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Spray On Acoustic Treatment?

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brokenjoe View Drop Down
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    Posted: 12 May 2017 at 8:46am
Does anyone know of a spray on / or a way of treating something to help with room acoustics?


other than serge drapes / but along those lines




i want to treat a ceiling without lowering the height of the venue


Edited by brokenjoe - 12 May 2017 at 8:48am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bob4 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 May 2017 at 10:04am
Some type of porous expanding foam might work, but you would need loafs of it. With acoistics there is no free lunch, you always have to apply a layer of absorbant material with a thickness of 1/4 wavelength. For example to damp above 1 kHz, you need at least 6 cm of material, for 500 hz and up 12 cm, etc.....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kevinmcdonough Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 May 2017 at 10:58am
hey

depends on what frequencies your looking at, but unfortunately there's no cheating the laws of physics.

If its just higher frequencies you're looking at, then just some carpet tiles/thin foam/material on the roof will make a big difference. 

However as you go lower and lower, you need thicker and more dense materials to absorb the frequencies properly. 

The only exception might be if it's a particular frequency or narrow band of frequencies you're looking at, a standing wave or whatever. A Helmholtz resonator of some kind may help in that case, and depending on the design they can still be fairly thin and not lower the ceiling too much. 

K
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote brokenjoe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 May 2017 at 6:07pm
Originally posted by kevinmcdonough kevinmcdonough wrote:

hey

depends on what frequencies your looking at, but unfortunately there's no cheating the laws of physics.

If its just higher frequencies you're looking at, then just some carpet tiles/thin foam/material on the roof will make a big difference. 

However as you go lower and lower, you need thicker and more dense materials to absorb the frequencies properly. 

The only exception might be if it's a particular frequency or narrow band of frequencies you're looking at, a standing wave or whatever. A Helmholtz resonator of some kind may help in that case, and depending on the design they can still be fairly thin and not lower the ceiling too much. 

K


It's mainly Hf / MF, just to deaden the room really, the bass end is ok

i'd say 1000khz upwards 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote _djk_ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 May 2017 at 9:00pm
Flame-proof spray-on cellulose insulation does a good job.

I heard the results in a large metal building, it made a large difference (even though it was done for heat-loss reasons, not sound).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ceharden Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 May 2017 at 12:08am
When I helped refit a music venue last year, I found some spare carpet tiles and glued them to the wall behind the mix position.  They're not thick but I think it does make a noticeable difference.

What is the ceiling currently?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote brokenjoe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2017 at 4:48pm
the ceiling is typical warehouse ceiling / semi lowered / fibre boards 

sticking carpet tiles is gonna be pretty laborious, it 26m x 20m .. the roof also goes up to an apex at 2 points, so the ceiling area is bigger than that too !


i've seen some buildings with a bobbly textured ceiling, but no idea what the stuff is called.. looks like expanding foam, but not as expanded! 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote odc04r Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2017 at 5:04pm
Spray on insulation stuff?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MPASOUND Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2017 at 5:51pm
Originally posted by odc04r odc04r wrote:

Spray on insulation stuff?

That's what I was thinking. Something like this maybe?  

It's just bits of paper flapping about in a box..
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ceharden Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2017 at 7:22pm
Are they standard loose tiles?  If so, you can replace them with ones which have greater sound adsorption, they come in all kinds of different types.  You could also do two layers of them potentially.

Pictures would help.

The other option is that you don't necessarily need to cover the whole area.  If you made up some frames with serge or felt stretched across them and some fibreglass/polyester behind (bearing in mind fire regs), then hang them a few inches below the ceiling in various places that might help.  Think Royal Albert Hall!
 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kedwardsleisure Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2017 at 7:31pm
I've seen spray-on stuff used on a youtube video from a company erecting portable metal buildings, it's a sort of giant flock that insulates the building, looks like a cross between expanding foam and a feather pillow and is applied with a lance and mobile compressor. Whatever you use, make sure it isn't going to rain down toxic fireballs if there's a fire. H&S can get very sniffy about that sort of thing.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote kevinmcdonough Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2017 at 8:26pm
hey

Yeah I don't know if I'd go with spray on stuff, seems like a lot of hassle.  I'd think that all the time cocooning the room in dust sheets and polythene, and then all the clean up of the over spray after, would be much more work that was actually worth it?

If it's only general hf absorption you want, I'd just go with foam tiles. You don't need to go with super high quality, extra dense audio specific tiles, aim more for quantity than quality. Even just approach a foam manufacturer and try and buy in bulk straight from them rather than an audio or acoustic specific company. 

Long as it's open cell foam, and fire retardant/safe, then just buy a huge pile of it and no nails it to the roof, job done. No need for masses of cover up before or clean up after, like there would be with spray stuff.

K


Edited by kevinmcdonough - 16 May 2017 at 8:26pm
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