Perfect low/sub for the Turbosound TXD-081
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Topic: Perfect low/sub for the Turbosound TXD-081
Posted By: 4AC
Subject: Perfect low/sub for the Turbosound TXD-081
Date Posted: 19 September 2010 at 12:31pm
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Hello to all you friendly people, As the title says, I am looking for a low/sub woofer to combine with a pair of Turbosound TXD-081 speakers I have lying around here. Here's a specsheet: ftp://ftp.turbosound.com/datasheets/txd081.pdf - ftp://ftp.turbosound.com/datasheets/txd081.pdf Absolutely amazing speakers; very loud, good quality, compact... well, I just like them very much for the money. The speakers are powered by the Crown XTi1000. Good amplifier with build-in audio processor. And that's pretty handy, but not really comparable to the real professional stuff.. Here's a specsheet: http://www.crownaudio.com/pdf/amps/139472-3.pdf - http://www.crownaudio.com/pdf/amps/139472-3.pdf The amplifier suits reasonable to the speakers. But for good headroom in all situations I would recommend a amplifier from around 500-600 watts @ 8 ohm (rather than 275). And now my question to you guys: what low/sub cabinet will suit nice to my turbo's? I know a lot of subs will do the job. But I am looking for the PERFECT MATCH (and I'm the critical type of guy). I was thinking of a 15" BR? Double 12"? I prefer a single-driver cabinet, because of the costs. Sound quality is the main desire. Second is the sensitivity or SPL. Third is the size. WEIGHT IS NOT A ISSUE! (150kg or 15kg, I don't mind at all) I hope that anyone nows the answer to this! Thanks a lot, Greetings, Teun (4AC) |
Replies:
Posted By: 4AC
Date Posted: 19 September 2010 at 1:00pm
BTW, the idea is to use the same handles on both sides of the sub like this: Both sides are like one very large handle. I used this monitor once, and the practibility and handling was stunning with this handles. Further, the LOOK of the cabinet will be mostly the same as the TXD-081, so turbo-blue and the same painting.  Greetings, Teun |
Posted By: Sheggy
Date Posted: 19 September 2010 at 1:30pm
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I would go for a simple low-tuned 18" reflex box. I would make two with top hats so you can mount your TXDs on poles. There are lots of easy to build 18" reflex designs out there and they would give good punchy low bass to meet the clear mid of your cabs. You would need another amp, something that could do sub but you might not need a xover if that amp has a sub out and time alignment won't be ness. Would be a nice little system if you spend the money on good components. S |
Posted By: Meat
Date Posted: 19 September 2010 at 1:49pm
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I was happy with my Ciare 12.00SW loaded mini sub and other people have built similar with the BMS 12S330 (which can go a bit lower in a similar size box at the expense of sensitivity). As the maximum continuous SPL of your tops is only 116dB I'd go for a single 12" with either of the above or similar drivers. I'd also use 4ohm drivers to keep the cost of powering them down. ------------- Don't test the champignon sound |
Posted By: 4AC
Date Posted: 19 September 2010 at 5:43pm
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Thanks for your quick replies! Well, you're right about the amp. Before I buy a second one (XTI2000 ore what-ever) it will go fine by using one channel for the turbo's and the second channel for the subs. I used this configuration before, successfully. The amp has a built-in crossover, eq, pink-noise, delay, limiter, etc. etc. No problem at all! And, it does relatively fine on low. No comparison to a macrotech 5000 or crest 9001, but, that aint a comparison at all if you look to price, weight and go on. A 18" br, I wonder if that would be the bes option, quality-wise. This kinda sub propably won't go high enough and my turbo's won't go low enough. I think there will be a 'gap' between the sub and the top. The Ciare in a BR also isn't the way in my opinion. You can do 2 things with them: - loud and not low - low and not loud Also the driver needs a lot of power to get them really moving. To get everything where you buy them for. I don't worry much about the SPL of my tops. When crossed relatively high (let's say, 150 hz and on) they are louder than the specs assume. More ideas are always welcome! Greetings, Teun |
Posted By: 4AC
Date Posted: 19 September 2010 at 5:43pm
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Like I said before, I am pretty critical about my sound. Excuse me for that  Some more information: The equipment will mainly be used INSIDE. Maybe 4, 5 times outdoor. For any kind of sound, from music-playback to a live/band or so. Difficulty of the built doesn't bother either. If I can't do it, someone else will do it for me. No problem.  The reason that I was thinking of a BR, is because they mostly have a very linear response to the whole sound-spectrum. My other option is to buy second-hand gear. Maybe I should open a new topic about that here. Options that I have already seen before are: - EAW SB150r (with MX100) - Kling & Freitag SW115D - Dynacord CP15-1 (and CP 12-1, but they don't go loud- and low enough?) - Turbosound 15" sub (TXD or Live/TL series) - EV SB122 (very ugly aesthetics) I Know what it will cost me when I buy one of these second hand. Now I'm looking what I will get for my money when I built one. |
Posted By: ceharden
Date Posted: 19 September 2010 at 6:15pm
| Single 15" reflex is almost certainly the way to go. For example I've got a couple on the go at the moment which are a Beyma 15LX60 in an 80L box. Won't go very low (ie below about 45Hz) but quite efficient and very compact. |
Posted By: 4AC
Date Posted: 19 September 2010 at 6:39pm
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OK, that's what I was thinking too. But, why should I use a BR instead of a BandPass or hybrid/ARLS? Witch design and woofer will give me the most linear response from -let's say- 45 hz to 150 hz? Greetings, Teun |
Posted By: Tony Wilkes
Date Posted: 19 September 2010 at 7:05pm
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Loads of suitable 15" drivers out there just depends on your budget. Choose from one of the top brands and you will not go far wrong. IMHO it needs to be BR because you will need it to play fairly high. Look for one that you know will work and sound good up to at least 250 hz. It does look at though you have already made your mind up though and would just like a little mutual cuddle. Tony ------------- www.forteaudio.eu - BMS - db-Mark Processors - Lexon (SAE) |
Posted By: ceharden
Date Posted: 19 September 2010 at 7:06pm
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Bandpass won't go high enough to cleanly meet the 8", you need a direct radiator. Hybrid horn/reflex systems tend to be very efficient but also quite large. |
Posted By: Tony Wilkes
Date Posted: 19 September 2010 at 7:10pm
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He really does not need the output though Chris if they just have to keep up with the 8" jobbies. My double 8" units are looked after by a single 15" per side pretty much like the box you described i.e. 80L tuned 42hz. Tony ------------- www.forteaudio.eu - BMS - db-Mark Processors - Lexon (SAE) |
Posted By: 4AC
Date Posted: 19 September 2010 at 7:16pm
Hahahaa, I guess you're a little right about that...  What para-meters (is that ok in english?) are important for me? Is it possible to say what the fs MUST be or that the xmax must be at least 7mm or something like that? Maybe the... FaitalPro 15XL1400 Ciare 15.75Ndw2 (I can get one of these for 75 euro's, NP +/- 350) Beyma SM115 Beyma 15" g400 ??? |
Tony Wilkes wrote:Posted By: ceharden
Date Posted: 19 September 2010 at 9:26pm
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As a general rule, the fs should be close to what you expect the tuning frequency of the box would be. However there are lots of drivers with an fs in the 35-40Hz region so that doesn't narrow it down much. One to consider might be the 18Sound 15LW1401, they sound very nice. In terms of finding one which will be a bit faster and play up to the 8" mid-top well, look at the mms and choose one which is lighter if possible. What you might tend to find is the lighter drivers with stronger motors might look a little lacking in the bottom of the range however this can be corrected with a little EQ as most decent drivers will have sufficient excursion and power handling for this not to be a problem. |
Posted By: GekoMusic94
Date Posted: 20 September 2010 at 1:06pm
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Your perfect sub: MTH-30. Very good response, it goes low, and have (With RCF 12G301) 128 db of SPL! I use my with 4 FBT Jolly 8ra (114db SPL, 8"). Here is the video of the test  .The mic distorts badly because of the SPL  ...------------- https://soundcloud.com/dj-uber |
Posted By: Sheggy
Date Posted: 20 September 2010 at 6:44pm
I don't think so. 18" reflex is a good option and will easily meet your MTs but maybe you want a weak little bass sound |
Posted By: 4AC
Date Posted: 20 September 2010 at 9:58pm
Ok, that's your opinion then. The physics tell me that a 18" BR just wouldn't go high enough. A Turbosound TSW118 would do the job (like 250 hz max), but they are way to large and to pricey. And nr.1: they are way to loud. The bass isn't the major thing in music, it may not overrule the rest. And, in my opinion, you don't know what you're talking about if you're saying that without a 18" driver you will get a "weak little bass sound". A pretty dumb thing to say... Thanks for your reactions! Greetings, Teun |
Posted By: 4AC
Date Posted: 20 September 2010 at 10:25pm
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Hello everybody, What do you guys think of this woofer for my applications: http://www.ciare.com/pdf/catalogo/PW395ND.PDF - http://www.ciare.com/pdf/catalogo/PW395ND.PDF ? Greetings, Teun |
Posted By: Sheggy
Date Posted: 21 September 2010 at 1:45pm
Relax, I was just teasing because you rejected my suggestion so readiliy. What I'm saying is that all 18" designs I've seen will play high enough to meet your MTs but if you want to cross the TXDs over as high as 250 Hz, then that's up to you. IIRC, the recommended sub for those is an 18" reflex that only goes up to 150 Hz or so. A 15" or 12" can be tuned low enough but if you can cope with a larger box why not? Reflex are an easy build and won't need time alignment. You don't say how you'll use the system or what kind of music it'll be used for but the combination of an 8+1 on top of an 18 or 15" reflex is a proven design for a small portable system. S |
Posted By: 4AC
Date Posted: 24 September 2010 at 2:55pm
Excuse me, because my English isn't quite a 100% I don't understand everythinh the way that I wish to. I don't want to cross my MH's to 250 hz. I usually run them from 120-150 hertz or alike and up. The system will be mostly used inside. For simple playing music. All kind of styles. I also have 4 or 5 times a year an outside event for this system. The audience won't be larger then, well, 50 to 60 people MAX. Thanks for your reaction! I have a new question. I just found these designs: http://speakersdiy.weebly.com/uploads/4/3/8/7/4387513/4105127_orig.png - http://speakersdiy.weebly.com/uploads/4/3/8/7/4387513/4105127_orig.png http://speakersdiy.weebly.com/uploads/4/3/8/7/4387513/1943096_orig.png - http://speakersdiy.weebly.com/uploads/4/3/8/7/4387513/1943096_orig.png Is it possible to find a woofer that fits in one of these designs? So, turn the whole thing around, find a suitable driver for a design. Not a suitable design to a driver. Haha If I could build one of these... well, that would be perfect! Greetings, Teun |
Posted By: 4AC
Date Posted: 30 September 2010 at 6:39pm
| Bump-y-bump |
Posted By: 4AC
Date Posted: 23 October 2013 at 11:07am
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So, it's been a while! I've used a 10" frontloaded sub, a 15" bandpass and even an 18" subwoofer along these Turbo's. And since a month or so I use an slightly modified 'PAL12' tapped horn. The speaker I used is a Ciare 12.00SW, wich has been collecting dust on a shelf for way too long. It al began with this:  Despite some errors caused by my CNC-cutter, the sub fitted nicely.  The rabbit seemed to agree   Here it is, all glue'ed up and ready for some serious sanding&filling  I decided to use the reflector panel, where normally the wheels are placed, as an connector panel.  As you can see, the connector panel is recessed in to the cabinet, so placing it closely against a wall is possible.  After the filler I applied a layer of primer (just to be sure...).  The paint itself is Trimite J136, instead of the more obvious choice Warnex. I was able to buy these for a real bargain price  I am really happy with the finish. I applied it with a structure roller (don't know if that is the correct name sorry).  The connector panel again  Ta-daa  And of course I added my own little touch to it...  And here it is 'at home'  And yes the Ciare woofer is 'visually well used'. First listening impressions are definitely positive. This thing really performs in the sub-low regions; I have not been able to find a song which included a lower note then this sub can handle. It easily pushes hard in the 30-35 Hz region, 30 Hz just as easy as 40- or 50 Hz. A pretty incredible experience at the SPL this sub can reach, to say the least. I do notice that this design has some difficulties producing the more higher regions of bass, for example the ‘hmmm’ or the ‘humming’ sound, also known as kick-bass (the bass that really hits you). Very prominent in nineties electronical music. I suspect it being the 70-120 Hz region. Nevertheless this sub is very musical, you can hear the different pitches/levels/stages in the bass. For that matter this sub passed all my demands, the ‘one-note bass’ I often hear on the larger festivals (in NL) really irritates me. The the higher regions in bass are just less prominent with this design. Concluding; I highly recommend this design to everyone that is looking for a relatively compact (it is NOT small) subwoofer that can easily reach 30 Hz, and is planning to use them either with a dedicated kickbass cabinet or a ‘hefty’ full range speaker. Oh, by the way, I power this sub with a bridged QSC PLX1602. The TXD-081's are also powered by a PLX1602, but then obviously in stereo. These speakers will soon be replaced by something that DOES produce the high-bass to accompany this sub. The PLX’s will be replaced as well, by a 4-channel lightweight. Teun (4AC) All-in-one picture:  And yeah yeah, a decent 19" rack is also on the to-do list Greeting, Teun (4AC) ------------- uǝɿɿɐʌǝ6ɯo sı ʇsʞǝʇ ǝzǝp |