Spektre double 18" 'scoops'
Printed From: Speakerplans.com
Category: Plans
Forum Name: Scoops
Forum Description: One scoop or two ;-)
URL: https://forum.speakerplans.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=63235
Printed Date: 31 March 2023 at 7:07am
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 12.05 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Spektre double 18" 'scoops'
Posted By: Randall
Subject: Spektre double 18" 'scoops'
Date Posted: 11 February 2012 at 2:19am
Right, we have got 6 of these 'Spektre' scoops, And if I'm honest. We know nothing about them. I was just wondering if anyone could shed any light on them? This seemed like the most sensible place to ask I guess...   ------------- It just feels like it's never quite loud enough... |
Replies:
Posted By: PauliePaul
Date Posted: 11 February 2012 at 10:58am
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Designed and built in Birmingham for Spectre Sound System (or Spectre Media) to house two PD.1850's. Around 200 cabinets were made, 40 or so were shipped to Australia for events Spectre did out there. They were processed with EV DX38's and were driven with racks and racks of ex SSE Crest P7001's and P8001's. Mid/hi cabinets for the system (also known as 'happy dogs' or something crazy like that!) were designed by Mark at Fane (when they were in Leeds).
I used to own 41 of these (not sure where the odd one came from!); they were powered with Crown VZ3600 amps, one box per channel so each driver was seeing just under 800W. Crazy boxes, not too heavy due to the fact that they were made from 'lightweight' 18mm ply
 .Maximum we took out was eight - and that was too much, way too much! The boxes don't like VZ5000's for some reason, they would never play right with them, only the VZ3600's made them sing.
I still have two here....
Pics.... H-Town (Handsworth) Park, Birmingham. Aug 2007.
 From the front... (Mid/Hi boxes in these pics are ex SSE HB3)
 And finally.... four of them sitting under 6 stacks of EAW KF850/SB850.... That's Johnny Clark soundchecking on stage there... Luciano was on the same bill.. and Etana...
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Posted By: mykey-
Date Posted: 11 February 2012 at 11:57am
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not scoops
------------- BbbBBRAAAAPppBBBBbgushhhhhhhhssshhhhhGrAbRAAAAAAPPPPPp = Dubstep |
Posted By: bass*en*mass
Date Posted: 11 February 2012 at 12:04pm
| TML or looong reflex or double minis? |
Posted By: phildat
Date Posted: 11 February 2012 at 12:13pm
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Nicely done Paulie Paul. Can't imagine them expecting such a detailed response... ------------- Its just a ride. |
Posted By: Nitz V1505
Date Posted: 11 February 2012 at 3:03pm
Providing the sound for Mr Clarke and Luciano, that's just awesome!!!!! Hat's of to you Sir, Big up Paulie.  In a couple of pic's in this forum of Shortman's workshop I see simillar cab's in the background. Have to agree with Mykey, they are not proper scoop's but more like a hybrid. ------------- LET THE BASS ROLL LIKE THUNDER & THE TOPS LIKE LIGHTNING..... |
Posted By: Randall
Date Posted: 11 February 2012 at 3:21pm
Quite right on that one! We had originally planned on loading them with 186's, but now were not so sure. How much of a difference is it likely to make? Have you tried this Paulie? And what are they then Mikey, as I said, we have no idea so any input is welcome. It is nice to know there is a bit of history behind them. We diff want to buy another 6 but by the sounds of it we are not going to need them! ------------- It just feels like it's never quite loud enough... |
phildat wrote:Posted By: JR.junior
Date Posted: 11 February 2012 at 3:24pm
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Double transmission lines. ------------- Support the scoop technology, larger mouth plays louder! |
Posted By: Randall
Date Posted: 11 February 2012 at 4:22pm
Elaborate? ------------- It just feels like it's never quite loud enough... |
Posted By: JR.junior
Date Posted: 11 February 2012 at 5:35pm
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Here you have very small mouth oppening compared to the throat. Transmission line have the almost the same width throughout "horn"path. ------------- Support the scoop technology, larger mouth plays louder! |
Posted By: PauliePaul
Date Posted: 12 February 2012 at 10:56am
Don't get me started on the name dropping..... a few eyes would be opened!! But that was back in the days when I used to be famous.
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Posted By: PauliePaul
Date Posted: 12 February 2012 at 11:13am
Well, my take on them is that they are two miniscoops joined together, both horn paths join in the middle. If you were to cut one in half and add a couple bottom panels you would indeed have a pair of 'mini' mini scoops. I sold six of mine to a guy in Leicester you did just that, but he cut just below the baffle board on one side, the smaller half was binned and the larger half had a base board added - job done.
Regarding chamber etc, the boxes have a medium sized chamber, they have a baffle board which only extends down, say, to 60% of the chamber height. The horn path is shaped inside with corner panels etc, but from memory (I'll have to get my tape measure out) there is negative expansion. There is absolutely no bracing in the boxes at all. I can see why they have been labelled as 'double scoops' because that's what i used to call them..... but the term 'front loaded dual 18" subs" was added later as it sounded more 'rider friendly'. To reinterate, we never had to chuck crazy power at them, one channel of a VZ3600 was sufficient, and we were never asked to turn the bass up... only ever to turn it down!
As I said previously, I have two boxes here still, and four PD.1851's......
 The chamber size will work with the drivers..... hmmmmm.... |
Posted By: levyte357
Date Posted: 12 February 2012 at 11:25am
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A box with 2x PD186 is sickening to lift, even with 2x guys. So lifting cabs with 2x PD1850s, is hello Mr Hernia. ------------- "Who am I? I'm the guy who does his job.. You must be the other guy". |
Posted By: PauliePaul
Date Posted: 12 February 2012 at 11:29am
On the contrary Sir.... I used to stack these three high on my own.... made good used of fulcrums, gravity and brute force.
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Posted By: levyte357
Date Posted: 12 February 2012 at 11:33am
Problem is, if you don't have edging, and don't want to slide cabs along your nice paintwork..  ------------- "Who am I? I'm the guy who does his job.. You must be the other guy". |
Posted By: TRE4U2NV
Date Posted: 12 February 2012 at 11:35am
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gwarn paulie paul was that porsche ? ------------- IM SO SECRETIVE BUT I CANT TELL YOU WHY |
Posted By: Gee136
Date Posted: 12 February 2012 at 11:45am
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Supaclick Sound from South London run with these boxes, only problem with Supaclick, is nobody really got to hear the full potential of the boxes off their sound, because Supaclick regularly had technical issues. Respect...................  ------------- Goverment Sound (weight & treble roots machine) When Goverment ah play, infidels, ginals & masqueraders run away..... |
Posted By: mykey-
Date Posted: 12 February 2012 at 12:44pm
 seems to be guess work. I wouldn't take them out, sorry to piss on your chips Shortman wasn't behind these was he ------------- BbbBBRAAAAPppBBBBbgushhhhhhhhssshhhhhGrAbRAAAAAAPPPPPp = Dubstep |
Posted By: PauliePaul
Date Posted: 12 February 2012 at 1:14pm
No Sir, The Drum.
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Posted By: PauliePaul
Date Posted: 12 February 2012 at 1:16pm
Dude, my chips are under cover..... and these boxes actually worked.... many witnesses would testify.
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Posted By: mykey-
Date Posted: 12 February 2012 at 1:25pm
yeah worked, but did they work well
------------- BbbBBRAAAAPppBBBBbgushhhhhhhhssshhhhhGrAbRAAAAAAPPPPPp = Dubstep |
Posted By: levyte357
Date Posted: 12 February 2012 at 1:29pm
@PauliePaul, ------------- "Who am I? I'm the guy who does his job.. You must be the other guy". |
Posted By: mykey-
Date Posted: 12 February 2012 at 1:39pm
not fishing, just stating a fact
------------- BbbBBRAAAAPppBBBBbgushhhhhhhhssshhhhhGrAbRAAAAAAPPPPPp = Dubstep |
Posted By: mike03
Date Posted: 13 February 2012 at 7:54pm
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I am planing to change my bass boxes soon which is super scoop design. I love them alot cause when i strung up to play the alcohol in the bar has to be take down from the shelf . But it is time for a change because no one in Jamaica uses scoop anymore, The design they use mostly today are two drivers in one cabinet facing down not sure where that design came from because i live in jamaica and has never seen them not even on the internet. But its a waist of resources because a scoop with one good driver plays heavier than one of them ANYDAY. I love scoops and i am looking for a design even if its similar or identical to the ones that are discuss here, That make me sound like scoops and look like those double boxes that are now used in Jamaica today. I was looking at doubling two mini scoops but have not yet gotten the specs. So if anyone of you guys have the specs for the design and can share it thanks. ------------- dc |
Posted By: brokenjoe
Date Posted: 19 February 2012 at 12:08pm
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they definitely move air, both playing them and when you first lift them!! possibly the heaviest box i've ever thrown around! ------------- error 404 |
Posted By: brokenjoe
Date Posted: 19 February 2012 at 12:16pm
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what are you doing with the 2 that you have sat around paul? ------------- error 404 |
Posted By: levyte357
Date Posted: 19 February 2012 at 12:18pm
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EDIT:Person who knows the full history of the cabs "Superclick had", told me, they are 2x Wembley Blines stuck together, and original builder is Cas from South London. Possibly explains why Mykey thought they were a "Shortman" design. ------------- "Who am I? I'm the guy who does his job.. You must be the other guy". |
Posted By: brokenjoe
Date Posted: 19 February 2012 at 12:32pm
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hmmmm... controversial ! i'm with paul on this..
------------- error 404 |
Posted By: balistic_sounds
Date Posted: 19 February 2012 at 12:41pm
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i wonder how many of these you could bring to GP ------------- Don't underestimate no sound! |
Posted By: levyte357
Date Posted: 19 February 2012 at 12:49pm
Should state, person who told me, was referring to the cabs "Superclik" had. ------------- "Who am I? I'm the guy who does his job.. You must be the other guy". |
Posted By: Gee136
Date Posted: 19 February 2012 at 1:00pm
Yep correct, Cas built SupaClick double boxes & also built Saxons 24" doubles, kinder the "same" format.............................. Respect......................... ------------- Goverment Sound (weight & treble roots machine) When Goverment ah play, infidels, ginals & masqueraders run away..... |
Posted By: Wrek0ne
Date Posted: 19 February 2012 at 2:03pm
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These used to be mine. They are not transmission line, the closest thing you can liken them too is a double mini scoop because of the layout and folding of the horn but there is negative expansion all over the horn making them, as someone has already said, guess work by the looks of it. ------------- Poll this! |
Posted By: Wrek0ne
Date Posted: 19 February 2012 at 2:04pm
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Randall - Have you made up a sketch up of the internals yet?
------------- Poll this! |
Posted By: brokenjoe
Date Posted: 19 February 2012 at 3:17pm
i'll let you off then ------------- error 404 |
Posted By: taurusty
Date Posted: 19 February 2012 at 3:23pm
Posted By: PauliePaul
Date Posted: 19 February 2012 at 3:38pm
Livewire (Bigga) in Birmingham had a number of these cabs, as did Love Express, also from Birmingham (I sold him six). I sold another six brand new and un-used boxes to a further sound in Birmingham who currently have them in storage. Eight went to a geezer in Buckingham, who I then sourced another six for. Four were sold to a guy in Leicester who cut them up into minis. Twelve are still with the guys I was in business with. There were, in 2007, 100 of these boxes sat on a trailer in a transport yard in the West Midlands, all brand new and unused. I'm unsure of the whereabouts of these now. The guy who actually did the design work on these particular boxes still builds stuff in Birmingham. They date from 2003(ish).
The plot thickens.
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Posted By: PauliePaul
Date Posted: 19 February 2012 at 3:40pm
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Posted By: luton_soundman
Date Posted: 19 February 2012 at 3:45pm
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yeah i remember you tellin me moooonths back about these! ------------- Sound Hire/Sales new/used equipment. |
Posted By: levyte357
Date Posted: 19 February 2012 at 4:05pm
Phew... Got the edit in just in time.. Don't need another "mob" after me.  ------------- "Who am I? I'm the guy who does his job.. You must be the other guy". |
Posted By: taurusty
Date Posted: 19 February 2012 at 4:17pm
Mike 03:I am planing to change my bass boxes soon which is super scoop design. I love them alot cause when i strung up to play the alcohol in the bar has to be take down from the shelf  . But it is time for a change because no one in Jamaica uses scoop anymore, The design they use mostly today are two drivers in one cabinet facing down not sure where that design came from because i live in jamaica and has never seen them not even on the internet. But its a waist of resources because a scoop with one good driver plays heavier than one of them ANYDAY. I love scoops and i am looking for a design even if its similar or identical to the ones that are discuss here, That make me sound like scoops and look like those double boxes that are now used in Jamaica today. I was looking at doubling two mini scoops but have not yet gotten the specs. So if anyone of you guys have the specs for the design and can share it thanks. Apologies to the Op: Not hijacking the thread: Where in JA R U, Mike 03? R U changing boxes for the right reasons (weight, rider friendliness, etc.)? As U say the double hybrid T18 which most sound systems use cannot approach a well-made scoop, much less a super scoop. Don't follow..lead.. Was at the Sound system explosion at Stadium car Park last night & 3 of 4 sounds (Stone Love, Swatch & 1 of 4 Bass Odyssey columns) were the double hybrid. throw was non existent. Bass Oddysey was using a curious design in 3 other columns (see pics attached. appears to be some sort of front horn loading ) that sounded far deeper and louder. The line array was Renaissance (2 Way self powered tops with 8"mids by ZANN fr Miami?)      |
Posted By: levyte357
Date Posted: 19 February 2012 at 4:45pm
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@Taurusty, have started new thread for this. It needs it. ------------- "Who am I? I'm the guy who does his job.. You must be the other guy". |
Posted By: midus
Date Posted: 19 February 2012 at 8:31pm
yes paul we brought 12(painted) from bigga mainly for the drivers didn't pay much more for the cabs the reasons we got rid of them we could not get them to play better than the scoop we had. you said they never worked well on vz 5000 we where using them with vz 5000 superclick to has never sounded good with theses cabs they also use vz 5000 cas still has 6 empty cabs of ours down london
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Posted By: PauliePaul
Date Posted: 19 February 2012 at 9:06pm
Thank you.... I knew all of the above... just needed someone else to say it, and I knew you knew!!
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Posted By: TRE4U2NV
Date Posted: 19 February 2012 at 10:15pm
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was this before bigga passed im sure he had ASS Scoops and a few of someone crowns when he passed ------------- IM SO SECRETIVE BUT I CANT TELL YOU WHY |
Posted By: PauliePaul
Date Posted: 19 February 2012 at 10:19pm
Yes, back towards 2006/7-ish... He did have ASS boxes, they are all still in Birmingham (so I heard). His unit on Western Road was crazy, jammed full of boxes etc the last time I went there, loads of vintage stuff.
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Posted By: midus
Date Posted: 19 February 2012 at 10:27pm
yeah a couple of years before he passed bigga was one of those guys who loved to talk about sound my sort of guy
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Posted By: brokenjoe
Date Posted: 20 February 2012 at 7:31pm
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i'm still i war with myself about getting some of these.. my head say yes my back say no.. ------------- error 404 |
Posted By: Lee In Montreal
Date Posted: 20 February 2012 at 7:43pm
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I don't see why you guys define those speakers as "scoops"... The mouth area is even smaller than the cone area. They rather are like BR with long expanding port. looks like the sound wave from on driver is fighting the one from the other driver... |
Posted By: levyte357
Date Posted: 20 February 2012 at 7:53pm
Term scoop commonly used to refer to curved sections in rear loaded horns. However many "scoops" these days have no "scoop", but have approximated curve from 2x or more angled cuts. Does that now also make these "not" scoops ? More accurate definition of a scoop is rear loaded horn. Even though Wembley bline cabs have no scoop, or uniformly increasing horn, or horn mouth per say, they do possess "pseudo" rear horn loading. Therefore are not just reflex cabs. As these cabs are based on Wembley Blines, they are also therefore not just reflex cabs. As no reflex cab, can match the SPL, generated by a "mini scoop". In the UK, the term "mini scoop", is often used to describe sub cabinet, with some type of rear horn loading, which causes sub SPL to exceed that possible from just a reflex cab, regardless of uniform horn expansion or lack thereof. EDIT:Spoke to my "source" regarding these cabs, and he "insists", the original cabs were manufactured in South London by Cas, the result of 2x Wembley Blines being fused together. This was before 2007, then a batch being transported to Birmingham.  As Mykey stated, A similiar cab was present in Shortmans workshop at one time, as I also saw it in person. This was probably mid 2007. Will find the pics on the forum now. ------------- "Who am I? I'm the guy who does his job.. You must be the other guy". |
Posted By: levyte357
Date Posted: 20 February 2012 at 8:13pm
Seems the cabs seen in shortman workshop, were similiar but different driver orientation.
------------- "Who am I? I'm the guy who does his job.. You must be the other guy". |
Posted By: levyte357
Date Posted: 20 February 2012 at 8:16pm
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Double post ------------- "Who am I? I'm the guy who does his job.. You must be the other guy". |
Posted By: PauliePaul
Date Posted: 21 February 2012 at 12:48pm
If you've noticed I've been a bit sketchy about the details of the designer/builders/place of build/construction/machining details etc, i do know a lot more about these boxes and the people behind them, but have chose not to divulge all of the info. Work started on the project a long time before 2007... infact, years before and, as previously stated, the development/build happened in Birmingham.
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Posted By: levyte357
Date Posted: 21 February 2012 at 12:52pm
Guess, best way to clarify this, is people in the know at the bar after GP gig, over some cold brewskis. ------------- "Who am I? I'm the guy who does his job.. You must be the other guy". |
Posted By: PauliePaul
Date Posted: 21 February 2012 at 12:56pm
No problem.... I'll come with documents, pictures, invoices, the designer and the builder... what you got?
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Posted By: levyte357
Date Posted: 21 February 2012 at 12:58pm
1st round. And the South London person who was around Cas, the first time he built them. ------------- "Who am I? I'm the guy who does his job.. You must be the other guy". |
Posted By: PauliePaul
Date Posted: 21 February 2012 at 1:03pm
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Be careful you don't come with.... it would be unfortunate.... it would be unfortunate....
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Posted By: levyte357
Date Posted: 21 February 2012 at 1:06pm
Yes.. I won't be saying anything, will let my "source" dispel all of these. ------------- "Who am I? I'm the guy who does his job.. You must be the other guy". |
Posted By: PauliePaul
Date Posted: 21 February 2012 at 1:14pm
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Jokes....
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Posted By: brokenjoe
Date Posted: 21 February 2012 at 7:06pm
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jeez.. i saw these at the q club around 2001 ! and they looked old and battered back then! ------------- error 404 |
Posted By: vibez
Date Posted: 24 February 2012 at 9:37pm
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interesting reading gentlemen. i heard supaclick play with luv injection at the drum just before christmas and i'm sure he was playing some of these. he was also using vz5000 and sounded rubbish. technical problems, feedback and a whole host of other problems. @pauliepaul.....i have met up with you so many times and had no idea you were so actively involved in my scene and full of so much knowledge/history, i look forward to the convesation next time i see you. i clearly need to do some more homework on the people i deal with as i now feel rather embarrased. anyway, i must dash. i'm off to the drum again to check out qualitex at the drum with luv injection. |
Posted By: tweeter box
Date Posted: 24 February 2012 at 10:17pm
 .
------------- PRECISION SOUND SYSTEM. Feeding the peoples needs for Roots Music. Strictly premium grade reggae and dub steppers from the early 70's to present day. |
Posted By: levyte357
Date Posted: 24 February 2012 at 11:11pm
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Put up pics of those already geezer... LOL When you buying my JBL MPA1100? ------------- "Who am I? I'm the guy who does his job.. You must be the other guy". |
Posted By: tweeter box
Date Posted: 25 February 2012 at 12:31am
dont need it got a Darq ------------- PRECISION SOUND SYSTEM. Feeding the peoples needs for Roots Music. Strictly premium grade reggae and dub steppers from the early 70's to present day. |
Posted By: PauliePaul
Date Posted: 04 March 2012 at 1:11pm
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Thease cabs also work very well with the PD.1851... testing completed!!
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Posted By: brokenjoe
Date Posted: 04 March 2012 at 9:01pm
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what are your plans with them paul? ------------- error 404 |
Posted By: PauliePaul
Date Posted: 05 March 2012 at 7:32am
Still undecided....
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Posted By: brokenjoe
Date Posted: 05 March 2012 at 8:51am
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i may getting an install.. might need them.. will call when they all get in one place.. muppets.. ------------- error 404 |
Posted By: levyte357
Date Posted: 05 March 2012 at 12:54pm
Didn't see you last night mate, all of my particulars were present and in order. ------------- "Who am I? I'm the guy who does his job.. You must be the other guy". |
Posted By: PauliePaul
Date Posted: 06 March 2012 at 8:18am
I was in London, but alas, time was not on my side.....
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Posted By: brokenjoe
Date Posted: 09 March 2012 at 8:42am
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what's the weight difference with the 81s in? they were pretty darn heavy with 80s ------------- error 404 |
Posted By: RealitySound
Date Posted: 10 March 2012 at 3:02am
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Check out about 4:25 in. Same cabs? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_PwHDw_vEAE&feature=related ------------- When you gonna send me some $$ mate ? |
Posted By: brokenjoe
Date Posted: 10 March 2012 at 9:27am
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no those are g subs.. owned by storm i think ------------- error 404 |
Posted By: Wrek0ne
Date Posted: 10 March 2012 at 11:50am
Yes, they are the same. And they are from Storm. I know this because we bought these 6 off Matt just before xmas and now Randall has bought my three off of me. ------------- Poll this! |
Posted By: brokenjoe
Date Posted: 10 March 2012 at 11:54am
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haha.. i've seen those loads of times and always thought they were G subs.. i stand corrected.. ! ------------- error 404 |
Posted By: Wrek0ne
Date Posted: 10 March 2012 at 12:18pm
If Im honest with you I thought they were G-Subs too (mainly because my house mate who convinced me to buy them had told me they were) until I saw them, I then had to sell them because of there sheer size, and (hope I'm not offending anyone by saying this) but shoddy build quality and inefficient folds and negative expansion etc. ------------- Poll this! |
Posted By: Ras Loud
Date Posted: 10 March 2012 at 6:54pm
Can anyone explain in simple words what "negative expansion" actually is? |
Posted By: imageoven
Date Posted: 10 March 2012 at 9:38pm
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A horn expands - the 'passage' that the soundwave passes down starts out small near the driver and keeps getting larger until it reaches the outside of the box (known as the horn mouth). Negative expansion would be a 'passage' (or section of that passage) that gets smaller rather than bigger . Hope that makes sense? ------------- Keep pushing on, things are gonna get better. |
Posted By: RealitySound
Date Posted: 11 March 2012 at 2:07am
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http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/855/24602059.png/
------------- When you gonna send me some $$ mate ? |
Posted By: Ras Loud
Date Posted: 13 March 2012 at 9:46pm
Cool  Can you also tell me what the short BPH / BP effect stands for? |
Posted By: Danger Piglet
Date Posted: 01 July 2022 at 11:33pm
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Hi Paul, Do you have any contacts that’s got anymore of these bins for sale? Cheers 👍🏻
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Posted By: Danger Piglet
Date Posted: 09 September 2022 at 10:09am
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Hi Paul, Do you know anyone selling any of these? we have some and would like to add more to the rig!
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