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Saturn 16 - 4 x 4200W - Discussion

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote concept-10 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 February 2019 at 7:19pm
Originally posted by MarjanM MarjanM wrote:

Originally posted by levyte357- levyte357- wrote:

Topology already stated by seller.

Original question also requested power dissipation and manufacturer, but have lost interest now.

Why would the seller disclose all that info to you? Can you get an answer to those questions from Labruppen or Powersoft? 
Marian, your statement totally misses the point, Lab and Powersoft don't need to give these specs, they are trusted brands with massive history so are trusted not only for their quality of build and components used but also their customer after care and back up, these Chinese amps being sold in the UK have none of the above proven history so are an unknown quantity, I would certainly want to know more than just some stated specs, this is in no way ment to be detrimental to Time bomb he is doing excellent work but more info on components used would be a good start at getting some confidence in this product.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MarjanM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 February 2019 at 12:04am
Sorry but this always sounds to me like the million questions i get all the time and they are pretty much the same. Which driver you use in that box? And which 12 inch driver? 
Jesus, are you buying a loudspeaker box or components? 
These amps might not be a Powersoft, but they also cost a fraction of the Powersoft cost.
For that cost, they are what they are.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote suiluj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 February 2019 at 9:09am
Originally posted by levyte357- levyte357- wrote:

Which amp is this?

Taken almost 5 years ago wayback 2014. Older PSU same as Lab G power supply. 
Timebomb said that the PSU has been updated. 
I am not sure if the amplifier module is also updated. 
The old version has a total of 8 devices per channel. See pic below. 



2 channels stick together






Edited by suiluj - 25 February 2019 at 9:11am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote levyte357- Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 February 2019 at 9:48am
Originally posted by suiluj suiluj wrote:

Originally posted by levyte357- levyte357- wrote:

Which amp is this?

Taken almost 5 years ago wayback 2014. Older PSU same as Lab G power supply. 
Timebomb said that the PSU has been updated. 
I am not sure if the amplifier module is also updated. 
The old version has a total of 8 devices per channel. See pic below.


Thanks.

What make/model where the devices?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote levyte357- Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 February 2019 at 9:52am
Originally posted by MarjanM MarjanM wrote:

For that cost, they are what they are.


And what exactly is that?

If you have no idea what the O/P Devices are, and how many there are per channel?

Or are you just suggesting buy it, and if it blows up in use, or doesn't provide what's needed, just sell it on for a loss ?

Some buyers, are a little more discerning.

As I said, Many Chinese distributors have no problem at all providing tech specs to those who ask, before a penny is spent.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Timebomb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 February 2019 at 9:55am
Originally posted by MarjanM MarjanM wrote:

Sorry but this always sounds to me like the million questions i get all the time and they are pretty much the same. Which driver you use in that box? And which 12 inch driver? 
Jesus, are you buying a loudspeaker box or components? 
These amps might not be a Powersoft, but they also cost a fraction of the Powersoft cost.
For that cost, they are what they are.

I feel you Marjan,  i have the same issue, some people seem to think all manufactures do is throw a load of components in boxs, rather than carefully test and evaluate components too find what is optimal in a given application.  People tend to have lot of bias towards one component manufacturer over another, often because they have liked a product that had that manufacturers components in,  so therefor wrongly assume that said manufacturers components are better for everything in all designs and applications, it is simply not the case.  I have customers tell me i should use x/y/z brand of drivers over what i have tested and concluded to me optimum, just because they think that brand X is "better",  it is much more about individual components and applications than brands... but people often dont get it...

Regarding manufacturers of Lab G copys/clones in China giving out component lists and schematics, yes there are many that will do this as there are 100s of factory's making these clones and the circuits are all 90-95% the same anyway, they have no real intellectual property to protect, It is different when the amplifiers you are referring to are not copys/clones, as those 100s of factorys are waiting to copy the next thing, but as it was asked the Saturn 16 output stages use 4 x IRFP4768 MOSFETs, all components are from reputable manufacturers and are well suited to there applications.

My issue with this is that it is a public forum where people will often make spurious comments about the suitability of components, design choices, performance claims etc without really understanding what they are talking about, and having no direct experience of the component / design / application involved, so consequently they are spreading miss information, weather it be deliberate or accidental, and this does directly impact on manufacturers reputation and sales, which is a shame.  There will always be a grey area between opinion and fact, i will publish more measurements of the Saturn series soon so hopefully that will make things clearer for people :)

Cheers.

James        


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Timebomb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 February 2019 at 9:58am
Those modules pictured are an older version of a lower powered model, the Saturn 16 modules are a similar layout.  The 4200W module is much more recent and did not exist 5 years ago.   
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote suiluj Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 February 2019 at 10:51am
Originally posted by levyte357- levyte357- wrote:

Originally posted by suiluj suiluj wrote:

Originally posted by levyte357- levyte357- wrote:

Which amp is this?

Taken almost 5 years ago wayback 2014. Older PSU same as Lab G power supply. 
Timebomb said that the PSU has been updated. 
I am not sure if the amplifier module is also updated. 
The old version has a total of 8 devices per channel. See pic below.


Thanks.

What make/model where the devices?


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote toastyghost Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 February 2019 at 10:57am
Considering many of the self proclaimed experts here don’t appear to understand or bother to look at the impedance curve of their boxes at low and high current use, nor respect the relationship that voltage, current and impedance has, I think it’s a given that the vast majority of comments on limiters, amps, power, and even frequency response of a given box are taken with a large pinch of salt unless they’re accompanied by verifiable measurements.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote redngold77 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 March 2019 at 8:09pm
Originally posted by Timebomb Timebomb wrote:

Originally posted by MarjanM MarjanM wrote:

Sorry but this always sounds to me like the million questions i get all the time and they are pretty much the same. Which driver you use in that box? And which 12 inch driver? 
Jesus, are you buying a loudspeaker box or components? 
These amps might not be a Powersoft, but they also cost a fraction of the Powersoft cost.
For that cost, they are what they are.

I feel you Marjan,  i have the same issue, some people seem to think all manufactures do is throw a load of components in boxs, rather than carefully test and evaluate components too find what is optimal in a given application.  People tend to have lot of bias towards one component manufacturer over another, often because they have liked a product that had that manufacturers components in,  so therefor wrongly assume that said manufacturers components are better for everything in all designs and applications, it is simply not the case.  I have customers tell me i should use x/y/z brand of drivers over what i have tested and concluded to me optimum, just because they think that brand X is "better",  it is much more about individual components and applications than brands... but people often dont get it...

Regarding manufacturers of Lab G copys/clones in China giving out component lists and schematics, yes there are many that will do this as there are 100s of factory's making these clones and the circuits are all 90-95% the same anyway, they have no real intellectual property to protect, It is different when the amplifiers you are referring to are not copys/clones, as those 100s of factorys are waiting to copy the next thing, but as it was asked the Saturn 16 output stages use 4 x IRFP4768 MOSFETs, all components are from reputable manufacturers and are well suited to there applications.

My issue with this is that it is a public forum where people will often make spurious comments about the suitability of components, design choices, performance claims etc without really understanding what they are talking about, and having no direct experience of the component / design / application involved, so consequently they are spreading miss information, weather it be deliberate or accidental, and this does directly impact on manufacturers reputation and sales, which is a shame.  There will always be a grey area between opinion and fact, i will publish more measurements of the Saturn series soon so hopefully that will make things clearer for people :)

Cheers.

James        



Looking forward to seeing some measurements :)

Did you do any long-term testing of the amps before taking them on? If so, can you give us any details? power output/duration/impedance
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Timebomb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 March 2019 at 10:21pm
Will update with new measurements hopefully in the next couple of weeks :)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Chris Grimshaw Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 March 2019 at 9:35am
Originally posted by Timebomb Timebomb wrote:

Will update with new measurements hopefully in the next couple of weeks :)


Watching with interest. I mostly do live bands where they'll want 4-8 monitor mixes. Couple of these would be great, and the DSP would be the icing on the cake.
Interested to see about the DSP capabilities, too. A little more grunt for the subs would be nice.

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