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Restoring / Complementing old D.A.S. Audio system

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benjicube View Drop Down
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    Posted: 17 April 2022 at 7:11am
Hello all!

First post here...

And this will be a long one, because I am a colossal n00b in this area, and have taken on a project where I have to learn many things along the way! (And I fully intend to study any and every subject needed, - but I am a great fan of not re-inventing the wheel every time someone needs a new car)

I have been an amateur producer, and part time studio tech for a couple of decades!
Also worked quite a few gigs as everything from hand, engineer, organizer, DJ, VJ, and everything else.

I am also quite experienced with electronics, - but I am a software developer by trade, and have absolutely ZERO professional experience with speaker design/engineering!

I have always rented/borrowed any equipment (or delegated that part), but now it was finally time to get my own system!

It will be used almost exclusively for electronic music, - Techno, Psytrance, DnB and Breakcore!


Coincidentally, a friend of a friend had a (very) old D.A.S. audio system, that me and another friend have now inherited, and are trying to turn into a functional system!

As we are going to exclusively be using this sound system for non-profit events, we are trying to do this as cheap as we can! :)


Here is a list of what we got, what is working, and what is not;

 - 2 x D.A.S. Audio BASS-218 (With 2 x G-45 fully working, 1 x G-45 that had a small tear, and has been glued, and 1 x G-45 that needs a new voice coil, or a re-cone)

Q1: As two of the drivers are compromised, and quite hard to get as spare parts, I have been considering buying 2 x 18sound 18lw2400, and putting one 18lw and one G-45 in each cabinet.

I am unsure of how that will sound, and if there is a better solution? (or better driver replacement)

Maybe change all drivers at the same time, or ditch the cabinets and make 2 new cabinets with 1 G-45 each?


 - 2 x D.A.S. Audio Bullet-2 (With cabinets, but they suck, so I am thinking new cabs)

Q2: As I understand it, an integral horn compression unit like the Bullet-2 doesn't really need a cabinet, except for weatherproofing.
Is that completely bogus, or could I make any kind of enclosure?

Q3: I am thinking the Bullet-2's would be great for kick-bins, - but this is based on knowledge solely from google, research I don't understand completely, and math that I haven't mastered yet! :)
Any comments as to why this is either correct, stupid, or just completely wrong are welcome (and if one of the latter two; an alternative use for them)


 - 2 x D.A.S. Audio Unknown speakers, with D.A.S Audio K-1, D.A.S. Audio K-2, and K-8
(However, 1 tweeter is dead, and one K-8 Compressor Horn is missing)

Q4: Would it make any sense trying to get the parts for "remaking" these boxes (or alternative drivers), or should we just sell the spares, and buy/make new mid-highs?
And if the latter, - any suggestions on that part?


 - Also, we have 2 x Electro Voice Qrx 115/75
But one DH7 unit is dead, and one DL15X unit is dead (So I basically just assembled it into one functioning Qrx)

Q5: Would you recommend re-coning the dead DL15X (I will pay a professional to do it), or buy a new DL15X? ....or maybe two new alternative units, like the Eminence delta 15 pro?

Q6: Should I buy 1 x new original DH7, 2 x chinese knockoffs, or go all in on 2 x new DH7?

I figured we could use the EV boxes as intermittent replacements for the D.A.S. tops, until I find a another solution, - but at this point of my learning endeavour, that is pure speculation (/hope)


For now, I have a L.A.B. 68:4, 2 x L.A.B. FP2400, and two L.A.B. Lucia 240 for testing units.

I will soon get either 2 x TC XO24, - or a Lake LM 26 + either a XO24 or Behringer 2496, - so I will have either 4 or 5 way stereo speaker management, and plenty of ways to wire up this frankensystem!

ANY and EVERY comment, idea, or criticism of this load of nonsense is VERY welcome, - and I apologize for my first post being the epitome of "I have no idea what I am doing, but please answer all my questions at the same time"....!


But this whole project already threw me so deep down the rabbit whole, that after this second/third hand system is playing nice, - I am going to continue my study of psycho-acoustics and speaker design, and make speaker building my new hobby (and maybe a job some day)!
....Well, it already is. But I am starting out with a half-complete "kit" instead of from scratch :D


If you've reached this far; thank you for reading!

edit: yeah, sorry for the links :D


Edited by benjicube - 17 April 2022 at 7:39am
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Young Croc
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote FOO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 April 2022 at 7:40am
First of, you need to fix those links. They dont work Smile

Second, DAS G18 is still on the market, and concidered to be a direct replacement for G45.

I would not mix and match different drivers in the same cabinets.
You could go with completely different drivers, but some calculations would be needed. G18 Will be a good choice ready to drop in the box. 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote benjicube Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 April 2022 at 9:22am
Yeah, sorry for that!

I spent WAY to much time trying to implement links for every single unit mentioned, but it ended up like a corrupted version of a klingon dictionary.... So, I gave up on those links :P
...I will learn how it works before my next OP! :)

But thank you very much for replying!

That was definitely my original plan, but I have only been able to find a single G-18 unit on ebay (and I tried all the other 2nd hands), and it will cost me about 580 USD, including import tax and delivery to Denmark.

I tried all the D.A.S. retailers in my part of europe
, but none of them wants to sell single spare parts (And I guess it would cost a lot more if I even found one)

...so, either I buy this single, used driver unit, and never know if/when I will be able to get a new one(or when it fails, or when the glued unit cracks again), - or I spend about the same on two new drivers that are still in production, and somehow match the specs....

2 x new G-18's would be freaking awesome, but it's a bit too expensive for me at the moment :(

Maybe I should just mount one working G-45 in each cab for now, - and then save the G-8 upgrade for later, as the subs are kind of worthless without the rest of the system working
...but at least could be used at half power, - a single one of those G-45s driven 40% by a Lucia 240 made glasses and plates fall off the table, three rooms over, in a brick house!


Thank you very much for your input!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote FOO Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 April 2022 at 11:35am
Send mig en PM. Det er ikke hver dag man støder på en dansker her inde 🙂

Og her har du et link til G18 enheder Big smile
https://en.toutlehautparleur.com/speaker-das-18g-8-ohm-18-11-inch.html


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Earplug Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 April 2022 at 1:21pm
Whenever I've needed to replace drivers, I will generally take a look at what's available from P-Audio. They have a good range, decent prices - and more importantly actually really good and reliable drivers.

I especially like the neodymium range they have. Good way to lighten up your cabs!   Smile


Earplugs Are For Wimps!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote SamV Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 April 2022 at 1:34pm
I have 4x DAS Sub18 cabs, one has a blown G45, so too am looking for comparable drives. The Sub18s are extremely small cabs at 74x51x41cm!

Tbh I'm tempted to sell my 4, i can get a 5th cab too. That said I've just seen that recone kits are about £110/
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https://en.toutlehautparleur.com/speaker-das-18g-8-ohm-18-11-inch.html

Just buy a 18G. Its the replacement for your drivers Smile
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Conanski Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 April 2022 at 4:32pm
Originally posted by benjicube benjicube wrote:

- 2 x D.A.S. Audio BASS-218 (With 2 x G-45 fully working, 1 x G-45 that had a small tear, and has been glued, and 1 x G-45 that needs a new voice coil, or a re-cone)

Q1: As two of the drivers are compromised, and quite hard to get as spare parts, I have been considering buying 2 x 18sound 18lw2400, and putting one 18lw and one G-45 in each cabinet.
Never mix two different drivers in the same cab... especially sub drivers unless they are known to be a perfect electro/mechanical match. Also you cannot use a dual driver cab with only a single driver installed as that completely unloads the driver making it super easy to destroy. A small tear in the cone of a woofer is no big deal, if it has been repaired correctly the driver will suffer no loss in performance or life expenctancy. So you really only need one more functional driver, if a recone is unavailable use a G18 as other have suggested. 

Originally posted by benjicube benjicube wrote:

- 2 x D.A.S. Audio Bullet-2 (With cabinets, but they suck, so I am thinking new cabs)

Q2: As I understand it, an integral horn compression unit like the Bullet-2 doesn't really need a cabinet, except for weatherproofing. Is that completely bogus, or could I make any kind of enclosure?
A box of some type makes stacking easier but it doesn't have to be sealed.. open back is fine.

Originally posted by benjicube benjicube wrote:

Q3: I am thinking the Bullet-2's would be great for kick-bins,
That is a hugh NO, these are midrange speakers they will not do kick at all, these should likely only be used from 250hz up. 

Originally posted by benjicube benjicube wrote:

- 2 x D.A.S. Audio Unknown speakers, with D.A.S Audio K-1, D.A.S. Audio K-2, and K-8 (However, 1 tweeter is dead, and one K-8 Compressor Horn is missing)

Q4: Would it make any sense trying to get the parts for "remaking" these boxes (or alternative drivers), or should we just sell the spares, and buy/make new mid-highs?
And if the latter, - any suggestions on that part?
Keep as parts for now. The K8's look like very capable 2" exit drivers that can be used with any 2" exit horn, these are the prize here, the others not so much.


Originally posted by benjicube benjicube wrote:

 - Also, we have 2 x Electro Voice Qrx 115/75
But one DH7 unit is dead, and one DL15X unit is dead (So I basically just assembled it into one functioning Qrx)

Q5: Would you recommend re-coning the dead DL15X (I will pay a professional to do it), or buy a new DL15X? ....or maybe two new alternative units, like the Eminence delta 15 pro?
Source a DL15x recone kit or have it reconed, these are still available and not expensive. Do not buy Delta pro15s.....

Originally posted by benjicube benjicube wrote:

Q6: Should I buy 1 x new original DH7, 2 x chinese knockoffs, or go all in on 2 x new DH7?
Neither source a DH7 replacement diaphram, do not buy anything chinese... especially not compression drivers. These boxes are a lot better than you might expect and are worth repairing to original spec, get a 4th driver for the 218s and you have a simple 4 box fullrange system ready to use. Note, the QRXs will need processing, EV has black box settings in the Dx processors for them but a quick search hasn't turned up an general PEQ data. But you can roll your own, I've had really good sucess with DIY tuning of the DH2012 which is a DH7 cousin, as well as with other drivers like the B&C DE750. 




Edited by Conanski - 17 April 2022 at 4:57pm
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Originally posted by Conanski Conanski wrote:

Never mix two different drivers in the same cab... especially sub drivers unless they are known to be a perfect electro/mechanical match. Also you cannot use a dual driver cab with only a single driver installed as that completely unloads the driver making it super easy to destroy. A small tear in the cone of a woofer is no big deal, if it has been repaired correctly the driver will suffer no loss in performance or life expenctancy. So you really only need one more functional driver, if a recone is unavailable use a G18 as other have suggested.
This is all very useful knowledge, - thank you!

Originally posted by Conanski Conanski wrote:

Originally posted by benjicube benjicube wrote:

Q3: I am thinking the Bullet-2's would be great for kick-bins,
That is a hugh NO, these are midrange speakers they will not do kick at all, these should likely only be used from 250hz up.
Also very nice to know! I have definitely misread/understood something about this! :)
Will study further!

Originally posted by Conanski Conanski wrote:

Originally posted by benjicube benjicube wrote:

- 2 x D.A.S. Audio Unknown speakers, with D.A.S Audio K-1, D.A.S. Audio K-2, and K-8 (However, 1 tweeter is dead, and one K-8 Compressor Horn is missing)

Q4: Would it make any sense trying to get the parts for "remaking" these boxes (or alternative drivers), or should we just sell the spares, and buy/make new mid-highs?
And if the latter, - any suggestions on that part?
Keep as parts for now. The K8's look like very capable 2" exit drivers that can be used with any 2" exit horn, these are the prize here, the others not so much.
I think I articulated that wrong. One whole K-8 unit is missing completely. This is also making me sad, because the other one sounds pretty sweet!

With this in mind, would you bother getting the missing originals, or just skip these and go with the EV's for now?
The K-8 compressor is 300€ without the horn, and as for the K-1 and K-2 I can only find sketchy looking recone-kits.

I've never reconed anything in my life, and think I'd like to do a bit of practice first on some cheap stuff, before I'd try this...

Maybe just sell all parts?

Originally posted by Conanski Conanski wrote:

Source a DL15x recone kit or have it reconed, these are still available and not expensive. Do not buy Delta pro15s.....
Will definitely do that, - someone tried to convince me the the Delta pros were a perfect replacement, but I had my doubts...

I will find a local who can help me with the reconing, - maybe even teach me a thing or two :)

Originally posted by Conanski Conanski wrote:

Neither source a DH7 replacement diaphram, do not buy anything chinese... especially not compression drivers. These boxes are a lot better than you might expect and are worth repairing to original spec, get a 4th driver for the 218s and you have a simple 4 box fullrange system ready to use.
I am not really sure what you are suggesting here? - Source a complete unit as a replacement, instead of just the diaphragm, or...?


Anyways, thank you very much for all your great answers! :)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote benjicube Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 April 2022 at 8:39pm
Originally posted by FOO FOO wrote:

Send mig en PM. Det er ikke hver dag man støder på en dansker her inde 🙂

Og her har du et link til G18 enheder Big smile
https://en.toutlehautparleur.com/speaker-das-18g-8-ohm-18-11-inch.html


Hey! Tak for link!

Jeg ved ikke lige om jeg har stirret mig blind på skærmen, - men jeg synes simpelthen ikke jeg kan finde en PM funktion? :)


Edited by benjicube - 17 April 2022 at 8:40pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote benjicube Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 April 2022 at 9:01pm
A friend of a friend just heard that I was restoring the Qrx 115/75 system, and offered me 3 x EV sx80 in mint condition, for me doing a bit of programming for him (Like, the equivalent of about 130€).

Would those make any sense in combination with the Bass-218 and Qrx units?
Or would that just be silly?

/n00b :)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Conanski Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 April 2022 at 9:14pm
Originally posted by benjicube benjicube wrote:


Q4: I think I articulated that wrong. One whole K-8 unit is missing completely. This is also making me sad, because the other one sounds pretty sweet!

With this in mind, would you bother getting the missing originals, or just skip these and go with the EV's for now?
The K-8 compressor is 300€ without the horn, and as for the K-1 and K-2 I can only find sketchy looking recone-kits.

I've never reconed anything in my life, and think I'd like to do a bit of practice first on some cheap stuff, before I'd try this...

Maybe just sell all parts?
Compression drivers don't get reconed you just replace the diaphram which often only involves using a screwdriver so it's pretty easy to do. But yes if you're missing a K8 that makes the rest a lot less useful. I'd say sit on these bits for the moment and decide what to do after you have the subs and QRX boxes functioning, if that system doesn't deliver the sound you want then have a look at what can be done with all these compression drivers. 

Originally posted by benjicube benjicube wrote:

Will definitely do that, - someone tried to convince me the the Delta pros were a perfect replacement, but I had my doubts...
The DL15x isn't exactly a beefy driver and it puzzles me that these cabs didn't get an EVX LF driver, but it's original to this cab and there is value in that as it will retain resale value and the OEM sound character. I like Eminence drivers and have used plenty of them but I don't like the Dalta 15B and think it's the wrong choice here. If you wanted to upgrade the cabs with a more robust driver there are lots of options to consider but that would involve replacing both units which will cost a lot more. 

Originally posted by benjicube benjicube wrote:

 I am not really sure what you are suggesting here? - Source a complete unit as a replacement, instead of just the diaphragm, or...? 
No just source an authentic DH7 replacement diaphram.. not a chinese copy. There is no need to ever replace a whole driver unless it has been physically damaged or parts are simply not available. 
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