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QSC RMX4050HD vs Chinese

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Jack_The_Ripper View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jack_The_Ripper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 December 2018 at 3:26pm
Marjan...

Well I was wondering about a Chinese amp that has the same 'ish power, the PQM13 is a lot more powerful so isn't comparable plus I wouldn't be able to run that on a 13A socket, i'm gonna be running my RMX4050HD each off it's own dual wall socket. 

To everyone else...

Yeah you see I love my RMX4050HD it's a great amp and although it's underpowering my subs I know it's going to be ultra reliable, I had two Proline 3000 amps but only used them twice and when I read time and time again how the slightest clipping and it could rape my drivers I sold them. Plus I didn't push them hard but knew that some occasions might call for the system to be full blast, I wasn't willing to take the chance though.


Now, am I right in thinking that although some people have SAE CA18, CA20 etc..and have no problems but some have had problems? Because that would mean quality control isn't very consistant, I worry if I get Chinese SAE CA20 amps that I could get a good one, I could get one which is ok for a while then fails. Plus like has been said the clip limiters in the Chinese amps aren't great, are they a LOT lower in quality and effectiveness than QSC's RMX, PLX series etc...?


Edited by Jack_The_Ripper - 11 December 2018 at 3:34pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ArthurG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 December 2018 at 6:01pm
Regarding SAE, they went down in price quite a lot, thus their quality too. They had some great products, then they decide to update it, but it's always been for the worst... Example, the MA16004 MKI was a beast of an amp. One year later, MK2 came and all customers complained about the lower quality, reliability and performance. Stupid move, you don't change a product when it's successful...

Moreover, they lost 2 lead engineers few years ago. They replaced then but the new ones are not as good.

Finally, they became very difficult to deal with. Their business attitude is wrong (they basically sell to anybody in direct) so they lost lot of customers these last months.
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Jack_The_Ripper View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jack_The_Ripper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 December 2018 at 6:19pm
As far as i'm aware SAE don't have any distribution here in the UK, I contacted them earlier this year and they wanted a horrifically high shipping costs which pretty much doubled the price so I decided not to pay once for the amplifier and then virtually the same again for shipping. That makes their amps no way worth the price when you can get used Crest, Crown etc..for half the price. 

I'm sure I read also somewhere can't remember where that the SAE sales staff are assholes and not very nice to deal with. Anyway my original question was in the hope someone had done an A-B test between the RMX4050HD vs some Chinese amps but I guess it was a long shot. 


Edited by Jack_The_Ripper - 11 December 2018 at 7:27pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Earplug Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 December 2018 at 9:11pm
"They had some great products, then they decide to update it"

Yes, very often that is the kiss of death.  Cry


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote king david Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 December 2018 at 10:08pm
Originally posted by Jack_The_Ripper Jack_The_Ripper wrote:

People go on about how the huge transformers in Chinese amps make them brilliant for subs and that they're only really let down by their reliability.


that says it all really imo
if an amp is not reliable you don't want it


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote paulus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 December 2018 at 8:19am
one thing to look at is the big ca crest copy's , ( by sae )the mk 1s weighs in at about 41-42kg and the mark 2 is about 36kg so takes some scales , I used a mk 1 for years and years running 2x1850 drivers per channel and it was faultless with excellent clipping behaviour also , it has 26 outputs per channel :) ( 13 pairs )

Edited by paulus - 12 December 2018 at 8:19am
TRENDSETTER SOUND SYSTEM
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AM55 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 December 2018 at 8:55am
I have three of the ma series although I'm not sure if they are MK1 or mk2. The cases are a bit flimsy and the switches feel cheap but they hoof it out. I run an ohm trs218 per channel.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jack_The_Ripper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 December 2018 at 9:15am
It's a pity to be honest that SAE have become unreliable and as Marjan said in another post on here "horrible people to work with", he also said if you order one or two amps they don't care they want people ordering about 40, that shows they care only about money and couldn't care less about customers.

Are there any companies in the UK or based in the UK and USA even though manufacturing might be in China that make brilliant heavyweight amps that are great on subs? I know QSC still do the RMX4050HD and supposedly the Cerwin Vega CV5000 are good on subs, is it true that people on lower budgets STILL buy older heavyweight amplifiers and people who can afford it buy amps like Powersoft K20 etc...?

If that's the case then it does mean that people like me who can't afford anymore than about £900 absolute maximum for an amp for subs have to and probably will have to keep buying old amps for our subs while the rich enjoy new amps costing more than a top of the range 4K 65" tv.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MarjanM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 December 2018 at 10:07am
Your boxes are best not to pushed beyond 2400W per box. 
As i have said earlier, going PQM13 route is proven combo in such case.
Note that we are talking about very efficient amp design compared to the old H class amps.
So i really think you should try and get one amp and see what it does for you.


Edited by MarjanM - 12 December 2018 at 10:10am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jack_The_Ripper Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 December 2018 at 10:53am
The problem is how would it compare one side of a dual 13A 240v wall socket to two QSC RMX4050HD amps each on one side of their own dual 13A 240v sockets. In theory the RMX4050HD option would be better because with two dual wall sockets the amount of power available is about 8,280 watts if you take into account that a dual socket has a combined power output of about 18A (i've read a dual socket has a total of about 18A shared between the two sockets) so both the RMX4050HD amps would be given more powe than they'd need. The PQM13 though would only be getting 13A so 2,990 watts. 

I do on the other hand fully believe that a PQM13 would be much better given a 32A supply than two RMX4050HD given the same supply. 


Edited by Jack_The_Ripper - 12 December 2018 at 10:54am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Timebomb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 December 2018 at 11:53am
Are you talking about making a widowmaker cable with 2 13A plugs on so you can draw more from a  double socket?  Or direct wiring to a cooker outlet?  I dont follow "two dual wall sockets the amount of power available is about 8,280 watts"

18A at 230V is 4140W but how do you connect to both sockets?

The PQM13 will be considerable more efficient than the RMX4050HD, (or a similar power level 4 channel class d amp would be even more efficient ;) ) So will not have the same high current demands as a toridial class h.

You also have to consider crest factor in the signal, and the fact that drivers are not really power rated they are voltage rated.  You do not need to draw 4000W average long term to fully power 4 x 1000W drivers,  it only takes about 300W of real long term power to damage most 1000W AES rated drivers, so with a 4 channel that is around 90% efficient the average long term power requirement to power 8 drivers would be 8 x 300W +10% so around 2640W / 11.5A,  you should be ok on a 13A fuse, and that is assuming you are pushing your drivers close to the edge...

You can draw a lot more than 13 from a 13A plug for short periods, 30A for 1 second, 25A for 10 seconds, 22A for 100 seconds, 21A for 1000 seconds,  you can run quite a lot off a 13A plug if you have an efficient amplifier.

James Secker          facebook.com/soundgearuk
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Timebomb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 December 2018 at 12:04pm
BTW the 2 lines for the 13A fuse are the tolerance allowed for a BS fuse, so the actual failure point will be in the band between the 2 lines.

Also worth noting it is good practice to have headroom in the supply, so a 16A or 32A Ceeform is better, but you can do quite a lot from a 13A plug.


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James@soundgear.co.uk               www.soundgear.co.uk
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