Simple HR question |
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MattStolton
Old Croc Joined: 04 September 2010 Location: Walthamstow Status: Offline Points: 4234 |
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Posted: 05 April 2013 at 11:29am |
When calculating L12 length, where do you measure L1 from, middle of dust cap? Playing with Martinssons Tham15, so middle of cone gives one L12, but there is 7.5" of driver either side of this. Is this why "measured" varies from HR quite often for the better, as there are multiple horn lengths? For long horns, I presume this effect is lessened, but on short horns, you have significant multiple lengths? Effectively, for a TH, you have multiple 1/4 wave lengths of horn path, which means you even out the predicted humps in response, from just one horn length? I.e if you consider slices of cone perpendicular to L12, at centre of dust cap L12 , there is a 15" wide strip of cone surface acting. As you move to each end of the cone L12 +7.5" or L12 -7.5", there is less cone strip/area acting, but at a possibly significant different L12? |
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Matt Stolton - Technical Director (!!!) - Wilding Sound Ltd
"Sparkius metiretur vestra" - "Meter Your Mains" |
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BP1Fanatic
Registered User Joined: 02 August 2009 Location: Columbus, Ohio Status: Offline Points: 105 |
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Regarding a 3 segment Tapped Horn, L12 = the begining of the horn to the middle of the dustcap.
L23 = the middle of the dustcap to the middle of the magnet.
L34 = the middle of the magnet to the end of the horn.
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mobiele eenheid
Old Croc Joined: 15 August 2004 Location: Netherlands Status: Offline Points: 1568 |
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The effect of different path lengths is relative to the wavelengths involved. Most tapped horns are <125 Hz whereas the effect is mostly noticeable about 1 octave higher (in the 200 - 400 Hz + area).
Best regards Johan
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TENSiON
Registered User Joined: 02 September 2012 Status: Offline Points: 279 |
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Roughly the equivalent of
Might be a bit off though - it's late and brain refuses to fully cooperate Edit: After giving it a second thought, the path difference in case of tapped horns is actually 2 cone diameters as the wavefront originating from the extreme far end of the back side of the cone has to cross the cone 2 times to arrive at the extreme far end on the front side. So the boundary conditions for the calculation are: HR path length (S2) ± effective cone diameter. However... If the transducer was square, this would account for a 1/3rd octave smoothing effect, but as the cone is circular and the bulk of its Sd is concentrated around the centerline, it has to be accounted for when evaluating the effective path differences and how it affects the final results. Based on this I would estimate that the final real world result is somewhere in the ballpark of 1/4th to 1/6th octave smoothing (for the specific case of THAM-15). Edited by TENSiON - 01 May 2013 at 3:01pm |
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MattStolton
Old Croc Joined: 04 September 2010 Location: Walthamstow Status: Offline Points: 4234 |
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I was wondering if it would have a significant effect. On Martinsson's blog, and from my fiddling on HR, you get quite a peaky output, but his measured response is pretty flat, and I am trying to work out what effect is causing this difference? Also along the lengths of L2-L3, do these lengths of individual "pipe", i.e each length between corners/bends "resonate" or do they out of band, say 200Hz plus, or not significantly at all. It has just been bugging me that the Tham15 HR is good, but a little peaky, whereas measured is much more favourable, with the troughs between peaks appearing filled, not peaks lowered. If I can work out what improves outside of HR, to flatten response, I may be able to apply this to other TH projects. |
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Matt Stolton - Technical Director (!!!) - Wilding Sound Ltd
"Sparkius metiretur vestra" - "Meter Your Mains" |
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TENSiON
Registered User Joined: 02 September 2012 Status: Offline Points: 279 |
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Yes, it can have a quite signifficant impact - especially in the case of tapped horns, because as I wrote in my previous post - when you take the longest pathway from the inner to the outer side of the cone, the wavefront has to cross the full diameter of the cone TWO times till it gets to the mouth termination point.
So the "smoothing" effect is about twice as strong in case of TH's than it is for classic FLH's. The difference is even greater if the FLH is perpendiculary slot loaded relative to the horn path (which minimises cone diameter related path length differences). Another non-negligible thing that adds to the final "smoothing" effect even further, is the back-reflection from the beginning of the first TH segment, which - depending on ratio between the first two segment lengths - can also be a signifficant contributor. While response smoothing in general is usually considered a "good thing", it has to be noted that at some point it becomes rather counter-productive, because as the pathlength "bandwidth" raises, the resulting sound becomes more and more muddy due to overswamped impulse response.
However, if not considered in the design process, it can easily become a peak/dip slaughterfest as you move up into the real of higher (midbass, etc.) frequencies.. |
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