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Running turbosound tms2's with bss analogue kit

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    Posted: 11 February 2020 at 8:51pm
We've decided to run our tms2 rig using old analogue bss kit. We have some fds 360 crossovers, and an fcs 960 graphic equaliser. After having some issues with the crossovers when we initially tested them I've realised that there is quite a lot to learn about running them like this, so I'm interested in any advice people have. Also considering getting new amps to run them off as well. We have always used ecler pam series in the past, but they are old  heavy and have started failing. I know they were used with c-audio originally, also qsc and mc2.....again, interested in any advice or opinions people have. 




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 4D Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 February 2020 at 12:05am
One thing to getyour head around is fds360 run with pin3 hot on the xlr input.  

Tms2's as std ?  run the fds 2 x 2 way with 250hz card  in the fds




DMZ. "The bass was intense. Girls were literally running up to stand next to the subs"
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Trig Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 February 2020 at 10:55am
Originally posted by 4D 4D wrote:

One thing to getyour head around is fds360 run with pin3 hot on the xlr input.  

I'm up to speed with that now, that was the initial issue I was referring to. 

Tms2's as std ?  run the fds 2 x 2 way with 250hz card  in the fds

Running them over tse215 copies, so gonna use two fds running 3 way crossing at 250 and 125 



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Robbo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 February 2020 at 1:16pm
NO DON'T RUN THEM LIKE THAT---Just run all of your 15" bass drivers up to 250hz as the bass section in a TMS2 is identical to half a TSE215 bass cabinet so you will gain nothing at all from splitting xover frequencies--in fact it will be just the opposite and you will lose out on volume and performance.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Trig Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 February 2020 at 1:30pm
Originally posted by Robbo Robbo wrote:

NO DON'T RUN THEM LIKE THAT---Just run all of your 15" bass drivers up to 250hz as the bass section in a TMS2 is identical to half a TSE215 bass cabinet so you will gain nothing at all from splitting xover frequencies--in fact it will be just the opposite and you will lose out on volume and performance.

They aren't identical, the tse215s play down to 40 but the tms roll off sharply after 60, and the tse don't sound nice at all playing higher than 150. We have 6 tse under 4 tms2s, running all those 15's up to 250 would give way too much mid bass. Using a digital crossover I used to run the tms 15s down to 90 and that used to give a nice balance. Not sure how they will sound running down just to 125 though, thinking that might be a bit high to cut them 


Edited by Trig - 12 February 2020 at 1:32pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Robbo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 February 2020 at 2:05pm
The TSE215s may play down to 40hz as you are getting the coupling effect of the two 15" drivers in the same horn cavity but as I said above, if you cut a TSE215 in half then you would be left with two bass sections of a TMS2 and also all of your cabinets contain the same 15" drivers so there is absolutely no point in splitting bass two way with identical drivers and the same horn loading.
I know all of the old Turbosound designs from many years of personal experience working with them and what you are attempting to do is pointless---Just as a matter of interest, what subs are you using below all of your 15" bass section as it seems that you are attempting to force the TSE215s into reproducing sub bass which they will never achieve.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Trig Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 February 2020 at 3:55pm
The ones turbo built might be identical but the copies we have are slightly deeper than the tms. They have different drivers in as well. Six tse215 in a pile play pretty low, never measured them but we don't use any subs under them. Always been happy with them, we don't play much music that needs loads of deep sub anyway, no dub or reggae just a bit of jungle and old breakbeat hardcore, we mostly play techno 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cravings Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 February 2020 at 4:07pm
are they definitely tse215 copies? if they look like these then they're copies of older boxes, tb215. and a bit different to the tms2 bass section. but robbo's advice stands.. i wouldn't expect them to play down to 40hz. and yes they won't sound nice above 150.

i have 6 of these boxes for well over 10 years now.. i'd definitely recommend subs under them.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Trig Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 February 2020 at 4:13pm
Could be, I'll have to get the tape measure out when I get home. I'd love to add a load of dedicated subs under them but I don't have the finances or the space, and as we will likely only use them a few times a year for little parties (most of us are in our 40's now and don't have the time or energy to get the rig out every weekend!) it's not really an option. Not sure about exact frequency range but they definitely play lower than the tms can 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Trig Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 February 2020 at 8:38pm
Originally posted by cravings cravings wrote:

are they definitely tse215 copies? if they look like these then they're copies of older boxes, tb215. and a bit different to the tms2 bass section. but robbo's advice stands.. i wouldn't expect them to play down to 40hz. and yes they won't sound nice above 150.

i have 6 of these boxes for well over 10 years now.. i'd definitely recommend subs under them.

What subs do you run under them ? 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cravings Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 February 2020 at 12:04am
X1s
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 4D Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 February 2020 at 11:53am
Originally posted by cravings cravings wrote:

X1s

Heretic... :) 

back to the 15"   @250hz the trick is not to overdrive the box too much power and the honk honk honk gets exaggerated 


Edited by 4D - 13 February 2020 at 11:53am
DMZ. "The bass was intense. Girls were literally running up to stand next to the subs"
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