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Turbosound restore project

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RoadRunnersDust View Drop Down
Young Croc
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RoadRunnersDust Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 September 2016 at 7:19pm
TSW-721 are the ideal bins to put under TMS in my opinion, the 24s are just TOO big, heavy and fragile and I've not heard any other bins that can keep up with Turbo cabs and maintain the brutal, punching transient ethos.

If you really want to approach Mecca then 5-way active with TSW-718s in between the 21s and the TMS makes for a great system.


As for the TMS-4, it's arguably the sweetest sounding box Turbosound ever made. The 18, 10 and 1 join seamlessly if you have them set up correctly and the 18 has all the punch of the 215 section of the TMS-3 whilst bringing a fullness to the party that the 215 doesn't quite manage.
It's only real faults are that the flying system for rigging them was nowhere near as slick as the TMS-3 and that by today's standards, it's too heavy, big and quiet.

Another thing to be aware of is that if you go for the TMS-3 (TSE-215+TSE-211) then you ideally want boxes that use the V2 device on the HF as the 2" offerings in the TMS-3 sound about as harsh as you'd expect of a 2'' being asked to run that high
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tv00 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tv00 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 September 2016 at 7:48pm
I don't thing any 18s in between 21s & 15s is needed, they have a big overlap.
In between 15"(or 18") & 10" it's more needed if you ask me, the weak point of turbo has always been the freqs between the folded horn and the straight horn, turbo at 200hz has never been the best.

I don't agree that the tms-4 is better than the tms-3 and I think only few would agree, 2x15s & 2x10" do by far outperform an 18" with a single 10", still a good box though.

By the way I have tms-4s & 3s & tse-211s & tsw-721s if u wanna listen:-)
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RoadRunnersDust View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RoadRunnersDust Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 September 2016 at 10:24pm
And once you stop loading your boxes with the wrong drivers and claiming them to still be TMS-x or TSE-x people might ask your opinion on the sound of the boxes Wink
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote leif.joson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 September 2016 at 7:13am
Originally posted by RoadRunnersDust RoadRunnersDust wrote:

And once you stop loading your boxes with the wrong drivers and claiming them to still be TMS-x or TSE-x people might ask your opinion on the sound of the boxes Wink


I am far from a Turbosound expert and their is much i want to learn. Therefore I ask things to persons that might know.

In general.
Ones knowledge is not equal to others interest in ones opinion.

Modefying, cloning, faking, pimping, styling, adjusting, fixing, inspired by is how we all do.
I hare no intention to fool nobody that what I did was original. I
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leif.joson View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote leif.joson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 September 2016 at 7:19am
Originally posted by RoadRunnersDust RoadRunnersDust wrote:

And once you stop loading your boxes with the wrong drivers and claiming them to still be TMS-x or TSE-x people might ask your opinion on the sound of the boxes Wink


I still understand your point just not how you express it.
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cravings View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cravings Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 September 2016 at 8:21am
he's talking to TV00 there.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote tv00 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 September 2016 at 8:36am
Originally posted by RoadRunnersDust RoadRunnersDust wrote:

And once you stop loading your boxes with the wrong drivers and claiming them to still be TMS-x or TSE-x people might ask your opinion on the sound of the boxes Wink


What a stupid idea!

Of course I tried this, I have plenty of original drivers in stock, why would I fit them when it's sounds worse?
That's why I can tell you they sound better with the "WRONG" drivers, I did plenty of A/B, by ear, measurement & even simulation (prior to testing).

Please also call these people and tell them that they're idiots:
http://www.formidableaudio.com/

Furthermore there's no single thing suchs as "original loaded" the sound can be completely different, I have the two oldest tms-2s in the world, they have old fane drivers with smaller top-plates behind and older beyma drivers, no doubt that they don't sound as clean as the newer PD loaded which don't sound as clean as the ones I've loaded.

Development never stop, and using your brain isn't prohibited.
If you don't want to call them "turbo" I don't care.
If I was to sell them I'd load the original drivers & keep the good stuff:-)

Lots of people just do what they're told; "only use turbo drivers", -"yes sir", "kick out foreigners", "yes sir". It's not about the badge, it's about what's inside. I prefer to use my senses and my brain, not just listen to authorities.

Reminds me: I'm every so often embarrassed to be an European white-man prick.
Soon I'm not allowed to call myself "white" anymore as I'm black inside :-)
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leif.joson View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote leif.joson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 September 2016 at 10:28am
Originally posted by cravings cravings wrote:

he's talking to TV00 there.


Hmm ok. The same is still true.
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tv00 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tv00 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 September 2016 at 10:59am
Originally posted by leif.joson leif.joson wrote:

Originally posted by cravings cravings wrote:

he's talking to TV00 there.


Hmm ok. The same is still true.


NO this is a LIE, he knows nothing about my life!
I have the original drivers and I've heard them lots of times, so this is entirely NOT TRUE!

Why don't you want the best sound? -I do, and so does my customers.
I have the original drivers ready to swap in if anyone buys them, but why would I fit them?

So you two think formidable audio are also doing WRONG when upgrading the Flashlight?


Edited by tv00 - 27 September 2016 at 11:00am
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leif.joson View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote leif.joson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 September 2016 at 11:14am
Originally posted by tv00 tv00 wrote:

Originally posted by leif.joson leif.joson wrote:

Originally posted by cravings cravings wrote:

he's talking to TV00 there.


Hmm ok. The same is still true.


NO this is a LIE, he knows nothing about my life!
I have the original drivers and I've heard them lots of times, so this is entirely NOT TRUE!

Why don't you want the best sound? -I do, and so does my customers.
I have the original drivers ready to swap in if anyone buys them, but why would I fit them?

So you two think formidable audio are also doing WRONG when upgrading the Flashlight?



I think we are talking about the same thing. Trying new things and doing what others say is impossible is how progress is made. What we cal the things might be up for talk but we a Volvo is still called a Volvo when the motor is optimized or the looks changed. The same with computers, and all other stuff I can think of.
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RoadRunnersDust View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote RoadRunnersDust Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 September 2016 at 11:59am
Sorry Leif, that was aimed entirely at TV00. His apoplectic defence of his modification is a reoccurring theme on the forum.

Put me face to face with Formidable and I will quite happily call them idiots.
The kind of idiots that put a long-throw stadium system into a tiny club and managed to, unsurprisingly, lose coherence anywhere but the dance floor whilst the line-arrays that the system should have pissed all over ate it for breakfast.

The kind of idiots that just blew a large pile of money on a stadium system with no stadium to run it in and no tours to tour it on.

The kind of idiots that spunked a pile of money on refurbishing amplifiers that are too big and heavy to be acceptable in the market they're punting at and have subsequently had to replace them.

The kind of idiots that last I heard were in some deep financial poo.

They are not the messiah, they're some very silly boys.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tv00 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 September 2016 at 12:20pm
There's no "original drivers" for this, turbosound used a series of different drivers, just like funktion one does these days, so u have to keep up to keep them upgraded.

Actually an "original" box will sound terible, as the passive xover HAVE to be updated according to Tony Andrews handwritings (attached) in order for it to sound proper, this raises high/mid xover.


First boxes had weak fane drivers, later ones stronger fane drivers, then the pd's cam, two generations of those too, this accounts for both 10" & 15", first beyma drivers doesn't sound that good the cp-350s are better (they have a turbobadge on the back of course:-)
Yet a driver like bms 4540nd sounds much sweeter and lighter for my taste, i bypassed the filter and cross actively at 4 khz, you're welcome to A/B with an original:-)

The tms-4s & tms-3s had a wide range of drivers installed also, first ones were Fane, looks much like the 15b, whereas the tms-2 driver was lighter, the later tms-3s can come with both ls-1506 & 1507 which are very different drivers! Some of the missing numbers must be: ls-1501, 1502, 1505, I've seen 1504 & 1503 (fane)

Electrovoice and JBL were used for tms-4s & tms-3s in US.

Having "original" laoded cabs are no guarantee that they sound the same or even sound good, you have to listen, open, look, test...
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