Court Acoustic - Black Box System
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Topic: Court Acoustic - Black Box System
Posted By: londonavc
Subject: Court Acoustic - Black Box System
Date Posted: 30 April 2012 at 10:31am
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Hi Guys, Anyone got any pics of the Court Acoustic Black Box system although old school, I had a chance to use this system sounds fab. Was running 4 stacks I believe is stack is made up of a Top (Half box), Hi/Mid and Bass. I'm pretty sure it was the 8000 club series. |
Replies:
Posted By: samworrall
Date Posted: 02 May 2012 at 4:47pm
Just bought 2 of these myself, there huge! Haven't got a chance to get them loaded yet, can't wait to do so haha ------------- pukka |
Posted By: Tocooltom
Date Posted: 02 May 2012 at 4:57pm
| are those w bins dual RCF 15" loaded? if so a friend of mine has a pair....they are loud as fook! |
Posted By: Dub Specialist
Date Posted: 02 May 2012 at 5:05pm
Black Box system is just a huge rig man well nice tho, i used have the dual mids and even them alone are massive man sounded proppa tho...
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Posted By: samworrall
Date Posted: 02 May 2012 at 5:50pm
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the guy who had them before me had fane 15xb in them, said they were good choice of driver for them ------------- pukka |
Posted By: simonh
Date Posted: 02 May 2012 at 9:42pm
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Check out the Caister thread: http://forum.speakerplans.com/caister-soul-weekender_topic57514.html There's a Black Box system used at the bbq during the day - there are some pictures of it shown. Lovely old system, nice sound. Funny enough the Caister Soul weekender is this coming weekend, so will be listen to this system on Saturday.
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Posted By: samworrall
Date Posted: 02 May 2012 at 9:56pm
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didn't realise they did an 18" version of their w-bin, nor did I realise the design was quite so old! let us know how the system sounds on Saturday. ------------- pukka |
Posted By: TONY.A.S.S.
Date Posted: 02 May 2012 at 10:12pm
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The 18 is the original JBL cab ------------- http://www.facebook.com/tony.rossell.3" rel="nofollow - http://www.facebook.com/tony.rossell.3 |
Posted By: samworrall
Date Posted: 02 May 2012 at 10:21pm
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looks a bit more portable than the 15 inch w-bins, they weigh a ton! ------------- pukka |
Posted By: simonh
Date Posted: 02 May 2012 at 11:15pm
Will do Sam
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samworrall wrote:Posted By: shagnasty
Date Posted: 03 May 2012 at 12:12am
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Define Black Box?
main users at a pro level where JH, Scan and Eurohire, they had the proper Court Acoustic stuff and lots of it, other like "I like to play with myself" Wayne had copies with JBL Wave guides on teh top end (Better IMHO than the wooden S Court offering) but to do any damage you needed 2 Bins per Midhi and even then run 4 way never really had and sub.
With a truck pack denisty of 3K per face as Flash/Flood was hitting 8K+ per wall with about 40% higher efficiency the days of the Big Black box where numbered, that said did a gig at teh Marquee a while ago where Ralph the House guy proudly explained " that's a JBL 2" pointing at you, it's gotta hurt to work.." BIG Smile....
 |
Posted By: levyte357
Date Posted: 03 May 2012 at 2:12am
What was the perfect driver for this cab Tony? ------------- "Who am I? I'm the guy who does his job.. You must be the other guy". |
Posted By: Phil B
Date Posted: 03 May 2012 at 5:35am
Ha ha ha that`s made my day that has...I know EXACTLY who you`re on about!! .p. ------------- Mostly harmless.... except if catering is shut. Solar Sound System Shennanigans.. http://diyhifi.biz/" rel="nofollow - http://diyhifi.biz/ |
Posted By: KWB75
Date Posted: 03 May 2012 at 9:38pm
| Much of the early 90's rave scene have Court to thank for huge imposing walls of sound, certainly lots of rumble indoors! |
Posted By: jbl_man
Date Posted: 03 May 2012 at 9:44pm
I believe it was the 2240 Lev.back in the early 80's. ------------- Be seeing you. |
Posted By: giordihc
Date Posted: 03 May 2012 at 9:48pm
yes it was the 2240h |
Posted By: madboffin
Date Posted: 04 May 2012 at 11:47am
Didn't Entec run Black Boxes for a while too? And Roger Lindsay had a rigful of it in the late 70's / early 80's, probably some of the first ones made. Stephen Court made a foolish mistake when he started offering it with a choice of either JBL or Fane drivers. From then on, hirers couldn't be sure whether they would get the real version or the cheapo version. A classic case of Brand Devaluation... |
Posted By: jbl_man
Date Posted: 04 May 2012 at 12:14pm
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Yep,i have to agree with that,Fane in late 70's was a budget choice,....several other manufacturers offered a "bargain basement" Fane option in their pro. cabinets,as a cheaper alternative to JBL and Gauss,but the only english firm who could compete on a performance level back then was ATC. Things have moved on thesedays,but some of the younger readers will find it stange to think that a cabinet with a Fane Cresendo or colossus driver (or a Celestion too) back then really was regarded very much as the poor relation to the JBL/Gauss/ATC loaded cabinets. ------------- Be seeing you. |
Posted By: londonavc
Date Posted: 05 May 2012 at 2:04pm
| So can someone explain the exact spec of the stack, the one I was playing off seemed to have a half box on the top, which I assume with Hi, the second speaker which was a mid/hi and bass, I believe the bass was the dual loaded 15s. I will try to get a picture. |
Posted By: jbl_man
Date Posted: 05 May 2012 at 2:41pm
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Bass was either a 1x18 or a 2x15 W-bin.....the large mid-hi box (some were cut in half,but as far as im aware,had exactly half the components of the full box) which was,2x jbl 2202 12inch mid,and 2x jbl 2461 1" exit,on a pair of horns,and 2x 2402 bullets.
------------- Be seeing you. |
Posted By: djeddie
Date Posted: 05 May 2012 at 3:07pm
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Am I right in thinking that at the end of the eighties / beginning of the nineties Court updated the Black Box into the 8000 series? If I'm right then there was the single 18", the double 15" and the tops were the original Black box cut in half. They also changed the colour to grey. But 'Grey Box' obviously didn't have the same oomph as Black Box.
------------- Chas n Dave : it's like Drum and Bass but with beards. E=mc² ±3dB |
Posted By: csg
Date Posted: 05 May 2012 at 4:40pm
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club 8000 was slightly different in that the top box has 2 x 1" drivers manifolded onto one horn, and it also sported one bullet and one slot. the bass was the standard black box bass ( DLB800), the sub replaced the old single 18 w bin with a new twin 18 v baffle twin miniscoop, nice sub that. That sub went on to form the sub section of the first generation ramjet system, which was completely different from the current ramjet. black box tops were available in 1/2 or full size units, but only the "signature" jbl unit had the bullets. The earlier tops with the hand made wooden HF horns did not have bullets either. ------------- “The fact is this is about identifying what we do best and finding more ways of doing less of it better” |
Posted By: TONY.A.S.S.
Date Posted: 05 May 2012 at 6:38pm
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We made a load of these, when Court Acoustics was owned by Theatre Projects, and the young lad there at the time was Shaun who has worked for a few people since. Mike wilson from HH was the man in charge at the time. ------------- http://www.facebook.com/tony.rossell.3" rel="nofollow - http://www.facebook.com/tony.rossell.3 |
Posted By: londonavc
Date Posted: 05 May 2012 at 8:13pm
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Thanks for the info, I've uploaded a picture of what we used: http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/189/rigsz.jpg/" rel="nofollow">  |
Posted By: londonavc
Date Posted: 05 May 2012 at 8:16pm
| You can see the turbosound bins to the left, stacked with the hi box (half box) please correct me if I'm wrong, and the on the right what seems to be a mid hi box + bass box could be double 15s or single 18. Cabs where original court acoustic, don't ask me about the stacking or why on earth we had to use a artic as if they are not high enough from the ground already. |
Posted By: GAZ.
Date Posted: 06 May 2012 at 6:10pm
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I've DJ'd on a court blackbox rig before, That particular system wasn't working fully, various drivers were blown and needed attention. Dispite this it didnt sound too bad. It was certainly loud I seem to remember. Very big boxes, the 3 cabs stacked on top of each other either side of the stage were only a couple of inches from touching the ceiling! Thinking about it I should have some pictures somewhere, I'll have a look for them later. ------------- 100% Earth Moving Bass |
Posted By: jbl_man
Date Posted: 06 May 2012 at 6:23pm
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i had to post this,i know these Black box mid-hi's are a pain in the a*se to move,but this does seem a bit cruel! ------------- Be seeing you. |
Posted By: jbl_man
Date Posted: 06 May 2012 at 6:26pm
The half-sized mid hi's. ------------- Be seeing you. |
Posted By: londonavc
Date Posted: 06 May 2012 at 9:03pm
any chance of me having 2 jbl_man ?  So that has helped the top box is the half mid/hi box, I take it the second cab was a full mid box and the bottom box was either a 1x18 or 2x15, weighed a tonne that's all I remember lol |
Posted By: TONY.A.S.S.
Date Posted: 07 May 2012 at 9:15am
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I've been reading with interest all the posts in this thread, and it would seem that some people are confused as to what the black box system was, especially the mid hi cab. The original cab was something like a Clare Bros 2x12 mid, and the wooden horn section was similar to a pair of Mantaray Horns. The cabs in the picture above don't really bare any resemblance to the original. ------------- http://www.facebook.com/tony.rossell.3" rel="nofollow - http://www.facebook.com/tony.rossell.3 |
Posted By: jbl_man
Date Posted: 07 May 2012 at 9:22am
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Any idea what the time-line was on these Tony?..I recall Pink Floyd/Brit row using them in the early 80's...the big box you mention would be from that period im guessing..maybe 1981-82-83 ish? The ones in the photo above were owned by Percy on here (super-hero) a while back. ------------- Be seeing you. |
Posted By: csg
Date Posted: 07 May 2012 at 9:27am
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if i remember correctly, the system for pink floyd's the wall was black box. As Tony correctly states, the original top did look very different to the 1/2 size tops above, but there were plenty of the latter ones built as well. Im guessing it was a lot cheaper to use a straight walled mid horn and off the shelf high horn rather than the curved and hand made flares of the earlier boxes. ------------- “The fact is this is about identifying what we do best and finding more ways of doing less of it better” |
Posted By: TONY.A.S.S.
Date Posted: 07 May 2012 at 9:34am
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I think your time would be about right. Although we made many of the cabs, The official ones that we made were, as said previously, when Theatre Projects owned the Brand. All the cabs owned by Mick Anthony when the Town and Country club was up and running were built by us, and we also re-arranged the cabs to make side fills, so the 2x12 section was on the bottom and the horns were on the top, this was purely to give the horns the proper height as side fills. We also made quite a few of the Pro-flex cabs, I'd almost forgotten them. I think the systems that emerged from Court later, were always looked upon as cheaper versions of the original, which is probably why they never gained as much Kudos.
------------- http://www.facebook.com/tony.rossell.3" rel="nofollow - http://www.facebook.com/tony.rossell.3 |
Posted By: VSS
Date Posted: 07 May 2012 at 6:05pm
This makes me really angry
 . In my opinion , people like them ( in the clip ) should be publicly linched . I'm not jokin'. I know it's heavy equipment , used the club 8000 system for many years , stacking it on my own and would keep using it if I still had the system .
It's a part of the PA history ! Don't get it , but it's probably me .
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Posted By: SamV
Date Posted: 07 May 2012 at 6:13pm
| That must be a copy. I've seen them dropped from that height without much damage bar shifted magnets. |
Posted By: cravings
Date Posted: 07 May 2012 at 6:43pm
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comments on the youtube page are (well, quite typical of youtube comments really...) quite odd! |
Posted By: simonh
Date Posted: 09 May 2012 at 11:11am
One of the the stacks of the Caister bbq rig this year, sounded great. |
Posted By: njw
Date Posted: 09 May 2012 at 6:39pm
I would have expected a well built cab to just land, falling from that height, not smash to pieces as it does.
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Posted By: cakey87
Date Posted: 20 May 2012 at 8:51pm
| If its any use i have an original black box rig with the wooden horn flares, ill be more than happy to get some pics on tuesday for you and post them up, and they had the original jbl drivers in the tops and rcf on bass. if anyones interested let me know and ill post away |
Posted By: cakey87
Date Posted: 20 May 2012 at 8:53pm
Also i have actually droped one of mine from this high, and it was loaded and it didnt do anything like this, infact it barely even marked the cab.
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Posted By: Dub Specialist
Date Posted: 20 May 2012 at 9:12pm
these were the original Black Court mid/hi Correct ??? or not???
------------- treat all creation with respect. For music is sound...sound is vibration...vibration is energy... and energy begets life. Therein lies my passion! MUSIC IS LIFE 
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Posted By: TONY.A.S.S.
Date Posted: 20 May 2012 at 10:33pm
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Correct. ------------- http://www.facebook.com/tony.rossell.3" rel="nofollow - http://www.facebook.com/tony.rossell.3 |
Posted By: theoldsoundman
Date Posted: 31 July 2012 at 1:43pm
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The Black Box that SCAN used were copies and not very good ones either. The black box used JBL components and nothing else. The Court original Black Box had cast aluminum throats with phase correctors. Court never used fane drivers. One of Courts biggest clients who put court gear into many clubs, wanted a B range with equal performance but less cost. They used Fane drivers which matched the JBLs but were 3dB less efficient, and 20% less power handling (the fane 18XB colossus, designed by Steve Hewlett is one of the finest 18s on the market). Court only used 2 x 1" drivers because combined, they had more efficiency and power handling, better HF and lower distortion than the 2" drivers Did you know there is a new black box coming? It is apparently all singing and dancing with a new 3kw bass bin. It will be on the website at the end of next month. |
Posted By: colint
Date Posted: 31 July 2012 at 2:09pm
Mmmm, Stephen Court methinks, sure hope so be a nice addition to the forum. ------------- Never criticise another man until you've walked a mile in his shoes. Once you have, call him what you like, you're a mile away and you've got his shoes! |
Posted By: londonavc
Date Posted: 07 October 2012 at 11:28am
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How much would is cost to purchase all the original JBL drivers for the mid hi box, found some empty mid hi boxes (unloaded)? Thanks |
Posted By: penduluminsanity
Date Posted: 09 October 2012 at 5:45pm
i still have sum of this rig and it is tops use it all the time  and my court black box rig is all 18" loaded. it is a four way rig that i have got bass low-mid hi-mid and tops. this is one of the best rigs i have had old but nice ------------- psplaserworld and rigs |
Posted By: midas
Date Posted: 09 October 2012 at 6:13pm
| The sound engineer I use has a pair of the larger bass boxes. Twin 15's and sound lovely. We hiked them up into our larger room turned them on, went round the back to see if we would upset the locals. Not only could we hear it we could FEEL it....lol. Another visit from local council....Even after we had turned it down. |
Posted By: JR.junior
Date Posted: 09 October 2012 at 6:34pm
Very nice cab! ------------- Support the scoop technology, larger mouth plays louder! |
Posted By: jbl_man
Date Posted: 09 October 2012 at 8:02pm
I assume you mean with 2nd hand drivers? as the E120's aren't made anymore,so your only chance is to buy used.....i have used 2nd hand prices below. Each box will need 2x e120 at around £100 each.....and two 2425 at approx £75 each...so around £350 a box...if you need 2402 bullets,allow an extra £50 each. ------------- Be seeing you. |
Posted By: shagnasty
Date Posted: 10 October 2012 at 6:48am
2 stacks od these babies gave a 3.2Kw, took a entire face in an artic and weished near half a tonne, 290 KG of Floodlight produce about 2 -3 times the SPL, dropped lower and took 1/3 of a face in a truck pack.
Last time I was in the Marquee in Hertford they had Black box and a Pub in Milton Keynes, The Craufurd Arms runs it to great effect, just don't wanna be paying trucking on it!!!!
 |
Posted By: csg
Date Posted: 10 October 2012 at 7:47am
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In fairness, the black box design is 20 years older than floodlight, and one stack against one stack, the black box bottom end walks all over the turbo. Having owned both, proper black box ( not the later copies) will easily keep up with floodlight, and stacked properly will throw like flashlight. I agree on the weight and size though - we used to have 16 full stacks - that took half our trailer... ------------- “The fact is this is about identifying what we do best and finding more ways of doing less of it better” |
Posted By: shagnasty
Date Posted: 10 October 2012 at 8:27am
having run massive black box systems, like 32 boxes a side I wouldn't say the low end was particularly impressive, a TSW-718 would easy out run a black box low, probably keep up with 2.
I used stack the BB LO-LO-Mid/hi and run the bottom box under 90 hertz but even that config didn't give the lo-end of a Turbo dual 18, as for throw I would say some of the copies (W-Wayne's stuff with the JBL flares) out-threw the wooden ones but not to the point they could touch Flash with any clarity, yeah a pair of JBL 2"s will produce some SPL, but to get them musical was more of a challenge....
Were they really about in '75? I only really started using them in in '89 when EuroHire became my local PA company...
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Posted By: cyte
Date Posted: 23 October 2012 at 7:43pm
| I hear Black Box 2 is coming out soon... |
Posted By: colint
Date Posted: 23 October 2012 at 7:50pm
So Mr Court has already posted above. ------------- Never criticise another man until you've walked a mile in his shoes. Once you have, call him what you like, you're a mile away and you've got his shoes! |
Posted By: cyte
Date Posted: 23 October 2012 at 9:16pm
| Missed that... |
Posted By: Tocooltom
Date Posted: 24 October 2012 at 9:16am
| http://www.courtacoustics.net/ramjet.htm" rel="nofollow - http://www.courtacoustics.net/ramjet.htm |
Posted By: nuclearbass
Date Posted: 24 October 2012 at 9:49am
i was thinking this, it seems to just fall to bits "quite literally" ------------- one life - have fun! Force fusion pro audio |
Posted By: burningbush
Date Posted: 24 October 2012 at 11:55am
------------- music is the message |
Posted By: djeddie
Date Posted: 24 October 2012 at 8:23pm
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But the Ramjet system has been around for a few years already.
------------- Chas n Dave : it's like Drum and Bass but with beards. E=mc² ±3dB |
Posted By: sKitchOSB
Date Posted: 08 January 2013 at 6:02pm
| What drivers were in the mid/tops - what is the part number and make for the 12"s ? |
Posted By: lgosdset
Date Posted: 08 January 2013 at 11:09pm
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has anyone heard ramjet in action? |
Posted By: azlan
Date Posted: 21 January 2013 at 2:01am
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I believe the westy in aldershot has a ramjet system, I know its court acoustics, but not 100% on the model ------------- http://www.last.fm/user/azlan121/?chartstyle=basicrt10" rel="nofollow"> 
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Posted By: shagnasty
Date Posted: 21 January 2013 at 2:06am
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Posted By: colint
Date Posted: 15 February 2013 at 10:43pm
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Stephen's been very quiet which is a bit naughty of him but have a looky at this! it would appear Black box 2 has arrived! http://www.courtacoustics.net/blackbox2.php ------------- Never criticise another man until you've walked a mile in his shoes. Once you have, call him what you like, you're a mile away and you've got his shoes! |
Posted By: lickweed
Date Posted: 15 February 2013 at 11:48pm
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Looks good ------------- http://www.liquidsound.co.uk/ |
Posted By: colint
Date Posted: 16 February 2013 at 8:19am
Yes but that bass cabs's a bit funky at 156 kilos. ------------- Never criticise another man until you've walked a mile in his shoes. Once you have, call him what you like, you're a mile away and you've got his shoes! |
Posted By: MarjanM
Date Posted: 16 February 2013 at 12:09pm
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Oberton drivers? ------------- Marjan Milosevic MM-Acoustics www.mm-acoustics.com https://www.facebook.com/pages/MM-Acoustics/608901282527713 |
Posted By: chris_k
Date Posted: 16 February 2013 at 10:04pm
Yup used one many times. Its not rip your face off loud, its quite a clear hi-fi`ish sound. If you want thunderous-hit you in the chest bass its not the one. But for clarity and definition its spot on. Sadly majority of todays current `music` requires the above mentioned bass which this doesnt have so its not really taken off. The finish of the cabs is a bit lacking (tuffcab is more durable!) |