P. Audio C18-650el in PD1850 horn
Printed From: Speakerplans.com
Category: Plans
Forum Name: 1850 and 186 horns
Forum Description: Discussion / Questions about the 1850 and 186 horns
URL: https://forum.speakerplans.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=4793
Printed Date: 24 April 2024 at 6:08am
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 12.06 - https://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: P. Audio C18-650el in PD1850 horn
Posted By: JOngix
Subject: P. Audio C18-650el in PD1850 horn
Date Posted: 25 April 2006 at 6:03am
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hey how about using a P. Audio driver in PD1850 horn... P.Audio modelled C18-650el... it was said in the plan that PD1850 and other drivers with EBP over 125 and BL's over 28 can use this horn cabinet. P.Audio C18-650el has BL' that is over 28 specifically it has 30.78 T-M... so I presume it will work.... what can you say about that? please help... TS PARAMETERS
Size: 18" ------------- Soundcheck |
Replies:
Posted By: Mark James
Date Posted: 25 April 2006 at 8:45am
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the ts arnt horrendusly different actualy, i originaly thought it wouldnt, [and im still not convinced it will] but looking at it, its never going to be as good as the 1850. but its got a better chance than i originaly thought! any one more quilified wanna offer an opinion? ------------- me so horny me love you long throw horn loaded for her pleasure |
Posted By: Mark James
Date Posted: 25 April 2006 at 8:47am
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then i saw the x-max, i dont know if this is going to work, i was lokking at the 186, but the x-max is still alot lower than id hope for this purpose! ------------- me so horny me love you long throw horn loaded for her pleasure |
Posted By: JOngix
Date Posted: 25 April 2006 at 9:32am
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what's the importance of this XMAX? are they that important in the criteria of PD1850 horn... will this P.Audio driver be useless if I put it in 1850 horn? or it will work but not that heavy as PD1850 does? even I have low Xmax and all other PArameters are almost the same does this sound poor? was this driver (P. Audio) are intended for horn application or bandpass or bass reflex, etc....?  ------------- Soundcheck |
Posted By: Mircea Bartic
Date Posted: 02 May 2006 at 6:08am
a quick hornresp plot says it works well  plot made with one unit in a corner 1W just make sure the driver fits into the rear chamber ------------- general manager & head designer at nexus-acoustics research http://www.facebook.com/nexus.acoustics.research" rel="nofollow - http://www.facebook.com/nexus.acoustics.research Ex Nexus_3 |
Posted By: Mark James
Date Posted: 02 May 2006 at 9:19am
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@nexus 3 would it work in the 186 horn? if so im going to order four next month! ------------- me so horny me love you long throw horn loaded for her pleasure |
Posted By: JOngix
Date Posted: 08 May 2006 at 5:04am
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thank you so much for your support... now i can buy the P. Audio driver with no doubt! cheers!
------------- Soundcheck |
Posted By: Pozest
Date Posted: 26 March 2008 at 12:24pm
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Hi, did the P Audio driver fit into the 1850 cab? I own 4 drivers and i'm loving the 1850 cab so i want to build some, but don't want to waste the cash on ply if it doesn't fit. ------------- Can you feel the BASS! |
Posted By: Jake_Fielder
Date Posted: 26 March 2008 at 12:45pm
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Xmax (mm) means how far the cone can move backwards and forwards while still being controlled by the magnet, If its exceeded then your driver will distort. If Xdam is exceeded then the driver will destroy itself!
Generalisation> So a small Xmax means than that at low frequencys and high power the driver is more likley to get damaged than a driver with a large xmax, (there is other stuff to take into account though)
[[[haha just realised i was replying to a 2 year old bit of the thread!]]]
To answer you Pozest, im not really sure, i would have thought that the 186horn would be more appropriate. hopefully someone else can help u theough!!!
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Posted By: Pozest
Date Posted: 26 March 2008 at 12:55pm
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Thanks Jake_Fielder, you rekon the 186 is a better option or should I settle for scoops? for my C18-el650s. At the moment the drivers are in MTL2 cabs but sound crappy. ------------- Can you feel the BASS! |
Posted By: Hugo Biermann
Date Posted: 26 March 2008 at 3:29pm
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TDA uses them in WSX's.........................
------------- www.aggressiveaudio.co.za |
Posted By: adambomb
Date Posted: 26 March 2008 at 3:39pm
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I use them in X1s ------------- http://www.freespeakerplans.com" rel="nofollow - www.freespeakerplans.com |
Posted By: mylesound
Date Posted: 26 March 2008 at 3:50pm
| would it be worth it to put it in a 1850 with all that compression only feeding about 600w or would a 186 cab RCF loaded AT 1000 watts get Greater SPL? |
Posted By: Jake_Fielder
Date Posted: 26 March 2008 at 3:57pm
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He already has the drivers tho. I think the question is 1850horn or 186horn......? |
Posted By: Hugo Biermann
Date Posted: 26 March 2008 at 3:58pm
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I will rether try 186horn though
------------- www.aggressiveaudio.co.za |
Posted By: adambomb
Date Posted: 26 March 2008 at 4:49pm
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I would go with 186horn with the C18. ------------- http://www.freespeakerplans.com" rel="nofollow - www.freespeakerplans.com |
Posted By: Pozest
Date Posted: 27 March 2008 at 6:51am
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Cool thanks,guys 186horn it is.... ------------- Can you feel the BASS! |
Posted By: bmf2
Date Posted: 31 March 2008 at 7:03pm
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Regarding the xmax. Doesn't paudio measure in one direction giving a lower figure than other manufactuers. I seem to remember this being discussed before. I also am considering this driver in a 186 cabinet. I'm very interested in the results if anyone has tried it. ------------- You say it's too loud-I say your hearing is too good |
Posted By: boycey
Date Posted: 31 March 2008 at 7:52pm
xmax is always one way but seem to remember p-audio measuring in a way that gives a 25% lower figure than actual. mircea bartic can probably clear this up. ------------- the only thing more dangerous than a person who doesn't give a f**k is a person who gives a sh*t. |
bmf2 wrote:Posted By: Jake_Fielder
Date Posted: 31 March 2008 at 9:09pm
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http://www.speakerplans.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=3747&KW=xmax&PID=31584#31584 - http://www.speakerplans.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=3747
Theres loadsa other threads aswell that mention it, i know i have discussed it with Mircea.
Search!
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Posted By: Jake_Fielder
Date Posted: 31 March 2008 at 9:16pm
| http://www.speakerplans.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=14587 - Paudio Xmax - a thread i started Regarding a design of mine, but it might still be relevant |
Posted By: heinrich
Date Posted: 01 April 2008 at 2:44am
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so Jake, as Mircea states, it is "possible" to use the C18-el in the 1850 or 186 horn.......? conclusions pls...... ------------- .....power is nothing without control.... |
Posted By: Jake_Fielder
Date Posted: 01 April 2008 at 8:12am
Ha! I specifically didnt say cos i don tknow 
All i know is, dont be too scared by the low xmax on Paudio.
If anyone has the parameters for the 186 horn (I dont have time to work right now) then i'll model it and get Mircea opinion on the results if possible.
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Posted By: heinrich
Date Posted: 01 April 2008 at 9:46am
 but somehow TDA let the C18-650el drive his WSX..... ..................hoooo!!!!! it's summer here... heat hits 35deg.........!!!!!! ------------- .....power is nothing without control.... |
Posted By: streetsounds
Date Posted: 06 August 2008 at 3:10pm
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BISAG - ASA? where is this place Pards! ------------- Bass matters... |
Posted By: Silas ))))))
Date Posted: 06 August 2008 at 5:25pm
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right well i have them loaded in my 186's and they sound good. Not as lovely and drawing as the pd's but they dont half move some air.
Well chufffed
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Posted By: heinrich
Date Posted: 07 August 2008 at 5:03am
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BISAG-ASA............alaska! ------------- .....power is nothing without control.... |
Posted By: tv00
Date Posted: 16 November 2014 at 5:27pm
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whow the specs for this driver changed a lot! now its 22,76 BL & claims 1200W rms aes, but still same poor xmax ------------- www.facebook.com/babysoundsystem |
Posted By: Andy Kos
Date Posted: 17 November 2014 at 7:08am
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The Xmax on the C18-650EL is a little low... BUT P-Audio use the 'true' mathematical calculation for Xmax: ie Voice Coil Winding Height - Gap Depth _______________________________ 2 25.5 - 15 _______ 2 which gives you 5.25 mm. Another popular 18" driver has Voice Coil Height of 22, magnet gap depth of 11mm, which gives a calculated Xmax of 5.5mm, yet it's published specs are 8mm Xmax. With a strong magnet, the field will extend outside the gap, so many manufacturers use Klippel measurements to determine at what point the magnet field no longer provides linear response, which in some cases can be 2 or 3 mm bigger than the calculated Xmax. Potentially, the P-Audio could be used beyond 5mm excursion, ultimately the limiting number would be what most manufacturers would call Xlim (or Xdamage) which is the point at which excursion can cause mechanical damage due to the voice coil hitting the back plate or other similar mechanical limit. Unfortunately very few manufacturers publish this info, so it's hard to know. One thing is for sure, you cant just look at the Xmax quoted by different manufacturers and compare it directly, as there are different calculations used which can cause variations of as much as 50% for what should be the same number if they stuck to the true mathematical calculation. Ideally, everyone should publish calculated Xmax, which is mathematical, and then measured Xmax deduced by Klippel Analysis or other similar method, and stick to a standard measurement method. To some extent, Xmax is becoming misquoted in order to make drivers seem better ------------- just a guy with a warehouse and a few speakers... www.bluearan.co.uk |
Posted By: SMP
Date Posted: 17 November 2014 at 9:51am
??? Xmax = the linear region of cone movement it is not controlled by the magnet either but by the output stage of an amplifier jeez basic stuff not very well understood eh? we have some P-Audio we are field trialing in enclosures designed for 1850's seem to work quite well 2 single 18 units do very nice job for a 300 percap venue we will be ordering 16 drivers as they seem to do the job best thing is suck it n see I guess |
Posted By: Andy Kos
Date Posted: 17 November 2014 at 11:56am
Just curious - Which driver is it you are using? ------------- just a guy with a warehouse and a few speakers... www.bluearan.co.uk |
Posted By: SMP
Date Posted: 17 November 2014 at 12:09pm
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right now cannot recall but you have sent us 4 so far it is an 18 (takes a kwik look at an empty Carton) "E18-600" seem to be fairly good we were looking for a kwik load to deal with an urgent need & you are kwik of the mark for shipping. I would like to try some others too but as yet had no time to invest in further research. but all in all pretty good for a cheap driver. I am sure there are others worth trying when it gets a bit slack after new year I will have the time just not now. I am all ears to any suggestions you may have as it is one of your product lines. so feel free to make suggestions you may have |
Posted By: Mircea Bartic
Date Posted: 26 April 2016 at 1:10pm
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C18-650EL has an X-lim of 22mm / direction ------------- general manager & head designer at nexus-acoustics research http://www.facebook.com/nexus.acoustics.research" rel="nofollow - http://www.facebook.com/nexus.acoustics.research Ex Nexus_3 |
Posted By: Mark James
Date Posted: 27 April 2016 at 9:51am
is that the mk1? i thought it was more like 4mm lol  personaly id only use these in the 186 horn i will be reporting back in a couple of weeks on how they went at an actual event hopefuly well because iv nearly got 8 of the things lol ------------- me so horny me love you long throw horn loaded for her pleasure |
Posted By: Mircea Bartic
Date Posted: 27 April 2016 at 10:07am
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yes, the MK1 there were several 1850 horn built in Romania using this woofer. Most are still working today. This is still one of my favorite woofers of all time. Perfect overall combination of Tonality and performance ------------- general manager & head designer at nexus-acoustics research http://www.facebook.com/nexus.acoustics.research" rel="nofollow - http://www.facebook.com/nexus.acoustics.research Ex Nexus_3 |
Posted By: Mark James
Date Posted: 27 April 2016 at 11:21am
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wow if they survive the 1850 then il guess the 186 is a safe bet i hope ------------- me so horny me love you long throw horn loaded for her pleasure |
Posted By: DMorison
Date Posted: 27 April 2016 at 12:47pm
Bit of a horn newb here so sorry if I've got this backwards, but wouldn't a larger rear chamber allow more cone excursion, a la vented and closed boxes? If so, 1850 horn should be "safer" than 186, albeit presumably with a little less LF Extension.
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Posted By: tv00
Date Posted: 28 April 2016 at 10:18am
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I think it's more a matter about pressure (compression) than excursion if the cones break, excursion tends to make surrounds break in stead in my experience...
------------- www.facebook.com/babysoundsystem |