thought that cabinet is pretty messy for DIY-ing.
Planned to test double version (all panels already cut prepared out of 15mm ply .. but unfortunately no more adequate 18" drivers for test .. so to will wait some better times as pile of panels :)

In my opinion those are nice hybrid of FLH and DTBR-s ...gives excellent "one compact bass box for all" solution.  However if space/stacking is not problem big stack of standard horns will give you ~ same extension and higher SPL .. but than tradeoff is size.

Those hybrids seems to give nice LF extension and superb kick even from single pretty compact cabinet. Ofcourse , stacking in multiples will improve thing even more (but not as much as standard horns benefit in big stack)




Posted By: mykey
Date Posted: 05 February 2010 at 10:53am
did you do the cabinet like a schematic layout staiper?

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......just all them hanging there like giant bananas.



Posted By: staiper
Date Posted: 05 February 2010 at 11:11am
Originally posted by mykey mykey wrote:

did you do the cabinet like a schematic layout staiper?


Not .. same system (front horn + two chambers - serial tuned , like on that schematic) but different internal folding / chamber volumes.  .. not big philosophy , theory is same Big smile


Posted By: char355
Date Posted: 05 February 2010 at 11:14am
was just thinking about going to get some chipboard to mess around with, but oh yea, i need some drivers too! might see what i can do with some 15s without changing it too much.


Posted By: mykey
Date Posted: 05 February 2010 at 11:25am
Originally posted by staiper staiper wrote:

Originally posted by mykey mykey wrote:

did you do the cabinet like a schematic layout staiper?


Not .. same system (front horn + two chambers - serial tuned , like on that schematic) but different internal folding / chamber volumes.  .. not big philosophy , theory is same Big smile
No, I meant build it on a bench with a schematic layout like this

....easier? harder? more fun?

then the best part is fitting it in to the space required, IE: cabinet

http://img231.imageshack.us/i/111dy.jpg/">


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......just all them hanging there like giant bananas.



Posted By: darkmatter
Date Posted: 05 February 2010 at 1:10pm
Mykey - I think that'd be a great way to do it and would allow you to tweak the tuning as required. However, the difficulty is working out a way to do it that's tweakable while still keeping the port output aligned with the horn mouth, as it seems the crucial bit in this sort of design is the phase alignment between port output and horn output.


Posted By: subbass
Date Posted: 05 February 2010 at 2:31pm
looks a bit stasys Xish to me Tongue


Posted By: char355
Date Posted: 05 February 2010 at 3:22pm
I'm sure they have nothing to worry about.

brilliant idea mykey.


Posted By: mykey
Date Posted: 05 February 2010 at 4:39pm
Originally posted by darkmatter darkmatter wrote:

Mykey - I think that'd be a great way to do it and would allow you to tweak the tuning as required. However, the difficulty is working out a way to do it that's tweakable while still keeping the port output aligned with the horn mouth, as it seems the crucial bit in this sort of design is the phase alignment between port output and horn output.
don't take the sketch  literally, you can bend the whole thing into a 'U' shape, so the port ends up in line with the horn mouth

  http://img222.imageshack.us/i/11112n.jpg/">


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......just all them hanging there like giant bananas.



Posted By: darkmatter
Date Posted: 08 February 2010 at 12:55pm
Yeah I thought you would have meant it like that mate, I just meant that as soon as you start tweaking the layout above the lengths and therefore the alignment would change. Def the best way to go about it though I reckon.



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